Author Topic: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????  (Read 64033 times)

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Online SeaKingTacco

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #800 on: October 22, 2020, 18:01:31 »
We will see how the Liberals and their NDP puppy respond to the next assault.

https://www.nationalobserver.com/2020/10/22/news/second-confidence-showdown-liberal-minority-could-be-way

Yeah, I mean the absolute temerity of the Official Opposition to, you know, oppose.

There ought to be a law against questioning a Liberal Government....<sarcasm, in case everyone wasn’t already clear>

Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #801 on: November 21, 2020, 11:35:07 »
MP Yasmin Ratansi denies claims of abusive, inappropriate behaviour in social media post
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/mp-yasmin-ratansi-denies-claims-of-abusive-inappropriate-behaviour-in-social-media-post/ar-BB1bdzu1?li=AAggNb9



MP Yasmin Ratansi secretly employed her sister in her office contrary to the rules. She allegedly told employees to call her sister by another name and told them to hide the fact they were related. Her sister would hide from cameras and physically hide in the office when members of the public would come in the office as to not recognize her.

MP Yasmin Ratansi is now accused of creating a toxic and verbally abusive work environment.  Members of the office were also apparently ordered to ignore the immigration files and family reunification files for some South Asian constituents' because she felt they were "untrustworthy" or they "lied" because of their ethnicity. (that's not racist at all)




Family members getting special treatment.
Employees being told and expected to 'get onboard' and be complicit with unethical behavior.
Toxic work place with a side order of verbal abuse.

Now that doesn't sound like the Liberal Party one bit.
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Offline Brihard

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #802 on: November 21, 2020, 11:56:51 »
MP Yasmin Ratansi denies claims of abusive, inappropriate behaviour in social media post
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/mp-yasmin-ratansi-denies-claims-of-abusive-inappropriate-behaviour-in-social-media-post/ar-BB1bdzu1?li=AAggNb9



MP Yasmin Ratansi secretly employed her sister in her office contrary to the rules. She allegedly told employees to call her sister by another name and told them to hide the fact they were related. Her sister would hide from cameras and physically hide in the office when members of the public would come in the office as to not recognize her.

MP Yasmin Ratansi is now accused of creating a toxic and verbally abusive work environment.  Members of the office were also apparently ordered to ignore the immigration files and family reunification files for some South Asian constituents' because she felt they were "untrustworthy" or they "lied" because of their ethnicity. (that's not racist at all)




Family members getting special treatment.
Employees being told and expected to 'get onboard' and be complicit with unethical behavior.
Toxic work place with a side order of verbal abuse.

Now that doesn't sound like the Liberal Party one bit.

FWIW, she got turfed from caucus back on the 9th and now sits as an independent.
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Offline dapaterson

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #803 on: November 21, 2020, 12:20:18 »
While Andrew Scheer, who hired his sister in law (who in turned hired Scheer's wife to work in her business), remains in the Conservative caucus.  Before the 2012 rule change, his sister worked for him in the Speaker's office.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/scheer-sister-otoole-conservative-1.5805264
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #804 on: November 21, 2020, 12:45:54 »
Quote from: dapaterson
Before the 2012 rule change, his sister worked for him in the Speaker's office.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/scheer-sister-otoole-conservative-1.5805264

Right, and before the rule change Yasmin Ratansi 's sister worked for her from 2005 to 2011.

Did Scheers sister work for him after the rule change and hide under the desk and in other offices when members of the public came in the building? Did Scheer tell people to call his sister a different name and try to hide their relationship?


The comparison really seems apples and oranges here.
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #805 on: November 21, 2020, 12:47:24 »
FWIW, she got turfed from caucus back on the 9th and now sits as an independent.

I seen that. It still blows my mind that a member of parliament whether they're an independent or not is allowed to remain in their position after blatantly pulling something like this.
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Offline dapaterson

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #806 on: November 21, 2020, 13:10:29 »
Right, and before the rule change Yasmin Ratansi 's sister worked for her from 2005 to 2011.

Did Scheers sister work for him after the rule change and hide under the desk and in other offices when members of the public came in the building? Did Scheer tell people to call his sister a different name and try to hide their relationship?


The comparison really seems apples and oranges here.

Hiring your sister in law (after the rule change) who then hires your wife has a bad look.  Particularly when you are the party leader...
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Offline Brihard

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #807 on: November 21, 2020, 13:17:03 »
I seen that. It still blows my mind that a member of parliament whether they're an independent or not is allowed to remain in their position after blatantly pulling something like this.

