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A Deeply Fractured US

The law has also changed in those 6 years. Mr. Trump himself is the one who made it a felony to mishandle classified documents. If anything he should know best the consequences of those actions as he is the one who approved them.
 
The law has also changed in those 6 years. Mr. Trump himself is the one who made it a felony to mishandle classified documents. If anything he should know best the consequences of those actions as he is the one who approved them.
Let's see if he's indicted and if so what the court determines.... You speak as though he is already guilty.
 
Media covered Clinton’s email fiasco quite extensively. She paid for that and her actions at the polls.

The issue seems to be that the Trump crowd is truly obsessed with Hillary's emails from 6 years ago, and Hunter Biden's laptop, no matter how much coverage it gets. That's the go-to defence for pretty much anything Trump does, even if we agree that Hillary's emails were mishandled they think Trump is so awesome he should just get a free pass no matter what he does because "Hillary's emails".

I would love to see a court martial where a CAF member tries to use the excuse "But Hillary's emails" while being charged for leaking some Protected B documents. It would be awesome and hilarious, and apparently possible since clearly some members of the organization seem to think this an actual way to bring the heat off a security violation.
 
The issue seems to be that the Trump crowd is truly obsessed with Hillary's emails from 6 years ago, and Hunter Biden's laptop, no matter how much coverage it gets. That's the go-to defence for pretty much anything Trump does, even if we agree that Hillary's emails were mishandled they think Trump is so awesome he should just get a free pass no matter what he does because "Hillary's emails".

I would love to see a court martial where a CAF member tries to use the excuse "But Hillary's emails" while being charged for leaking some Protected B documents. It would be awesome and hilarious, and apparently possible since clearly some members of the organization seem to think this an actual way to bring the heat off a security violation.
And the point continues to soar a mile over your head. You really can't see the system is being gamed for and against particular people, can you?
 
And the point continues to soar a mile over your head. You really can't see the system is being gamed for and against particular people, can you?

Just so we're clear here you're saying "the system" that allowed Trump to beat Hillary in the 2016 election and become president is actually "gamed" against Trump? That's a conspiracy, and one that makes very little sense.

Sidenote: Who created "the system" that made it a felony to mishandled classified documents? You should look into that.
 
Let's see if he's indicted and if so what the court determines.... You speak as though he is already guilty.

Can you show us where Eaglelord17 said Trump is "already guilty" or is that just something you decided to say instead of actually addressing his post?
 
Just so we're clear here you're saying "the system" that allowed Trump to beat Hillary in the 2016 election and become president is actually "gamed" against Trump? That's a conspiracy, and one that makes very little sense.

Sidenote: Who created "the system" that made it a felony to mishandled classified documents? You should look into that.
This post makes no sense. Aren't we talking about how the FBI/DOJ have been handling Clinton, Biden, Trump? The electoral system is another discussion altogether.

I suppose you're one of those who think Trump made it a felony to mishandle classified documents and then deliberately went out of his way to personally commit that felony.
 
This post makes no sense. Aren't we talking about how the FBI/DOJ have been handling Clinton, Biden, Trump? The electoral system is another discussion altogether.

I suppose you're one of those who think Trump made it a felony to mishandle classified documents and then deliberately went out of his way to personally commit that felony.

Please clarify for us as I asked, and may be confused, what "system" is being "gamed" against Trump. Is this about in comparison to Hillary's emails again?
 
HRC, no shit she did a bunch of criminal things, but two wrongs don't make a right.

True.

No-one can go back in time and collect Hillary's scalp (prosecute and convict). No-one can go back in time and shut down the investigations that continued past the point at which investigators and people up to and including the president (Obama) knew they were working with flawed evidence (or none at all). No-one can go back in time and re-do the 2020 election with wall-to-wall coverage of the contents of Hunter Biden's laptop.

So, collect Trump's scalp (and maybe some other ones) now. Re-set the standard. There will be some anger expressed due to the chain of history I just described, but Trump is egregious enough that I doubt it will be the civil war or insurrection some people like to play up.

Soon enough, another prominent Democrat will be in legal jeopardy. Whatever Democrats choose to do now is going to box them in more tightly than they already are.
 
Update on the state of play in the Mar-A-Lago search:

Trump filed a civil lawsuit last week in Florida seeking the appointment of a “special master” to go over all the recovered documents to protect any potential privilege claim, and requested the investigators not be allowed to continue examining documents til that’s done. This appears to have backfired; last night DOJ filed it’s reply to the motion, and it’s a doozy. This has allowed them to expound on what led to the search. It could not disclose much specific criminal evidence (this is civil, not criminal, and is before a different judge than the search warrant), but it’s also not redacted. A few highlights:


- Investigators have already gone through all the documents and a small amount of potentially attorney/client privileged documents were set aside by a filter team prior to examination. A separate risk assessment is also being done.

