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getting off course

fuccaduck

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hey new poster here. i just started my DP1 not long ago. for a few weeks now i’ve been thinking of putting in for a VOT the more i learn about combat arms the less i want to be in them. not my thing i suppose. is there any honest way of getting removed or getting off this course? i don’t feel mentally capable of handling it or a combat arms trade. any advice or ideas how to get off?
 

Jarnhamar

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the training and day to day life. i guess i picked combat arms with the wrong idea of what they actually are and do.

Fair enough.

If you just started your dp1 then you don't really know what day to day life will be like once you pass and get posted.

This is just my opinion but as a combat arms guy for a decent amount of time I think the non combat arms people work a hell of a lot harder than us in day to day life. Their living conditions may not be as bad in the field (though it can very well be) but their day to day life can be pretty damn stressful. I couldn't do a cooks job or a clerks job, that's for sure.

Anyways if you don't want to be combat arms and want a different trade you need to be cautious with the language you're using when you want to make it known.

If you start talking about mental health and what you're not mentally capable of that can send up redflags with you being in the CAF, not just combat arms.

I'd recommend submitting a memo to your chain of command and indicating you would like to VOT. You simply decided you want to do something else. I can't remember off the top of my head if you're able to do that while your on course or if you have to wait until you're fully trained (or after your first 3 years). Someone smarter may be able to help with that.

Be prepared to be told no and maybe you'll need to VR to get off course.
 

fuccaduck

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Fair enough.

If you just started your dp1 then you don't really know what day to day life will be like once you pass and get posted.

This is just my opinion but as a combat arms guy for a decent amount of time I think the non combat arms people work a hell of a lot harder than us in day to day life. Their living conditions may not be as bad in the field (though it can very well be) but their day to day life can be pretty damn stressful. I couldn't do a cooks job or a clerks job, that's for sure.

Anyways if you don't want to be combat arms and want a different trade you need to be cautious with the language you're using when you want to make it known.

If you start talking about mental health and what you're not mentally capable of that can send up redflags with you being in the CAF, not just combat arms.

I'd recommend submitting a memo to your chain of command and indicating you would like to VOT. You simply decided you want to do something else. I can't remember off the top of my head if you're able to do that while your on course or if you have to wait until you're fully trained (or after your first 3 years). Someone smarter may be able to help with that.

Be prepared to be told no and maybe you'll need to VR to get off course.
i honestly hate the field. not my thing. i’m definitely going to take your adjvide and write up a memo. thank you very much for the advice. personally i’d like to be a MSE op i love driving and stuff like that so hopefully it’ll go through. if it gets denied are there steps i could take for it to be re evaluated ?
 

Jarnhamar

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i honestly hate the field. not my thing. i’m definitely going to take your adjvide and write up a memo. thank you very much for the advice. personally i’d like to be a MSE op i love driving and stuff like that so hopefully it’ll go through. if it gets denied are there steps i could take for it to be re evaluated ?
You're welcome.

Just to manage your expectations if you hate the field you may want to consider changing your element to airforce or navy. Most trades in the army go to the field in one aspect or another. MSE ops are out living in modular tents and improvised shelters in the field right next to the infantry. A very demanding job. When vehicles are stuck up to their steering wheel in mud because infantry guys don't listen to directions guess who is out there in the mud and rain trying to pull the vehicle out.

Even in the airforce and navy if you get posted to a front line unit on an army base (which happens) you may see field time. Gotta roll the dice.

MSE Op is definitely a super cool job though.

If you're memo is denied you can try to submit a grievance but the chances are if you're being denied then it's likely due to a policy on it, which is difficult to grieve.
 

brihard

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i honestly hate the field. not my thing. i’m definitely going to take your adjvide and write up a memo. thank you very much for the advice. personally i’d like to be a MSE op i love driving and stuff like that so hopefully it’ll go through. if it gets denied are there steps i could take for it to be re evaluated ?

You could easily be an MSE op and still get posted to a combat arms unit, or to a logistics unit that exists to support those units in the field. Trucks go (most of) where troops go. Troops in the field need lots of stuff brought to them, and MSE ops do a lot of that. Just so you’re aware of the risk.

My opinion? You’re on DP1, which is a whole different world from life once you’re qualified. Stick it out, finish the course, and get a feel for what normal life looks like. And if you still really like the thought of driving trucks, infantry units have their own integral transport elements that you could work towards getting into.
 

