Life in the CAF (Infantry DEO)

[andyyy_13]

Hello everyone,

I was curious if anyone here, perhaps some of the senior members, have been in the infantry or infantry officer. I would love to know more about life in the forces as an Infantry officer:

• What are the day-to-day responsibilities?
• How often do you get relocated?
• How often do you go on courses or exercises?
• Is it feasible to have a gf or wife while in the CAF, and what does that look like?

Any other info that would be beneficial to a potential future recruit will be great!

Thanks in advance.

 

[sarahsmom]

• How often do you get relocated?

In the infantry you get relocated less, because you tend to belong to aa regiment your entire career. As an officer you might get moved for experience, but still not as a support trade, so maybe once or twice in your earlier career and then maybe to Ottawa or another command post later, much later.
There are people in Petawawa at 1RCR or 3RCR that have been here for 10+ years.

• Is it feasible to have a gf or wife while in the CAF, and what does that look like?

Having a gf or wife is just as feasible as having a boyfriend or husband. There are lots of people with relationships in the CAF. The key is that your spouse needs to be able to manage things on their own with little support from you at times. On exercise or on deployment, you may or may not have much time to call or text, and if they are extremely dependent on you they will have a hard time. As for what it looks like, it look slike any other relationship as much as that is possible? Once you are done training, you can live with them if you choose in a RHU/PMQ, an apartment you rent in town, or a house you rent or purchase in town.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Hello everyone,

I was curious if anyone here, perhaps some of the senior members, have been in the infantry or infantry officer. I would love to know more about life in the forces as an Infantry officer:

• What are the day-to-day responsibilities?
• How often do you get relocated?
• How often do you go on courses or exercises?
• Is it feasible to have a gf or wife while in the CAF, and what does that look like?

Any other info that would be beneficial to a potential future recruit will be great!

Thanks in advance.

Best. Job. Ever.

And some other stuff.

Someone more helpful will likely be along in a minute

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Hello everyone,

I was curious if anyone here, perhaps some of the senior members, have been in the infantry or infantry officer. I would love to know more about life in the forces as an Infantry officer:

• What are the day-to-day responsibilities?
• How often do you get relocated?
• How often do you go on courses or exercises?
• Is it feasible to have a gf or wife while in the CAF, and what does that look like?

Any other info that would be beneficial to a potential future recruit will be great!

Thanks in advance.

OK. I am not an Infantry Officer, but until a serving Infantry Officer comes along I will offer my perspective as an Armour Officer that has served as a sub-unit commander in an Infantry Battalion for two years.

Day-to-day responsibilities is a remarkably hard question to answer. In theory, your first appointment once you are qualified should be as a Platoon Commander (Pl Comd). As a Pl Comd you would be responsible for 30 soldiers and their equipment. Your Platoon Second in Command (2IC) should be a Warrant Officer. They will be fully qualified to run the platoon in your absence and they will likely have twelve or more years of experience. Your three Sections should all be commanded by Sergeants, and they will have Master-Corporals as their 2ICs. All that to say, you will have plenty of mentorship available from within your platoon. Your daily routine will be driven by the routine of your unit. If you are in garrison then expect to be at Physical Training (PT) with your Troops once a day, usually in the morning around 0700 hrs but unit routines can vary. Then you go into the unit lines - and probably have coffee. There could be training conducting in your lines or the local area (ranges etc). You could have administration to complete for your troops. You will have O Gps (meetings) etc to attend. Generally the day in Garrison wraps-up by 1600 hrs.

If you are in the field then you are out with your troops 24/7. This is when you really learn your job. Field exercises vary in length from a few days to several weeks. You stay in the field the whole time (unless otherwise programed).

Relocations can certainly vary from officer to officer. Perhaps you stay in your first Battalion for five years before your first posting. You then get posted to a School or HQ for a couple of years before getting posted back to Battalion (same Regiment but perhaps a different Battalion than your first). As an Armour Officer I have been posted nine times over 27 years of Regular Force service. Your mileage may vary, but postings for officers tend to come every two to three years if you are progressing. Some folks, though, end up staying in the same Base for a while as they move from unit to unit within the same base. May the odds be ever in your favour.

