Author Topic: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019  (Read 1975 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online Halifax Tar

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 52,718
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 2,019
  • Ready Aye Ready
RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« on: April 11, 2020, 05:43:07 »
Subject: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019_NDHQ C NAVY OTTAWA_091412Z APR 20_MSN:2020100000232

 CLASSIFICATION: UNCLAS

 RAAUZYUW RCCPJAQ1012 1001557-UUUU--RCWEWLA RCWMBNS RCWMFYS RCWMHBS
 RCWMHVS RCWMKES RCWMMIS RCWMNHS RCWMNMS RCWMPCA RCWMSKS RCWMTRS
 RCWMWGS RCWMWIS RCWMYKS.
 ZNR UUUUU ZOC
 R 091412Z APR 20
 FM NDHQ C NAVY OTTAWA
 TO NAVGEN
 BT
 UNCLAS NAVGEN 006/20 RCN 011/20
 SIC WAC/OTA
 BILINGUAL MESSAGE/MESSAGE BILINGUE
 SUBJ: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
 RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE
 REFERENCES: A. APPROVAL LETTER MND / CDS DATED 3 JULY 2019
 B. NAVAL DRESS COMMITTEE DATED 25 JULY 2019
 C. EMAIL NAVAL DRESS COMMITTEE SECRETARY / DIRECTORATE OF
 SOLDIER SYSTEMSPROGRAM MANAGEMENT 2 DATED 04 SEPTEM
 BER 2019
 1. THE CANADIAN NAVAL ENSIGN (CNE) IS A DISTINCTIVE IDENTI-
 FYING SYMBOL OF THE ROYAL CANADIAN NAVY OF CANADA.
 IN ACCORDANCE WITH REFERENCE A, THE CNE IS AUTHORIZED FOR
 WEAR ON THE NAVAL UNIFORM
 2. UNTIL IT BECOMES AVAILABLE IN THE NATIONAL SUPPLY SYSTEM,



 PAGE 2 RCCPJAQ1012 UNCLAS NAVGEN 006/20
 THE CNE CAN BE PURCHASED AT CANEX
 3. REGARDING THE WEARING OF THE CNE, THE FOLLOWING SERVES
 AS DIRECTION TO ALL WHO WEAR THE NAVAL UNIFORM:
 A. ON THE NAVAL WIND AND RAIN JACKET AND THE NAVAL COMBAT
 JACKET, THE CNE IS TO BE WORN ON THE LEFT ARM POCKET CENTRED
 ON THE UPPER FLAP
 B. THE CNE NOW SERVES AS THE NATIONAL FLAG OF CANADA AND
 THE WEARING OF TWO NATIONAL IDENTIFIERS IS PROHIBITED. THIS
 MEANS THAT, IN ORDER TO WEAR THE CNE, THE CANADIAN FLAG
 CURRENTLY LOCATED ON THE BRASSARD FLAP MUST BE REMOVED:
 I. ON THE NAVAL WIND AND RAIN JACKET, BY REMOVING THE VEL-
 CRO CANADIAN FLAG
 II. ON THE NAVAL COMBAT JACKET, BY CAREFULLY REMOVING THE
 STITCHING SECURING ONLY THE CANADIAN FLAG TO THE BRASSARD
 VELCRO TAB. THIS IS TO BE DONE WITHOUT REMOVING, ALTERING,
 OR DAMAGING THE BRASSARD VELCRO TAB
 END OF ENGLISH TEXT / TEXTE FRANCAIS SUIT
 LE POINT SUR LA TENUE VESTIMENTAIRE DE LA MRC
 R EF ERENCES : A. LETTRE D APPROBATION DU MINISTRE DE LA DN ET
 DU CEMD EN DATE DU 3 JUILLET 2019