ArmyRick

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i honestly hate the field. not my thing. i’m definitely going to take your adjvide and write up a memo. thank you very much for the advice. personally i’d like to be a MSE op i love driving and stuff like that so hopefully it’ll go through. if it gets denied are there steps i could take for it to be re evaluated ?
I spent years instructing DP1 infantry at Meaford and once managed the holding platoon as a WO. Dealing with people like you. I can offer some insights but be warned, I will be blunt.
 
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I spent years instructing DP1 infantry at Meaford and once managed the holding platoon as a WO. Dealing with people like you. I can offer some insights but be warned, I will be blunt.
Saying "people like you" does not sound very helpful or welcoming more I am/was a crusty WO/CSM and want to belittle someone which is likely not your intention. Fair but blunt is a good thing.
That said as a less crusty infantry NCO then logistics NCO of 27 years the truth is military life may not be for you as except for some hard airforce tech trades the field is pretty much always on the table although the combat arms is the least comfortable of the field trades.
 

kratz

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Harbour defence and some other roles see the RCN in the field as well. This means all services have a real potential for operating in the field.
Nicer answers do not hide the hard truths. Remastering to hide from the field is a foll's errand. A trade might be less likely, but if/when it happens you'd be miserable and potentially useless for the required job.
 
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Fair enough.

If you just started your dp1 then you don't really know what day to day life will be like once you pass and get posted.

This is just my opinion but as a combat arms guy for a decent amount of time I think the non combat arms people work a hell of a lot harder than us in day to day life. Their living conditions may not be as bad in the field (though it can very well be) but their day to day life can be pretty damn stressful. I couldn't do a cooks job or a clerks job, that's for sure.

Anyways if you don't want to be combat arms and want a different trade you need to be cautious with the language you're using when you want to make it known.

If you start talking about mental health and what you're not mentally capable of that can send up redflags with you being in the CAF, not just combat arms.

I'd recommend submitting a memo to your chain of command and indicating you would like to VOT. You simply decided you want to do something else. I can't remember off the top of my head if you're able to do that while your on course or if you have to wait until you're fully trained (or after your first 3 years). Someone smarter may be able to help with that.

Be prepared to be told no and maybe you'll need to VR to get off course.
This is a good response. One of the biggest reasons people release from the CAF is that they were enrolled into the wrong trade and can't see a way to escape other than releasing. The memo to the chain of command including enough details to satisfy them that you have done some research into the trade(s) you DO feel would be a good fit for you is a good first step. If there is an opening in that trade, or one similar, and your CFAT test score doesn't disqualify you, there is no reason why you wouldn't get the VOT. Then you'll be happier and more likely to remain in uniform. Consider this a longterm plan after you (hopefully) finish your DP1. The combat arms experience will almost certainly come in handy one day.
 

Eaglelord17

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There is something called 'occupational reassignment' or something along those lines (essentially VOT). You can't have completed your trades course to apply for it though. The moment you complete you DP1 you are locked in your trade for at least 36 months. I am not 100% of the actual name and they don't do it too often as most by time they realize it exists are usually DP1/QL3 qualified and it is too late.

I would put a memo up stating the trades you would be requesting and why. They likely won't be happy but its your career and you are unhappy with it now is the time to speak up.

 

FormerHorseGuard

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Courses and actual army life are 2 different things. Courses are made to be stressful, you are there to learn, get dirty, work as a team and then when the course is over life changes.

I hatred my time on Leadership course back in 1992, wanted to go home and do the walk of shame that I was sent and volunteered to come home and admit I failed. I asked one of the instructors and he said no. I finished the course and look back it almost 31 years later and realize it was one of the best things I ever started and completed.

Course life is not the same as life in a regiment or unit or HQ. You get time off, you get some space of your own if you live in barracks. Yes you have to keep your personal space tidy and neat. You do not have the instructors or staff checking in on you at all hours of day and night. You can wear your own clothes on after duty hours.

Every trade has those days of oh crap I have to go to the field and do what ever under tentage or in a hole. Or you go to sea for a tour, or whatever.
Some of the people here have been in your exact spot and finished it and found out it was not as bad as course life made it out to be.
Others have opted for a change of career and found out it took a long time, and what ever holding unit you are put in, they always had something for you to do.

Other people here will explain how to do the VOT thing and your free to try for it.

But before you do it, why not ask your instructor about life outside of the course, and what he or she really did at the rank of Pte in the regiment on a regular day, and get some first hand knowledge before you pack it in
 
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