Once you are complete your DP 1 training (the initial series of courses that qualify you to be a Platoon Commander) your next course would be the Army Tactical Operations Course (ATOC) which is taken as a junior Captain. Its a month or so in Gagetown New Brunswick but includes a distance learning element. Then you have the Army Operations Course (AOC) as a more senior Captain. This is about four months long with three or so of those in Kingston. You might have other courses along the way to include some of the specialized infantry ones if you end up going to a support platoon at battalion. My Infantry colleagues can offer more up-to-date information, but circa 2010 I had two infantry officers in my squadron that had taken the Advanced Reconnaissance Patrolman course (they were in the Recce Platoon.

You can certainly have a significant other. It is a challenging lifestyle and I won't suger-coat it. Your wife or girlfriend will make some sacrifices being with you due to the nature of service life. Relocations, especially to remoter areas, can be a big stressor. There are supports available, but at the end of the day each couple has to navigate life in the CAF together and find a way to make it work.

Other advice? Stay fit. Be ready to deal with some stress. Be a good teammate and listen to people who know things. Do what needs to be done but take care of people.

Best of luck!

 

[andyyy_13]

• How often do you get relocated?

In the infantry you get relocated less, because you tend to belong to aa regiment your entire career. As an officer you might get moved for experience, but still not as a support trade, so maybe once or twice in your earlier career and then maybe to Ottawa or another command post later, much later.
There are people in Petawawa at 1RCR or 3RCR that have been here for 10+ years.

• Is it feasible to have a gf or wife while in the CAF, and what does that look like?

Having a gf or wife is just as feasible as having a boyfriend or husband. There are lots of people with relationships in the CAF. The key is that your spouse needs to be able to manage things on their own with little support from you at times. On exercise or on deployment, you may or may not have much time to call or text, and if they are extremely dependent on you they will have a hard time. As for what it looks like, it look slike any other relationship as much as that is possible? Once you are done training, you can live with them if you choose in a RHU/PMQ, an apartment you rent in town, or a house you rent or purchase in town.

Thanks for the detailed reply!

OK. I am not an Infantry Officer, but until a serving Infantry Officer comes along I will offer my perspective as an Armour Officer that has served as a sub-unit commander in an Infantry Battalion for two years.

Day-to-day responsibilities is a remarkably hard question to answer. In theory, your first appointment once you are qualified should be as a Platoon Commander (Pl Comd). As a Pl Comd you would be responsible for 30 soldiers and their equipment. Your Platoon Second in Command (2IC) should be a Warrant Officer. They will be fully qualified to run the platoon in your absence and they will likely have twelve or more years of experience. Your three Sections should all be commanded by Sergeants, and they will have Master-Corporals as their 2ICs. All that to say, you will have plenty of mentorship available from within your platoon. Your daily routine will be driven by the routine of your unit. If you are in garrison then expect to be at Physical Training (PT) with your Troops once a day, usually in the morning around 0700 hrs but unit routines can vary. Then you go into the unit lines - and probably have coffee. There could be training conducting in your lines or the local area (ranges etc). You could have administration to complete for your troops. You will have O Gps (meetings) etc to attend. Generally the day in Garrison wraps-up by 1600 hrs.

If you are in the field then you are out with your troops 24/7. This is when you really learn your job. Field exercises vary in length from a few days to several weeks. You stay in the field the whole time (unless otherwise programed).

Relocations can certainly vary from officer to officer. Perhaps you stay in your first Battalion for five years before your first posting. You then get posted to a School or HQ for a couple of years before getting posted back to Battalion (same Regiment but perhaps a different Battalion than your first). As an Armour Officer I have been posted nine times over 27 years of Regular Force service. Your mileage may vary, but postings for officers tend to come every two to three years if you are progressing. Some folks, though, end up staying in the same Base for a while as they move from unit to unit within the same base. May the odds be ever in your favour.