- FBI counterintelligence investigators had to get read in to additional security clearance levels (I assume SCI/SAP as they were going through the documents recovered in the spring’

- After the subpoena for classified documents in the spring, Trump’s team certified that a diligent search had been done, and that all responsive records brought from the White House had been located in the storage room. At this time, although investigators were shown the Mar-A-Lago storage room, they were not permitted to look in the boxes still there.

- Investigators then got new info that documents had been moved, concealed, and retained. They cite multiple sources of information for the investigation. It was after this that a warrant was sought.

- The warrant founds classified records not just in the boxes in the storage room, but also in Trump’s office, both boxes as well as a few loosely in his desk. This is where his passports came from; they were located with classified docs and seized as evidence. (My note- personal documents, notes, etc would absolutely be potential evidence of personal knowledge/possession and would be legitimately seized.) A redacted photo from the search shows at least 5 folders marked up to TS//SCI and others at Secret//SCI in his office.

- The search warrant allowed the search and seizure of all containers containing classified records, plus any containers stored with them, hence the seizure of other personal items and documents. See my note above re: passports.

- The search warrant recovered more classified documents than had been turned over in response to the subpoena and the certified ‘diligent search’ that his lawyer signed off on. I.e., when served with a subpoena, less than half the classified materials present at Mar-A-Lago were turned over.

My personal opinions based on the assumption that they can prove in court what they filed last night:

  • Someone is SUPER fucked for the big picture here. I don’t know who that is. Someone will be going to jail.
  • Trump’s lawyer who signed off on the subpoena response is gonna go through some things. Signing that declaration it not something I would personally have chosen to stake a law license on.
  • Trump himself is likely exposed to at least some amount of personal legal (criminal) jeopardy at this point.
  • Investigstors believe they have a clear case for obstruction. Not clear if they have any specific individual dead to rights, but this clearly goes beyond accident or oversight.
  • Someone currently or recently inside team Trump is snitching. Probably more than one person. Likely that investigators by now have solid leverage to flip others.

All that aside, I suspect the court in Florida will also find that it doesn’t have jurisdiction to hear this civil claim, and/or it’ll deny the relief sought because it’s not founded in law and is moot due to how long they waited.

Trump’s counsel have until 8 pm tonight to file a response, which will immediately be publicly available.
 
Someone might be….
There was a really good thread on Twitter last night by a former Fed Prosecutor who went through the issues 1 by 1.
I was trying to post but around 0200 this morning the site would not load for me and I can’t find the thread anymore (still looking)

1) Trump’s legal team never claimed executive privilege for any of the classified documents. Which if they had been declassified would have been easy to do.

2) Classified documents where found in several different locations at the residence,
Not secured in any shape or form.

3) President Biden is apparently going to address the nation on Thursday- expectations are this will be dealing with this and the assumption that 45 will have been arrested.

4) Anyone I know who was once a Trump guy (I was too at a point) now is shaking their head wondering WTF is wrong with him.


Similar link
 
Trump’s lawyer who signed off on the subpoena response is gonna go through some things. Signing that declaration it not something I would personally have chosen to stake a law license on.
I have a hard time understanding how some lawyers in the US willy nilly put themselves into these positions. Lawyers are supposed to be legal advisors. Once you start testifying in affidavits and signing documents like this on behalf of clients you become a witness (and possibly a defendant) and no longer an advisor.

🍻
 
I have a hard time understanding how some lawyers in the US willy nilly put themselves into these positions. Lawyers are supposed to be legal advisors. Once you start testifying in affidavits and signing documents like this on behalf of clients you become a witness (and possibly a defendant) and no longer an advisor.

🍻
Indeed. I’ll be interested to see if there is any flux in who Trump’s counsel are on various legal matters. At least one and potentially more are now quite likely implicated in possible crimes.

This filing last night is just more and more devastating the more analysis it gets from people who really know their stuff. And all of the real nitty gritty ‘how we got this info’ is still under seal in the criminal case.

Trump’s response is due by 8:00 pm. I’ll be curious to see what claims his counsel are willing to assert and sign their names to… And who said counsel are.

Perennial reminder that none of the three charges on the search warrant even pertain to classified information. There are additional criminal offences potentially in play including obstructing a grand jury subpoena, and mishandling of classified information. I’m realizing just how carefully and conservatively the offences on the search warrant were selected and articulated. I’d love to know what’s under the redactions regarding obstruction and the moving/concealing of documents.
 
The RNC has now refused to fund Trumps legal issues on this.

Hopefully it brings Republicans together without DJT, but I’m probably too optimistic
 
The RNC has now refused to fund Trumps legal issues on this.

Hopefully it brings Republicans together without DJT, but I’m probably too optimistic
The RNC shouldn’t fund it. He’s a billionaire isn’t he?
 

How can anyone take the FBI seriously at this point.
 
The RNC shouldn’t fund it. He’s a billionaire isn’t he?
I guess they have a standing rule to fund a GOP POTUS’ legal fees for a bunch of issues that could stem from his presidency. This is a signal that they will only go so far.
 
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