Author Topic: New RCAF Command Badge?  (Read 6232 times)

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Offline Dimsum

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2017, 19:37:29 »
I'll go one better. Let's focus on getting the RCAF the hardware they need to do their jobs first. Then, if there's money left over that can be used for uniforms and accoutrements, let's design a RCAF uniform that is uniquely Canadian, or at least somewhat based on British-pattern RAF uniforms instead of having the current uniform which, save for lapels, is essentially a copy of a late 1940s-early 1950s USAF pattern?

Why do we always need to ape our American cousins, anyway? Do we do it to show them that we are their allies?

I'm not sure where you're going with this.  As GW said, the RCAF DEU doesn't look like the American one at all, and even the 1940s/1950s USAF uniform itself looks really similar to the RAF one without a belt and the ranks being on shoulders instead of the sleeves.  As for our current DEU, with the colour changes and such, the only big differences between us and the RAF are the belt (we don't have one) and the bottom pockets - even the wings have (or are shortly) going back to silver instead of gold. 

I'm also not sure where you get that our military has to copy the American one.  We definitely have some commonality because of NORAD, NATO, etc procedures and standards, but it's not like we've become "US military lite" - we're just as, if not more, similar to the Aussies, Brits, and other Commonwealth nations.
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Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2017, 19:56:37 »
Especially now that the Elliot's eyes have been restored to the Royal Canadian Navy.  ;D

Offline Dimsum

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2017, 20:33:19 »
Especially now that the Elliot's eyes have been restored to the Royal Canadian Navy.  ;D

<tangent>

Now you just need Officers' 8-button tunics, JRs' Square Rig and the old rank insignia back.  :stirpot:

Judging from Change of Command pictures, senior officers of both genders wearing high-collar whites is pretty much an "unofficially official" thing now.

</tangent>
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2017, 06:05:28 »
Well before we invest in more bling...how about we invest in uniforms that look like uniforms and not business suits with badges...with the exception of the RCN DEU, maybe, that is what we have.

Jon

Screw that.  Bring the bling!  We don't need that operational stuff in the RCAF.  Gimme another badge dammit!   ^-^
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Offline Ditch

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #29 on: August 28, 2017, 13:35:26 »
CANAIRGEN 19/17:

SUBJ: RCAF DEU COMMAND BADGE

REF: CAF DRESS INSTRUCTIONS, A-DH-265-000/AG-001

1. THE ROYAL CANADIAN AIR FORCE WILL INTRODUCE THE RCAF DEU COMMAND BADGE (NSN 8455-20-010-3760) TO COINCIDE WITH THE UPCOMING CONSECRATION OF THE RCAF COLOURS 1 SEPTEMBER 2017.

2. THIS ACCOUTREMENT WILL BE WORN BY ALL PERS EMPLOYED UNDER THE RCAF COMMAND IAW THE REF EFFECTIVE 1 SEPTEMBER 2017.

3. SIC ITUR AD ASTRA, SUCH IS THE PATHWAY TO THE STARS.
Per Ardua Ad Astra

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #30 on: August 28, 2017, 14:45:21 »
That certainly makes sense.  Glad to see this is the official direction.
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Offline Old EO Tech

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #31 on: August 28, 2017, 19:23:16 »
Screw that.  Bring the bling!  We don't need that operational stuff in the RCAF.  Gimme another badge dammit!   ^-^

I'm not even talking about operational uniforms....though I could open of a tangent here to talk about the Army(not to mention the RCAF) wearing CADPAT as work dress :-/

I'm all for a little bling....I mean we are the least "blingy" of any of our allies.  But I just want a DEU uniform that I don't have to be embarrassed about when I visit my Brit and US friends :-/

Jon

Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #32 on: August 28, 2017, 19:27:20 »
Pic of it on a DEU (not mine)



It was nice of them to create something with a lovely, very gold eagle when everything else was recently changed to silver. Perhaps it's just the photo, but it doesn't appear to blend well...
"Stop worrying about getting back to who you were before it all went wrong. To heal is to understand that the person you've since become is the one who's most capable of doing whatever it is you were put here to do."~SR

Offline Dimsum

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #33 on: August 28, 2017, 19:32:30 »
CANAIRGEN 19/17:

3. SIC ITUR AD ASTRA, SUCH IS THE PATHWAY TO THE STARS.

Well there you have it - buttons and bows is the pathway to the stars.   >:D

It was nice of them to create something with a lovely, very gold eagle when everything else was recently changed to silver. Perhaps it's just the photo, but it doesn't appear to blend well...

