Author Topic: LAV 6.0  (Read 90708 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Spencer100

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • 7,370
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 305

Offline Spencer100

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • 7,370
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 305
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #201 on: August 23, 2017, 12:20:38 »
Also an older piece,  Canada is looking at older Stryker hulls. 

https://www.defensenews.com/land/2016/12/08/peru-wants-us-army-stryker-infantry-carrier-vehicles/


Offline Loachman

  • Former Army Pilot in Drag
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 206,392
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 7,208
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #202 on: August 23, 2017, 15:21:21 »
I am not sure why we would look at old US hulls, when we have/had a pile of our own older ones around. The LAV 6 hulls are all brand-new production, as that was the cheapest solution. The USMC had their old hulls completely stripped down, the bottoms cut off, and new ones welded on - much more work and much more expense.

Offline Colin P

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 118,025
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 8,519
  • Civilian
    • http://www.pacific.ccg-gcc.gc.ca
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #203 on: August 23, 2017, 17:31:11 »
Likely:

"We have money to modify the fleet totally from the ground up"

"Why don't we buy new ones?"

"There is no budget for new ones"

"But the costs are the same or close?"

"There is no budget for new ones"


Offline Thucydides

  • Army.ca Legend
  • *****
  • 189,185
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 13,474
  • Freespeecher
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #204 on: August 23, 2017, 20:40:21 »
Most likely some sort of procurement magic, money could be spent so long as it was for "upgrades", not new equipment. If the Marines were able to get an extended production run, they may have been able to get new and very different hulls, but still naming them LAV 25 (LAV 25B?), much like the F/A-18 Superhornet is essentially an entirely new airplane compared to the F-18.

A bit of an out of the box suggestion, since the US Army is using Strykers, other countries are considering them and the USMC has a demonstrated need for a newer vehicle, maybe we could put together some sort of consortium and have a very long production run of Strykers for Canada and all the other customers done at once. Economies of scale, low unit costs, extended employment in London and other benefits would apply. If necessary, we could build "green" hulls and let the final customers add radios, electronics and their own turrets or RWS, and still get something like 80% of the benefit.
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.

Offline Loachman

  • Former Army Pilot in Drag
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 206,392
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 7,208
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #205 on: August 23, 2017, 21:42:55 »
Ours were billed as upgrades, but in reality very little of the original vehicles survived into the "upgraded" ones. The USMC could have done the same thing, and saved money.

GD was producing LAVs for us, USMC, Kuwait, and possibly others in several variants during the 4 RCR tour a few years ago. Business looked good, and the Saudi deal (for which I have mixed feelings) will probably have them running at capacity for a while.

Offline Underway

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • 16,680
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 750
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #206 on: January 02, 2018, 19:11:11 »
Found this accidentally.  Found it extremely interesting regarding how the US refirbishes their M1 tank.  I expect the LAV 3 went through a similar process to upgrade them and rebuild them.

Part 1 Ultimate Factories - M1

Part 2 Ultimate Factories - M1

Offline .Fred

  • Guest
  • *
  • 40
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 10
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #207 on: June 15, 2018, 20:13:08 »
Wainwright has a rail line on/near the base.

http://www.army-armee.forces.gc.ca/assets/ARMY_Internet/images/news-nouvelles/2017/05/17-0146-pa01-2017-0146-012.jpg
United States Army M1A2 Abrams Main Battle Tanks prepare to be offloaded from a train at Canadian Forces Base/Area Support Unit Wainwright, Alberta during Exercise MAPLE RESOLVE on May 11, 2017.


It depends on the 'carrier' as to where they bring their cars.  We unloaded to the South of Base around the town of Hughenden.
I was reading through the thread and stumbled on this post. Wainwright rail line is operational, we've just shipped out a bunch of lav6/msvs on them

Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


Offline Spencer100

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • 7,370
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 305
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #208 on: July 10, 2018, 10:23:28 »
Well here is where the LAV go to die in London ON.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/london-ontario-lav-1.4734920


I like how the gov calls the LAV 3 to LAV 6.0 an "upgrade" when it really looks like a total new build.  I guess it is easier to get it though the buying process calling it an Upgrade.

Offline Chris Pook

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Legend
  • *
  • 193,545
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 12,159
  • Wha daur say Mass in ma lug!
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #209 on: July 10, 2018, 12:25:48 »
I wonder if they couldn't be stored in armouries - you know - as displays for the regimental museums.   
"Wyrd bið ful aræd"

Offline Remius

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 82,995
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 2,795
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #210 on: July 10, 2018, 12:37:30 »
I wonder if they couldn't be stored in armouries - you know - as displays for the regimental museums.