 PAGE 3 RCCPJAQ1012 UNCLAS NAVGEN 006/20
 B. R EUNION DU COMIT E SUR LA TENUE DE LA MARINE EN DATE DU
 25 JUILLET 2019
 C. ECHANGE DE COURRIELS ENTRE LE SECR ETAIRE DU COMIT E SUR
 LA TENUE DE LA MARINE ET L EQUIPE DU DIRECTEUR ADMINIS-
 TRATION DU PROGRAMME DE L EQUIPEMENT DU SOLDAT
 EN DATE DU 4 SEPTEMBRE 2019
 LE PAVILLON NAVAL CANADIEN EST UN SYMBOLE DISTINCTIF DE
 LA MARINE ROYALE CANADIENNE. CONFORM EMENT A LA R EF ERENCE
 A, LE PORT DU PAVILLON NAVAL CANADIEN EST AUTORIS E SUR
 L UNIFORME DE LA MARINE
 2. JUSQU A CE QU IL SOIT OFFERT DANS LE SYSTEME D APPROVI-
 SIONNEMENT NATIONAL, LE PAVILLON NAVAL CANADIEN PEUT
 ETRE ACHET E CHEZ CANEX
 3. VOICI LES DIRECTIVES CONCERNANT LE PORT DU PAVILLON
 NAVAL CANADIEN POUR TOUS CEUX QUI PORTENT L UNI-
 FORME DE LA MRC:
 SUR LE COUPE-VENT, LE VESTON IMPERM EABLE ET LE MANTEAU
 DE COMBAT DE LA MARINE, LE PAVILLON NAVAL CANADIEN
 DOIT ETRE CENTR E SUR LE RABAT DE LA POCHE SUP ERIEURE
 DE LA MANCHE GAUCHE



 PAGE 4 RCCPJAQ1012 UNCLAS NAVGEN 006/20
 B. LE PAVILLON NAVAL CANADIEN TIENT D ESORMAIS DE
 DRAPEAU NATIONAL DU CANADA ET LE PORT DE DEUX
 SYMBOLES NATIONAUX EST INTERDIT. CELA SIGNIFIE QUE POUR
 POUVOIR PORTER LE PAVILLON NAVAL DU CANADA, LE DRAPEAU
 NATIONAL DU CANADA QUI SE TROUVE ACTUELLEMENT SUR LE RA-
 BAT DU BRASSARD DOIT ETRE ENLEV E:
 I.SUR LE COUPE-VENT ET LE VESTON IMPERM EABLE DE LA MARINE,
 EN RETIRANT LE DRAPEAU CANADIEN EN VELCRO
 II. SUR LE MANTEAU DE COMBAT DE LA MARINE, EN ENLEVANT SOI-
 GNEUSEMENT LES COUTURES FIXANT SEULEMENT LE DRAPEAU
 CANADIEN A LA PATTE DE VELCRO DU BRASSARD,ET CE, SANS
 ENLEVER, ALT ERER OU ENDOMMAGER LA PATTE DE VELCRO
 BT
 #1012
Lead me, follow me or get the hell out of my way

Offline dapaterson

    Halfway to being an idiot-savant.

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 510,150
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 17,837
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2020, 10:40:47 »
As with the Army CADPAT badges, there is something fundamentally wrong with saying "We can't manage to acquire them in quantity in time, but CANEX somehow can..."
This posting made in accordance with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, section 2(b):
Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms: freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/charter/1.html

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 146,790
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,765
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2020, 11:03:20 »
I've wondered about that before, myself.

Makes me think that perhaps someone in procurement has a side deal with CANEX that includes some kickback.  :Tin-Foil-Hat:

Anyway, I am glad somebody realized that you don't need to have multiples of the Canadian flag stitched/velcroed on every inch of your uniform.

Now, if they could only apply that same logic to the removal of some of the fouled anchors everywhere, that would stop dragging the uniform down.

Offline FSTO

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 57,215
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 2,025
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2020, 11:07:36 »
Ships's crest and name on right breast, 1 qual badge on the left. CNE on shoulder. Voila! (then again I'm a follower of Marie Kondo  ;D)

Offline Dimsum

    West coast best coast.

