CFMG becoming more "clinical"?

[Dale Turner]

Just curious if any body can explain to me what is meant by the trade of being a medic in the Canadian Forces is becoming more "clinical"?   I'm hearing this term a lot now and I'm not 100% sure what it means.   Being more clinical has the flavour of only practicing our trade in a controlled environment such as an MIR or hospital.   Does that mean that we are slowly being phased out of doing field work ie; Coy medic or UMS tasks?  


Dale

 

[Armymedic]

I am not sure what the reserve side is doing...

But on the reg force side, more clinical means more mandated training. Maint of comp testing and training, and efforts to rotate pers thru the UMS and the CDU's.

 

[Dale Turner]

Armymedic,

I know that you in the regs have it a bit different than us reservists but our jobs cant be all that dissimilar.......can they?   So to your understanding you are still being utilized to provide med coverage for FTX's and other in field deployments and taskings? And being more clinical just refers to the type of training that will be done?



Dale  

 

[Resq]

Tour not of much use to anyone as a medic if you are not clinically competent. Rather than phasing the medic out of the UMS, it would appear the goal is to phase a more clinically competent medic into the UMS. We all win...medics and patients.

 

[Dale Turner]

I think you misunderstood what I meant by "clinical".  The way it was explained to me was that as medics we would no longer be deployed on exercicses to the field we would only be used in the UMS/BMS setting. That all we would be doing would be is training in a controlled, air conditioned environment where we wouldn't get our precious little fingers dirty.  I WANT to get dirty! I want to be the coy medic going on ruck marches and patrols. I want to walk the gun line.  I dont want to be stuck in doors being too clinical. 

I agree you have to have the skills to be a good medic.  But once you have those skills and you continue to practice and use those skills whats so bad about playing army every once and a while?



Dale

 

[Armymedic]

I think you misunderstood what I meant by "clinical".   The way it was explained to me was that as medics we would no longer be deployed on exercicses to the field we would only be used in the UMS/BMS setting. That all we would be doing would be is training in a controlled, air conditioned environment where we wouldn't get our precious little fingers dirty.   I WANT to get dirty! I want to be the coy medic going on ruck marches and patrols. I want to walk the gun line.   I dont want to be stuck in doors being too clinical.  

I agree you have to have the skills to be a good medic.   But once you have those skills and you continue to practice and use those skills whats so bad about playing army every once and a while?

I think that the training may get cleaner, due to the fact it is hard to conduct realistic medical oriented training using the current simulaters outside in the dirt. We are putting more emphais on the army soldier/medic skills, partiulary in responce of the CFMSS trend to civilianize training....Which I must admit is a good step in the right direction. We learn and get our experience on civy street, or in the rooms in Borden, and then afterward when you are at the stage just before the pointy end (Fd Amb), we teach you what might work in any given situation.

But make no mistake...there is no other occupation, military or civilian, who is capable to provide 1st line medical care to the soldier...As the Snr NCO's on my team put it, everyones role in the Canadian Forces comes down to providing support to the Infantry Sgt. In our case its the QL 5 Med Tech MCpl or Cpl (occasionally a Sgt in the light role) who is the closest medical support to that Sgt.

That is the base fact to our job...and should be one of the basic standards of training.

 

[JAFMA]

Totally agree with Armymedic.  If you can't walk the walk or talk the talk in a controlled situation / learning environment.  Then there is no place for you in the field.    Besides all we do is add on to what has already been done at the CCP and by the soldiers buddies in  F/A.  Don't forget Trauma is easy just follow your ABC's and plug all the holes and put in tubes. Stabilize and send him/her on there way to more definitive care.  Clinical is more in depth and is good training for employment in a garrison like unit where you should be learning every day anyway.  The day you stop learning in this field is the day you should hang it up and get out.

 

[Dale Turner]

Again, I'm not saying that continued education is a bad thing. I 100% agree we in the medical field NEED to learn something new every single day to stay proficient in our trade.  And you're right learning how to be a medic in the "bush" is not necessarilly the best learning environment.  What I'm saying is that I dont think we should be left out of the "soldiering" side of being in the army (and I know "soldiering" is going to have 100 different definitions ..but you know what I mean).

 

[JAFMA]

  What I'm saying is that I dont think we should be left out of the "soldiering" side of being in the army (and I know "soldiering" is going to have 100 different definitions ..but you know what I mean).

Not sure on what you mean by soldering, why don't you give me an idea?

 

[slim300]

Snr Med A,
I know what your getting at when you talk about becoming more clinical.  Working in Ottawa, just downstairs from CFMG HQ, I do get the sense that the big decision maker types are willing to see role 1 and 2 care erode in favour of greater role 3 (Field Hospital) capabilities.

Of course, clinical competence is of utmost experience, as Armymedic says.  I also see where they are coming from since in recent history the quality of care has deteriorated in peacetime, however, this is no excuse for losing focus on the need for well-executed life-saving medical support in the forward roles.

Cheers.

 

[COBRA-6]

Just curious if any body can explain to me what is meant by the trade of being a medic in the Canadian Forces is becoming more "clinical"?   I'm hearing this term a lot now and I'm not 100% sure what it means.   Being more clinical has the flavour of only practicing our trade in a controlled environment such as an MIR or hospital.   Does that mean that we are slowly being phased out of doing field work ie; Coy medic or UMS tasks?  


Dale

I've heard that expression a few times as well, used in a few different context... I think I know where you're coming from Snr Med A, a lot of times it refers to the trend (perceived? I'm not very knowledgeable about the med world) of moving from field-oriented med thinking, to one more civy-styled ambulance/clinic/hospital med thinking... and again I'm not saying that is true, just some people have that impression...

This may be a result of removing the Field Ambulances / Med Coys from under the CBG's command... I can count on one hand when I've had medics attached at the coy or pl level... maybe it also has something to do with how reserve medics aren't "allowed" to do almost anything until they reach the SNCO level (or so I've been told by res medics)... it just seems like they work out of ambulances/mirs instead of at the coal face most of the time...

I do have one example of what I'd like to see more of: I taught a SQ/BIQ one summer and we had a reserve pte medic attached because we were decentralized, with no MIR to support us. Anyways, he could have just done the morning sick parade thing, but he was out with us for every part of the course... on PT, on patrols, humping through the swamps, dug in, everywhere... handling all the problems that came up, cuts, bruises, foot problems, sprains.... etc... I'd like to see that on every exercise and course... 

If I'm way off base here please let me know, I am genuinely interested in the medical world and want to understand where you guys are coming from...

 

[Dale Turner]

Mike_R23a

      Most of the medics I work with are like the example that you used. We/they are highly motivated, competant and eager to please the units we support.  Every where you go you will get the odd @%&! pump that needs an attitude adjustment but that can be any trade, CSS or combat arms.

Med A's like to be able to take all the jammy info they've learned on courses and be able to apply that knowledge to the real deal in the field or on MIR taskings.  And that's where my point lies.  That we wont be able to use our knowledge in the field because we wont BE in the field. Maybe I'm misunderstanding the word "clinical" or taking it too literally. 

But then again thats what I started this thread for. To find out from every one else what clinical means.

DT

 

[medic65726]

The way it was explained to me by a WO/RN I was speaking the other day was like this:
The Army want's more Clinicians over Technicians.
Technicians learn skills and a bit about when to apply then, Clinicains learn more about how the body works and thus could better decide what interventios a patient needs.
On the reserve side of things it means they want to recruit more people who have civillian medical jobs, like Paramedics and Nurses.
Just what I understood of things.