Some of those museums are pretty small...

Pretty sure no reserve unit ever had those to begin with so what would be the link?.

Wasn't there some sort of movement years ago to have them as monument all over the country?


 
Optio

Offline CountDC

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 27,425
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1,498
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #211 on: July 10, 2018, 13:49:31 »
Well here is where the LAV go to die in London ON.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/london-ontario-lav-1.4734920


I like how the gov calls the LAV 3 to LAV 6.0 an "upgrade" when it really looks like a total new build.  I guess it is easier to get it though the buying process calling it an Upgrade.

Calling it an upgrade probably does make it easier as it is now maintenance vice a purchase.  Same kind of thing happened years ago at a certain base wanting new shacks.  No money to build new with but lots for maintenance and repairs.  Solution was to tear down everything but the main corner beams and rebuild on them - maintenance and repair.
"When the power of love, overcomes the love of power....the world will know peace" - Jimi Hendrix [1942-1970]

Offline dapaterson

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 412,420
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 15,693
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #212 on: July 10, 2018, 13:56:45 »
I wonder if they couldn't be stored in armouries - you know - as displays for the regimental museums.

Some are being converted to monuments.
This posting made in accordance with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, section 2(b):
Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms: freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/charter/1.html

Offline Chris Pook

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Legend
  • *
  • 193,545
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 12,159
  • Wha daur say Mass in ma lug!
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #213 on: July 10, 2018, 15:05:07 »
Some of those museums are pretty small...

Pretty sure no reserve unit ever had those to begin with so what would be the link?.

Wasn't there some sort of movement years ago to have them as monument all over the country?

Perhaps they could be stored on the parade squares - four to the armoury? 
"Wyrd bið ful aræd"

Offline Loachman

  • Former Army Pilot in Drag
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 206,392
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 7,208
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #214 on: July 10, 2018, 17:29:08 »
I had a tour of the General Dynamics factory in late 2013 or 2014.

It is a fascinating place.

Our LAV 6 are truly new vehicles. Very little survives from the old ones. It is much cheaper than doing what the US Marines were having done there at the same time - completely stripping their old LAV 25s, having the lower hulls cut off, and having new double-V hulls built and welded on.

There were stacks of cut armour pieces, ready to be welded together, half-hulls welded up and looking like giant plastic model kit pieces on longitudinally-rotatable jigs, and all sorts of interesting sights. Armour piece edges were precisely cut so that they naturally fitted together at the correct angles. Some brilliant work was being done. Many employees, especially on the management side, were ex-CF, including a few 4 RCR buds. The company takes its work seriously, partially due to that. R&D is constantly ongoing, based upon a lot of feedback from operators in many countries and some of the concepts being investigated were quite novel and ingenious.

LAV variants for other countries were also being built or upgraded. One was a turreted mortar variant, painted desert sand (I cannot remember the customer nation).

There is a LAV monument at Bowmanville, Ontario, on the north side of Highway 401. It is well-presented, but looks odd without all of the usual stuff tacked/tied on. That's the only one that I've seen.

Offline whiskey601

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 23,265
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,558
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #215 on: July 13, 2018, 21:01:16 »
There are LAV monuments popping up in a lot of places, find one near you! :  https://www.lavmonument.ca/en/index.html

Offline Colin P

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 118,025
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 8,519
  • Civilian
    • http://www.pacific.ccg-gcc.gc.ca
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #216 on: July 13, 2018, 21:20:57 »

Offline whiskey601

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 23,265
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,558
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #217 on: July 14, 2018, 09:32:38 »
There are LAV monuments popping up in a lot of places, find one near you! :  https://www.lavmonument.ca/en/index.html

Quoting my own post here. As far as I can tell, the cost to obtain and install a LAV monument is about 30,000, plus transportation costs. Does anyone know if that is close to correct? Reason I am asking is that are several young men from the area I grew up who was KIA in Afghanistan. It wouldn’t take long to fundraisers for a monument and there is lots of room for one.

Offline Loachman

  • Former Army Pilot in Drag
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 206,392
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 7,208
Re: LAV 6.0
« Reply #218 on: July 14, 2018, 14:38:44 »
Look on the FAQ page on the link that you posted.