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Basic Engineering

Kirkhill

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And if I remember correctly an early deployment of a Kingston MCDV found it trapped steaming in circles off of San Diego .... IIRC?



With all that in mind I found this discussion of the tradeoffs associated with building the "low cost" MCDVs enlightening.




Abalon pit stop.

 
For AOPs we were reassured that it was all class certified and met class rules so we didn't need to worry about it, and class knew more than we did so they would take our comments 'under advisement'.

Really frustrating as we've highlighted a number of design flaws and operating issues (having the design run at higher pressures than components are rated at) and took years to get even acknowledgement that we may have a clue.
 
As I watch the trials and tribulations associated with those long shafts and compare that with the simplicity of the bow-thruster service and re-installation it has me wondering, yet again, about, the decision to go with conventional shaft drive on the AOPS rather than the AziPods used on the MCDVs and the Svalbard.

I see the Norwegians stuck with the AziPods on their new icebreaker.

182,668,941.42 Canadian Dollar at today's exchange rate
Ordered 29 December 2013[
Laid Down 3 September 2015
Launched 3 March 2017
Completed 2018
In Service Aug 2018

It reached a latitude of 84° 40′N on July 13 (2019), but decided to turn back after meeting first-year ice measuring up to 1.5 meters thick, patches of multi-year ice and little sign of thawing.


General characteristics [2]
NameKronprins Haakon
NamesakeHaakon, Crown Prince of Norway
OwnerNorwegian Polar Institute [4]
OperatorNorwegian Institute of Marine Research
Port of registryTromsø,
21px-Flag_of_Norway.svg.png
Norway[2]
Ordered29 December 2013[2]
BuilderFincantieri (La Spezia, Italy)
CostNOK 1.4 billion
Yard number6255[2]
Laid down2 September 2015
Launched3 March 2017[2]
CompletedApril 2018[3]
Identification
StatusIn service
TypeResearch vessel
Tonnage9,145 GT
Length100.382 m (329 ft)
Beam21 m (69 ft)
Draught8.666 m (28 ft)
Depth10.408 m (34 ft)
Ice classPolar Class 3 Icebreaker
Installed power
  • 2 × Bergen B32:40L6 (2 × 3,500 kW)
  • 2 × Bergen B32:40L9 (2 × 5,000 kW)
Propulsion
Range15,000 nautical miles (28,000 km; 17,000 mi)
Endurance65 days at cruising speed
Capacity
  • Accommodation for 55 in 38 cabins
  • 1,180 m3 cargo hold
  • 20 TEU containers
Crew15–17
Aviation facilitiesHelipad and hangar


Also working on 3 new, 136 m 10,000 tonne Ice Strengthened OPVs, the Jan Mayens. (7.2 BNOK or 939,036,306.24 Canadian Dollar for 3)
Jan Mayen was designed by LMG Marin and built by Vard at its Vard Tulcea facilities in Romania.
The Norwegian parliament approved the investment for the vessels in June 2018. Vard signed a Nkr5bn ($617m) contract for the construction of three coast guard vessels for the Norwegian Coast Guard in the same month.

The hulls of three vessels will be built at the Vard Tulcea shipyard in Romania. Deliveries are expected to be completed by VARD Langsten shipyard in Norway, in 2022, 2023 and 2024 respectively.






These seem to have gone the "belts and braces" route with both a conventional shaft and a pair of AziPods. Nifty looking central prop though!


norwegianopvprops.jpg


and what appears to be a pair of thrusters forwards.

 
For AOPs we were reassured that it was all class certified and met class rules so we didn't need to worry about it, and class knew more than we did so they would take our comments 'under advisement'.

Really frustrating as we've highlighted a number of design flaws and operating issues (having the design run at higher pressures than components are rated at) and took years to get even acknowledgement that we may have a clue.

I used to argue that the most valuable piece of real estate owned by the Swedish company I worked for was the project library in Lund - a catalog of all the swings and misses and the corrective actions.

Nothing succeeds like practice and our government doesn't create the opportunities for practice. The Norwegians, on the other hand, equally blessed with lots of gas, lots of hydro and a small population give their industry lots of opportunity to try out different combinations and permutations. Their Coast Guard fleet has been a great playground for engineers. And the Coast Guard has gained a constantly refreshed, modern fleet.
 
I used to argue that the most valuable piece of real estate owned by the Swedish company I worked for was the project library in Lund - a catalog of all the swings and misses and the corrective actions.