  • Mentor
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 201,100
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,869
  • I get paid to travel. I just don't pick where.
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2020, 11:09:57 »
Ships's crest and name on right breast, 1 qual badge on the left. CNE on shoulder. Voila! (then again I'm a follower of Marie Kondo  ;D)

And a trade badge somewhere too.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 146,790
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,765
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2020, 11:15:39 »
And a trade badge somewhere too.

Why?

We never had them on the old work dress, garrison dress (blue) or the first NCD.

At sea, we are all seamen and we all know what each one another does onboard.

Trade badges are fine on service dress, but you don't need them on working uniforms.

Offline Dimsum

    West coast best coast.

  • Mentor
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 201,100
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,869
  • I get paid to travel. I just don't pick where.
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2020, 11:43:24 »
Why?

We never had them on the old work dress, garrison dress (blue) or the first NCD.

At sea, we are all seamen and we all know what each one another does onboard.

Trade badges are fine on service dress, but you don't need them on working uniforms.

First thing that comes to mind is when everyone's in flash gear at a section base and you're trying to find a specific trade to do a job. 

I'd argue that between service and operational uniforms, trade badges are more important on the latter.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Online Halifax Tar

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 52,718
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 2,019
  • Ready Aye Ready
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2020, 11:45:18 »
And a trade badge somewhere too.

Agreed.
Lead me, follow me or get the hell out of my way

Offline garb811

  • MP/MPO Question Answerer
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *
  • 111,465
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1,877
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2020, 13:51:19 »
...
Makes me think that perhaps someone in procurement has a side deal with CANEX that includes some kickback.  :Tin-Foil-Hat:
...
Nope, just the requisite 25% off the top for the retired GOFO cabal.  :Tin-Foil-Hat:
He's old enough to know what's right
And young enough not to choose it

Offline boot12

  • Member
  • ****
  • 12,845
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 115
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2020, 17:30:32 »
First thing that comes to mind is when everyone's in flash gear at a section base and you're trying to find a specific trade to do a job.

In the Chilean Navy, the NCMs have their trade badge located on their shoulder slip-ons, either above or below the rank (can't remember which). I don't take a stance on whether or not that is suitable for the RCN, but it makes identification of key pers much quicker during emergencies or simply when you're on a different ship where you don't know anyone.

Offline Dimsum

    West coast best coast.

  • Mentor
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 201,100
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,869
  • I get paid to travel. I just don't pick where.
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2020, 17:55:55 »
but it makes identification of key pers much quicker during emergencies or simply when you're on a different ship where you don't know anyone.

Exactly my point. 

Similarly, the RN and RAN also have their trade badge on their operational uniform.  The RN has it on their right arm and the RAN has it as part of their nametag. 

https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/thumbnails/image/2015/03/19/17/Navy.jpg?w968h681

https://soldiersystems.net/blog1/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/new_ran_uniforms.jpg
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 146,790
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,765
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2020, 09:25:03 »
Very well. I relent.

I suppose it could be of some use to have a trade identifier these days in view of high personnel turnover/jetty jumping (wasn't as much of an issue in my days, as we had fairly stable crews).

I wouldn't go the "above/below the rank" route since we work in a Canadian unified rank system and would not want to cause potential confusion in RCAF or Army personnel we happen to meet (same reason I don't agree with the RCAF having replaced the "Aviator" rank with blades instead of keeping the single hook).

As for RAN and RN, they have always worn trade badge on their uniforms, as did we before unification in Canada.

Between the two, I prefer the RAN current approach. It would provide an occasion to remove one anchor from the uniform.

But, please, don't make us switch to that horrible cammo uniform.   :boke:

Offline NavalMoose

  • Member
  • ****
  • 5,800
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 144
  • "Life in a blue suit"
Re: RCN DRESS AND CLOTHING UPDATE 01/2019
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2020, 13:32:19 »
Hilarious that the RCN still can't get their act together over dress and badges etc.  The amount of time spent on this is ridiculous...now it's remove one flag if you want this one...sad