Once you are complete your DP 1 training (the initial series of courses that qualify you to be a Platoon Commander) your next course would be the Army Tactical Operations Course (ATOC) which is taken as a junior Captain. Its a month or so in Gagetown New Brunswick but includes a distance learning element. Then you have the Army Operations Course (AOC) as a more senior Captain. This is about four months long with three or so of those in Kingston. You might have other courses along the way to include some of the specialized infantry ones if you end up going to a support platoon at battalion. My Infantry colleagues can offer more up-to-date information, but circa 2010 I had two infantry officers in my squadron that had taken the Advanced Reconnaissance Patrolman course (they were in the Recce Platoon.

You can certainly have a significant other. It is a challenging lifestyle and I won't suger-coat it. Your wife or girlfriend will make some sacrifices being with you due to the nature of service life. Relocations, especially to remoter areas, can be a big stressor. There are supports available, but at the end of the day each couple has to navigate life in the CAF together and find a way to make it work.

Other advice? Stay fit. Be ready to deal with some stress. Be a good teammate and listen to people who know things. Do what needs to be done but take care of people.

Best of luck!

Thank you sir! Really appreciate your thorough response!

 

[deokid]

OK. I am not an Infantry Officer, but until a serving Infantry Officer comes along I will offer my perspective as an Armour Officer that has served as a sub-unit commander in an Infantry Battalion for two years.

Day-to-day responsibilities is a remarkably hard question to answer. In theory, your first appointment once you are qualified should be as a Platoon Commander (Pl Comd). As a Pl Comd you would be responsible for 30 soldiers and their equipment. Your Platoon Second in Command (2IC) should be a Warrant Officer. They will be fully qualified to run the platoon in your absence and they will likely have twelve or more years of experience. Your three Sections should all be commanded by Sergeants, and they will have Master-Corporals as their 2ICs. All that to say, you will have plenty of mentorship available from within your platoon. Your daily routine will be driven by the routine of your unit. If you are in garrison then expect to be at Physical Training (PT) with your Troops once a day, usually in the morning around 0700 hrs but unit routines can vary. Then you go into the unit lines - and probably have coffee. There could be training conducting in your lines or the local area (ranges etc). You could have administration to complete for your troops. You will have O Gps (meetings) etc to attend. Generally the day in Garrison wraps-up by 1600 hrs.

If you are in the field then you are out with your troops 24/7. This is when you really learn your job. Field exercises vary in length from a few days to several weeks. You stay in the field the whole time (unless otherwise programed).

Relocations can certainly vary from officer to officer. Perhaps you stay in your first Battalion for five years before your first posting. You then get posted to a School or HQ for a couple of years before getting posted back to Battalion (same Regiment but perhaps a different Battalion than your first). As an Armour Officer I have been posted nine times over 27 years of Regular Force service. Your mileage may vary, but postings for officers tend to come every two to three years if you are progressing. Some folks, though, end up staying in the same Base for a while as they move from unit to unit within the same base. May the odds be ever in your favour.

Once you are complete your DP 1 training (the initial series of courses that qualify you to be a Platoon Commander) your next course would be the Army Tactical Operations Course (ATOC) which is taken as a junior Captain. Its a month or so in Gagetown New Brunswick but includes a distance learning element. Then you have the Army Operations Course (AOC) as a more senior Captain. This is about four months long with three or so of those in Kingston. You might have other courses along the way to include some of the specialized infantry ones if you end up going to a support platoon at battalion. My Infantry colleagues can offer more up-to-date information, but circa 2010 I had two infantry officers in my squadron that had taken the Advanced Reconnaissance Patrolman course (they were in the Recce Platoon.

You can certainly have a significant other. It is a challenging lifestyle and I won't suger-coat it. Your wife or girlfriend will make some sacrifices being with you due to the nature of service life. Relocations, especially to remoter areas, can be a big stressor. There are supports available, but at the end of the day each couple has to navigate life in the CAF together and find a way to make it work.

Other advice? Stay fit. Be ready to deal with some stress. Be a good teammate and listen to people who know things. Do what needs to be done but take care of people.

Best of luck!

Hi,

Could you explain in more detail how the job of a captain differ from a Lieutenant/Platoon Commander? Also, is it true that you are automatically promoted to captain after two years of being a Lieutenant?