Nothing succeeds like practice and our government doesn't create the opportunities for practice. The Norwegians, on the other hand, equally blessed with lots of gas, lots of hydro and a small population give their industry lots of opportunity to try out different combinations and permutations. Their Coast Guard fleet has been a great playground for engineers. And the Coast Guard has gained a constantly refreshed, modern fleet.
That, and all the corporate memory is probably the two biggest assets the established yards have. A lot of the CPF design team went onto BAE, so pretty funny to hear them include lessons learned from the CPF modular building when talking about CSC.
 
As I watch the trials and tribulations associated with those long shafts and compare that with the simplicity of the bow-thruster service and re-installation it has me wondering, yet again, about, the decision to go with conventional shaft drive on the AOPS rather than the AziPods used on the MCDVs and the Svalbard.

I see the Norwegians stuck with the AziPods on their new icebreaker.

182,668,941.42 Canadian Dollar at today's exchange rate
Ordered 29 December 2013[
Laid Down 3 September 2015
Launched 3 March 2017
Completed 2018
In Service Aug 2018




General characteristics [2]
NameKronprins Haakon
NamesakeHaakon, Crown Prince of Norway
OwnerNorwegian Polar Institute [4]
OperatorNorwegian Institute of Marine Research
Port of registryTromsø,
21px-Flag_of_Norway.svg.png
Norway[2]
Ordered29 December 2013[2]
BuilderFincantieri (La Spezia, Italy)
CostNOK 1.4 billion
Yard number6255[2]
Laid down2 September 2015
Launched3 March 2017[2]
CompletedApril 2018[3]
Identification
StatusIn service
TypeResearch vessel
Tonnage9,145 GT
Length100.382 m (329 ft)
Beam21 m (69 ft)
Draught8.666 m (28 ft)
Depth10.408 m (34 ft)
Ice classPolar Class 3 Icebreaker
Installed power
  • 2 × Bergen B32:40L6 (2 × 3,500 kW)
  • 2 × Bergen B32:40L9 (2 × 5,000 kW)
Propulsion
Range15,000 nautical miles (28,000 km; 17,000 mi)
Endurance65 days at cruising speed
Capacity
  • Accommodation for 55 in 38 cabins
  • 1,180 m3 cargo hold
  • 20 TEU containers
Crew15–17
Aviation facilitiesHelipad and hangar


Also working on 3 new, 136 m 10,000 tonne Ice Strengthened OPVs, the Jan Mayens. (7.2 BNOK or 939,036,306.24 Canadian Dollar for 3)
Jan Mayen was designed by LMG Marin and built by Vard at its Vard Tulcea facilities in Romania.







These seem to have gone the "belts and braces" route with both a conventional shaft and a pair of AziPods. Nifty looking central prop though!


norwegianopvprops.jpg


and what appears to be a pair of thrusters forwards.

Looks to be a fixed centre shaft and two outer pods. sort of the best of both worlds. The fixed shaft appeared to be supported at the far end, meaning less lash and torque on it, with some dilution of the potentiel thrust.
 
That, and all the corporate memory is probably the two biggest assets the established yards have. A lot of the CPF design team went onto BAE, so pretty funny to hear them include lessons learned from the CPF modular building when talking about CSC.
I always thought that Canada's shipbuilding strategy should be to build about one ship a year..... forever. That maintains the workforce, skills and knowledge and allows for gradual evolution of ship design and construction. The start-and-stop shipbuilding program is ruinous.

Edit: I know there is a whole other thread about Canada's shipbuilding strategy but.. well... I am lazy.
 
That, and all the corporate memory is probably the two biggest assets the established yards have. A lot of the CPF design team went onto BAE, so pretty funny to hear them include lessons learned from the CPF modular building when talking about CSC.
A lot of them came from the BAE team back when the CPF was being built originally as well. Met a few in my day. Probably retired now. Nav Arch is a pretty small community when you get down to it.
 
I always thought that Canada's shipbuilding strategy should be to build about one ship a year..... forever. That maintains the workforce, skills and knowledge and allows for gradual evolution of ship design and construction. The start-and-stop shipbuilding program is ruinous.

Edit: I know there is a whole other thread about Canada's shipbuilding strategy but.. well... I am lazy.
Yes that's the plan. Take the money you would once put into life extention and put it into building new.
 
A lot of them came from the BAE team back when the CPF was being built originally as well. Met a few in my day. Probably retired now. Nav Arch is a pretty small community when you get down to it.
I get the feeling there is a very small pool that actually shifts around so the 'degrees of separation' for knowing someone in ship building if you could map it out is probably just 1 or 2.
 
Hello, and Merry Christmas.
Has anyone found the correct link to download the english version of the Maritime Eng. Journal (106)?
Every link directs to the French version.

Thank you.
 
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