Ultimately it’s up to the voters. Our system preserves Parliamentary independence fiercely. Kady O’Malley did a decent dive into this a couple years back: https://ipolitics.ca/2018/12/03/process-nerd-can-an-mp-be-forced-to-give-up-his-or-her-seat/
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #808 on: November 21, 2020, 14:36:47 »
Hiring your sister in law (after the rule change) who then hires your wife has a bad look.  Particularly when you are the party leader...

I'll buy that. A sister in law doesn't appear to constitute as immediate family under the same rule that Yasmin Ratansi broke. Sheers sister in law hiring his sister doesn't sound like it broke any rules but I'm comfortable firing all three of them, and also Yasmin Ratansi.

Like Brihard points out though it's up to the voters. I think we're seeing voters are willing to let rules be broken as long as they feel their interests are looked out for. That sounds like a broken system to me.



The MP allegedly telling her office not to work on immigration files from South Asian constituents because they're untrustworthy or liars because of their ethnicity is quite the accusation.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2020, 15:32:20 by Jarnhamar »
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Offline Brihard

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #809 on: November 21, 2020, 15:40:52 »
The MP allegedly telling her office not to work on immigration files from South Asian constituents because they're untrustworthy or liars because of their ethnicity is quite the accusation.

It is indeed. Biting my tongue because I have to in these cases.
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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #810 on: November 21, 2020, 16:10:03 »
IF TRUE, then there isn't any other Govt. job you wouldn't be fired on the spot from.  Be interesting to see the roadmap required to make that happen seeing how she's elected.
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #811 on: November 21, 2020, 16:24:59 »
It is indeed. Biting my tongue because I have to in these cases.

IF TRUE, then there isn't any other Govt. job you wouldn't be fired on the spot from.  Be interesting to see the roadmap required to make that happen seeing how she's elected.

Can you imagine if a Canadian Forces recruiter told the office not to work on First Nation or Black Canadian applicant files because they're untrustworthy and liars?
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Offline Brihard

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #812 on: November 21, 2020, 16:28:24 »
IF TRUE, then there isn't any other Govt. job you wouldn't be fired on the spot from.  Be interesting to see the roadmap required to make that happen seeing how she's elected.

The roadmap, unless she resigns, is that the PM asks the GG to dissolve Parliament and call an election.
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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #813 on: November 21, 2020, 17:00:07 »
The roadmap, unless she resigns, is that the PM asks the GG to dissolve Parliament and call an election.

There is no other road map for elected officials.

For MPs, there is only and ultimately the voters of each riding to sort it out.

And for those who think it is wrong, imagine for a moment a system where a sitting MP could be removed without an election. That would be abused and democracy in Canada would die.

Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #814 on: November 21, 2020, 17:20:20 »
There is no other road map for elected officials.

For MPs, there is only and ultimately the voters of each riding to sort it out.

And for those who think it is wrong, imagine for a moment a system where a sitting MP could be removed without an election. That would be abused and democracy in Canada would die.

You're right. It just seems like politicians have set themselves up in such a way that even when they're caught  breaking the rules they're hardly accountable outside of a fine and maybe having to find a new job. they're so connected that finding a new job is hardly the threat it would be to someone like us.
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Offline Colin P

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #815 on: November 21, 2020, 21:14:26 »
Can you imagine if a Canadian Forces recruiter told the office not to work on First Nation or Black Canadian applicant files because they're untrustworthy and liars?

There was a time when the military believed such things and it's long gone now, which is good.

Offline MilEME09

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #816 on: November 21, 2020, 22:38:30 »
There is no other road map for elected officials.

For MPs, there is only and ultimately the voters of each riding to sort it out.

And for those who think it is wrong, imagine for a moment a system where a sitting MP could be removed without an election. That would be abused and democracy in Canada would die.

I agree with you however, I feel we should have some kind of mechanism to allow constituents to recall an MP and force a Bi-election if the majority are unsatisfied.
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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #817 on: November 21, 2020, 22:46:05 »
Good summary by Kadie O’Malley on the near impossibility of removal of a sitting MP.
https://ipolitics.ca/2018/12/03/process-nerd-can-an-mp-be-forced-to-give-up-his-or-her-seat/
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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #818 on: November 22, 2020, 02:23:56 »
Pretty well a done deal from the sounds of it. Break the rules, keep your job, screw what the voters think.

Switching gears.