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Hi,

Could you explain in more detail how the job of a captain differ from a Lieutenant/Platoon Commander? Also, is it true that you are automatically promoted to captain after two years of being a Lieutenant?

There are two related concepts here: rank and appointment. We have our ranks and those are fairly straight-forward. Then we have appointments - those are also very important but sometimes a little more fuzzy. Generally, rank transcends organizations while appointment is more important within an organization. All else being equal.

Platoon Commander is an appointment. Lieutenant is a rank, as is Captain. Company Second in Command is an appointment. A platoon commander can be a Second Lieutenant, Lieutenant or even Captain. A Company Second in Command (Coy 2IC) is almost always a Captain, and they would be primus inter pares (first among equals) if one or more of the Platoon Commanders also happened to be Captains.

As a newly qualified officer in a Battalion you can expect to be a Rifle Platoon Commander. Its a big job. After that, there are the platoons in Combat Support Company and Combat Service Support Company that are normally commanded by officers (Lts or Junior Captains) that have already been Rifle Platoon Commander. Recce Platoon and Transport Platoon are such examples. These roles have the command and leadership aspects of Platoon Command (soldiers), but also some heightened technical and staff skills. You also get the bigger Battalion and maybe even Brigade picture.

The classic Captain role is Company Second in Command. There is a Major who is the Officer Commanding. You are there to replace him if he is absent, but also to ensure that the company is organized to accomplish its tasks. This means ensuring that administration is taken care of to include paperwork, fuel, ammunition, maintenance etc. You are not alone in this latter organizational task. The Company Sergeant-Major (a Master Warrant Officer) has a huge role in this, as do several NCOs such as the Company Quartermaster Sergeant (CQMS - usually the senior Warrant Officer in the company). As the Coy 2IC you are the link to Battalion at the officer level for most matters. There is also a LAV Captain in mechanized units who takes on some of the Company operations functions. As the Coy 2IC, though, you demonstrate that you understand how the company operates and how it fits in. You "ride herd" on the platoon commanders, helping to mentor them.

Other Captains serve in Battalion Headquarters in roles such as Adjutant. You work your way into those, generally through the Company 2IC position and often after a posting outside the unit to broaden your horizon. The Army Operations Course is usually taken before assuming one of those key Captain jobs.

Promotion to Captain is indeed based on time once you are are qualified in your occupation.

 

[deokid]

There are two related concepts here: rank and appointment. We have our ranks and those are fairly straight-forward. Then we have appointments - those are also very important but sometimes a little more fuzzy. Generally, rank transcends organizations while appointment is more important within an organization. All else being equal.

Platoon Commander is an appointment. Lieutenant is a rank, as is Captain. Company Second in Command is an appointment. A platoon commander can be a Second Lieutenant, Lieutenant or even Captain. A Company Second in Command (Coy 2IC) is almost always a Captain, and they would be primus inter pares (first among equals) if one or more of the Platoon Commanders also happened to be Captains.

As a newly qualified officer in a Battalion you can expect to be a Rifle Platoon Commander. Its a big job. After that, there are the platoons in Combat Support Company and Combat Service Support Company that are normally commanded by officers (Lts or Junior Captains) that have already been Rifle Platoon Commander. Recce Platoon and Transport Platoon are such examples. These roles have the command and leadership aspects of Platoon Command (soldiers), but also some heightened technical and staff skills. You also get the bigger Battalion and maybe even Brigade picture.

The classic Captain role is Company Second in Command. There is a Major who is the Officer Commanding. You are there to replace him if he is absent, but also to ensure that the company is organized to accomplish its tasks. This means ensuring that administration is taken care of to include paperwork, fuel, ammunition, maintenance etc. You are not alone in this latter organizational task. The Company Sergeant-Major (a Master Warrant Officer) has a huge role in this, as do several NCOs such as the Company Quartermaster Sergeant (CQMS - usually the senior Warrant Officer in the company). As the Coy 2IC you are the link to Battalion at the officer level for most matters. There is also a LAV Captain in mechanized units who takes on some of the Company operations functions. As the Coy 2IC, though, you demonstrate that you understand how the company operates and how it fits in. You "ride herd" on the platoon commanders, helping to mentor them.