The capbadge hasn't changed, so the eagle is still gold.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 19:35:27 by Dimsum »
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #34 on: August 28, 2017, 19:40:07 »
The capbadge hasn't changed, so the eagle is still gold.

Ah yea, good point. Banking on when they'll decide to alter one or the other... >:D
"Stop worrying about getting back to who you were before it all went wrong. To heal is to understand that the person you've since become is the one who's most capable of doing whatever it is you were put here to do."~SR

Offline Quirky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #35 on: August 29, 2017, 11:21:56 »
Out of all the stupid crap we do, this has to be at the top. I'm so glad our leadership has nothing more to concern themselves with that they can brainstorm these stupid blue hockey pucks to be worn on our bus driver uniforms. Fix PLD? Nah that's too hard. Sort out the boot issue? Screw that, I'm going to the golf course. Introduce a new command badge? Yes we must address this at once!.  ::)

Offline bigzoomie

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #36 on: August 29, 2017, 16:35:28 »
It was nice of them to create something with a lovely, very gold eagle when everything else was recently changed to silver. Perhaps it's just the photo, but it doesn't appear to blend well...

The birds on the RAF, RAAF and RNZAF badges are all gold so the RCAF having a gold eagle maintains tradition. Our silver (pearl grey?) ranks and wing colours are similar as well. The silver buttons and new command badge are a rough combo (don't know why didn't stick with fake brass buttons).

Here's hoping they leave the RCAF badge and hat badges alone. That said, ON TO THE FORAGE CAPS!!!   ;D
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #37 on: August 29, 2017, 17:46:13 »
The birds on the RAF, RAAF and RNZAF badges are all gold so the RCAF having a gold eagle maintains tradition. Our silver (pearl grey?) ranks and wing colours are similar as well. The silver buttons and new command badge are a rough combo (don't know why didn't stick with fake brass buttons).

Here's hoping they leave the RCAF badge and hat badges alone. That said, ON TO THE FORAGE CAPS for Officers!!!   ;D

FTFY  ;)
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Offline Dimsum

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #38 on: August 30, 2017, 01:02:10 »
Somewhat related - a friend of mine is supposed to be on the big RCAF Colour Party thing in Toronto in Sept and some of the CAF social media pics have them practicing.  The officers are wearing the old school blue and gold sword belts (not the plastic white ones). 

If we're going full steam ahead (behind?) on this whole tradition thing, I wouldn't be surprised if forage caps are next...although as someone who wore them the last trade, they aren't comfortable.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline MCG

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #39 on: August 30, 2017, 02:11:49 »
The birds on the RAF, RAAF and RNZAF badges are all gold so the RCAF having a gold eagle maintains tradition.
But, Canadian tradition should not be decided by what other Commonwealth nations are doing if Canada never had any such similarity in its own history.  Did the RCAF previously have a device with a gold eagle?  Maybe that is argument to call it "tradition."  Maybe it is not tradition?  Maybe it is just another expenditure of effort in the ongoing tribal rebranding by the CF Sneetches.

...

Why do we always need to ape our American cousins, anyway? Do we do it to show them that we are their allies?
...

I'm also not sure where you get that our military has to copy the American one.
Through the many iterations of the CF fashion transformation, there has been a false dichotomy, argued by proponents of the changes, where anything that did not "ape the British" was accused to "ape the US."  If you did not support restoration of long retired British symbols, then clearly you wanted to burry the Canadian military identity under that of the US. The argument is, of course, false.  However, there may have been a reader or two who read the discussions and did not realize where a hyperbole or straw-man was being tossed out to support the false dichotomy.  I do recall a handful of individuals declaring all CF uniforms to be copied American patterns.

I assume Eland was fooled by the myth.  Both he and you espouse my position: if we must tinker with buttons, badges, and other fashion, then I would prefer we look to neither the US nor UK as a template.  All our inspiration should come from within our own borders.

Offline kev994

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #40 on: August 30, 2017, 06:18:31 »
Lumberjack outfits for everyone!

Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #41 on: August 30, 2017, 12:47:05 »
. . .  Did the RCAF previously have a device with a gold eagle?  Maybe that is argument to call it "tradition."  Maybe it is not tradition?   . . .

With regard to this particular badge and the "golden chicken", while tradition likely resulted in the selection of that tincture for the animal in the device, the device is essentially the central element of the Royal Canadian Air Force Badge as granted in letters patent from the Canadian Heraldic Authority which is blazoned as "Bleu Celeste an eagle volant affronté the head to the sinister Or" (translation - a golden eagle flying facing front with its head turned to the left on a sky blue field).  The command badges worn on pockets are all the central element of the badges approved for those commands by the heraldic authority.   And yes, the bird on RCAF badges (pre-unification) has always been gold coloured (or brass)
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Offline bigzoomie

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #42 on: August 30, 2017, 13:17:41 »
Somewhat related - a friend of mine is supposed to be on the big RCAF Colour Party thing in Toronto in Sept and some of the CAF social media pics have them practicing.  The officers are wearing the old school blue and gold sword belts (not the plastic white ones). 

If we're going full steam ahead (behind?) on this whole tradition thing, I wouldn't be surprised if forage caps are next...although as someone who wore them the last trade, they aren't comfortable.

Sounds like they've resurrected part (or all) of the pre-68 RCAF ceremonial dress. Buttons and bows debate aside, the fancy belt and boards (with or without sword) was a simple way of snazzing up the officer uniform for those extra-special moments.
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #43 on: August 30, 2017, 16:13:09 »
Somewhat related - a friend of mine is supposed to be on the big RCAF Colour Party thing in Toronto in Sept and some of the CAF social media pics have them practicing.  The officers are wearing the old school blue and gold sword belts (not the plastic white ones). 

If we're going full steam ahead (behind?) on this whole tradition thing, I wouldn't be surprised if forage caps are next...although as someone who wore them the last trade, they aren't comfortable.

I haven't worn one since '89 and I never want to again.  I'll take the head-wallet any day over that.
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #44 on: August 30, 2017, 16:40:34 »
Did the RCAF previously have a device with a gold eagle?  Maybe that is argument to call it "tradition."  Maybe it is not tradition?  Maybe it is just another expenditure of effort in the ongoing tribal rebranding by the CF Sneetches.

I know MAG (Maritime Air Group) wore this in yester-year from *I am not sure when* until my father retired in '81.

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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #45 on: August 30, 2017, 18:29:33 »
I know MAG (Maritime Air Group) wore this in yester-year from *I am not sure when* until my father retired in '81.




Chicken in a basket.  Worn as the command badge for Air Command from 1975 until they stopped wearing command badges sometime after we went to DEUs.  I wore it 86-87 when I was posted to CFB Edmonton.  Just as the new RCAF command badge is the central portion of the RCAF badge so was this the central portion of the Air Command badge (originally authorized by letters patent in 1975) which was later registered with the Heraldic Authority as the RCAF badge in 2011.
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Offline WeatherdoG

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #46 on: September 01, 2017, 01:51:47 »
I haven't worn one since '89 and I never want to again.  I'll take the head-wallet any day over that.

I hate pointless hats, so the wedge and beret bother me greatly. If the hat isn't warm or provide shade for the eyes get rid of it. Make a new comfortable peak cap, or switch to fancy ball caps, but we need to get rid of stupid pointless hats for the sake of having a stupid hat.

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New RCAF Command Badge?
« Reply #47 on: September 01, 2017, 08:13:49 »
switch to fancy ball caps

NOW  you're talking!!  I hate this can't wear my sqn ballcap from the car to the breezeway crap.  It's a freakin hat. 

Don't get rid of the wedge, it fits nicely in my left leg pocket, its unique from forage caps and berets.  Personally, I always thought there was a nice difference between (in DEU) the RCN folks with forage caps, the army in beret and the air force with the wedge.

And, zoomies wearing wedges actually goes back to *the beginnings of the RCAF* historically.  My grandfather on Dad's side (who was also Air Force before and after unification) was in the Royal Flying Corps in WWI (survived a crash, too);  his wedge is in the pic attached.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2017, 08:18:19 by Eye In The Sky »
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