What is the process for creating a national referendum on whether voters are ready to follow the PM into globalism, post nationalism and the Great Reset, as it's been called? Is there nothing, grass roots taxpayers can do to say no? If Parliamentarians are too fickle to tackle the problem, how do disgruntled citizens do it?
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Offline YZT580

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #819 on: November 22, 2020, 09:37:53 »


What is the process for creating a national referendum on whether voters are ready to follow the PM into globalism, post nationalism and the Great Reset, as it's been called? Is there nothing, grass roots taxpayers can do to say no? If Parliamentarians are too fickle to tackle the problem, how do disgruntled citizens do it?
I know there is the, tried and true, age old solution. I'm looking for a solution without bloodshed.
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Offline Brihard

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #820 on: November 22, 2020, 11:02:19 »
Pretty well a done deal from the sounds of it. Break the rules, keep your job, screw what the voters think.

Switching gears.

What is the process for creating a national referendum on whether voters are ready to follow the PM into globalism, post nationalism and the Great Reset, as it's been called? Is there nothing, grass roots taxpayers can do to say no? If Parliamentarians are too fickle to tackle the problem, how do disgruntled citizens do it?
I know there is the, tried and true, age old solution. I'm looking for a solution without bloodshed.

Create a political party and run for office. Next election at the absolute latest will be in three years. There is otherwise no mechanism for a ‘citizens’ referendum’, unless expressly provided for by some act of government. Otherwise, get enough Canadians to actually show they have these concerns and pressure the existing slate of MPs to push back. Same solutions as have been in place the whole time our system has been around. You may not get the results you like, but that’s a peaceful democracy for you.
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Offline CBH99

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #821 on: November 22, 2020, 15:54:56 »
Forgive me for asking what may be a silly question, I haven't been following the details of parliament for a while now.  (Just because of Covid, and paying attention to other things.)

Are our current opposition parties able to challenge/say anything in regards to Trudeua's suggestion of 'the great reset'?  I know for a while that MPs were not allowed in parliament due to COVID concerns, and some of them expressed serious concerns that many important decisions were being made by the government without the usual due processes.
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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #822 on: November 22, 2020, 16:36:19 »
Are our current opposition parties able to challenge/say anything in regards to Trudeau's suggestion of 'the great reset'?
  There is only one current opposition party.  The NDP and Bloc are now Liberal "lite" and support Trudeau at almost every turn. Together they outnumber the Conservatives which allows the Liberals to have a de-facto majority government.

I know for a while that MPs were not allowed in parliament due to COVID concerns, and some of them expressed serious concerns that many important decisions were being made by the government without the usual due processes.
  A lot of parliamentary business, particularly committees, was conducted via video and teleconferences.  Teleconferences have a "mute" function.  Don't like what the opposition is saying?  Click "mute".  Voila!  Consensus.
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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #823 on: November 22, 2020, 17:20:35 »
Much as I hate to burst anyone's bubble but the Liberals, the NDP. the Bloc and the Greens combined garnered the votes of roughly 11.4 million Canadians while the Conservatives (and the Bernier's bunch) collectively got roughly 6.5 million.

Like it or not, this country is a Liberal lite country for the most part. They generally support globalism and a more socially and economically sensitive economy. The Great Reset as circulating now is a fake conspiracy theory, plain and simple, but the direction most Western countries were heading before the pandemic and certainly thereafter are definitely contrary to that which most of us in the fiscal conservative fold are happy with.

The trouble is that we can bleat and protest all that we want. Referendums, even if available, won't help. Neither will the old tried and true federal election process to throw the buggers out because in the end, the way we're heading, the majority of the population will demand that we continue down that road.

We're well and beyond political parties educating the electorate. The electorate is educating itself and the political party that can harness going along for the ride better than it's opposition, (barring any scandal that will truly outrage our blasé electorate) will win.

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Offline CBH99

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Re: Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????
« Reply #824 on: November 22, 2020, 18:49:42 »

We're well and beyond political parties educating the electorate. The electorate is educating itself and the political party that can harness going along for the ride better than it's opposition, (barring any scandal that will truly outrage our blasé electorate) will win.

 :stirpot:


At this point, I don't even know what kind of scandal would be necessary for people to actually care.  If none of the super shady stuff thus far has prompted the citizens to cry out for change, I honestly don't know what would.


Do they care when chatting with their friends?  Yes, outraged.

Are they internally disappointed and frustrated?  Yes.

Will some of them even jump on their computers and join the deep fryer of a CBC comments section?  You bet they will, albeit that has to be the most useless avenue ever to be heard on.


And that's it.  I've realized that most people are like fish.  The next day, they'll forget about the scandal and focus on whatever the media tells them to.   :(
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