Other Captains serve in Battalion Headquarters in roles such as Adjutant. You work your way into those, generally through the Company 2IC position and often after a posting outside the unit to broaden your horizon. The Army Operations Course is usually taken before assuming one of those key Captain jobs.

Promotion to Captain is indeed based on time once you are are qualified in your occupation.

Thank you so much for taking the time for writing such a detailed response. I appreciate it!

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

I realize I didn't really address the questions about how frequently an infantry officer (or any junior officer in the Army really) goes to the field and goes on deployment. I will offer a representative view of a unit's tempo and how a new officer might fit in. Your mileage will vary...

Army units are in Canadian Mechanized Brigade Groups: 2 CMBG in Pet and Gagetown, 5 GBMC in Valcartier and 1 CMBG in Edmonton and Shilo along with 6 Combat Support Brigade in Kingston, Gagetown and with int coys co-located with each CMBG. Those CMBGs are each in a different Division which also include reserve Canadian Brigade Groups (CBGs). For simplicity we numbered the Divisions differenty than the CMBGs that are in them...The "so what" is that each Division is in a different cycle of the Managed Readiness Plan (MRP). So the tempo of your unit will depend on where your Division is in the MRP.

Let's say that our newly qualified officer arrives at his battalion in late summer. His battalion is equipped with LAVs and is entered the Build phase of the MRP. They will then deploy in the following summer as they enter the Committed to NATO phase of the MRP. Our new officer won the lottery and was assigned to platoon command. The late summer and early fall are usually focused on Individual Battle Task Standards (IBTS) which means getting everyone through their annual qualifications. We go through lots of personnel churn every summer, so its a good practice to get everyone to the same baseline after that. So our young platoon commander might be tasked to be a Range Safety Officer on a range, but will also go through all the same IBTS as his troops. Thanksgiving weekend is usually made a little longer and if often a natural break between training phases.

The rest of the fall will likely see the unit conduct Foundation Training in the field up to platoon level. So our platoon commander will be in the field for several weeks, going through the paces with his platoon. They will start at low-level, focusing on Section level before going to Platoon level. The Battalion Commander or perhaps the DCO or Operations Officer might come out to validate the platoon commanders in the field. There might be section and platoon live-fire in addition to "dry training." How this training is conducted will vary by location. Units in Petawawa, Shilo and Gagetown will likely conduct at the base where they live, so they will often come back to garrison on weekends etc. Units in bases without bigger training areas will likely travel to Wainwright or Gagetown and conduct this FT in a block. I would expect at least four weeks in the field (Thanksgiving to Remembrance Day), but again your mileage will vary.

December is usually devoted to Christmas parties and unit-level stuff. Block leave is usually three weeks.

January and February might be winter warfare (a week or two give or take), but also some computer assisted exercises for the Battalion staff that will pull in junior officers. The unit might also run some courses (driver, 25mm Turrent Operator, driver wheeled etc) to make sure that the unit is ready for the deployment in the summer from a qualification perspective.

There will usually be a March Break, and the rest of March is often live fire for a number of reasons (fiscal year and fire index being two of the big ones).

April could see the unit train to company and combat team level in the field. The focus will be on company-level operations and combined arms. This could be two to four weeks assuming that the platoons did not reorg over Christmas.

Early May might have the tail end of Company-level training, but the focus of May and June will be pre-deployment. Catching up on all the pre-deployment administration and getting the unit ready to deploy will occupy a lot of the young officer's time. There will be some pre-deployment leave and then - off they go to Latvia for six months. Upon arrival they will go through a relief in place before hitting the field as a Battle Group. The deployment lasts six months. They will train, and train and train some more (hopefully just training). Then they come home around Christmas and spend the winter chilling-out. They might also go on some career courses. They might do some low-level training in the spring to "prevent getting rusty", but for the most part the unit will focus on day-to-day activities. Or get deployed to a wild fire or flood?

As our DEO officer's second year at battalion draws to a close he is likely promoted to Captain (if not before depending how long he was in the training system) and might get posted out of the unit (to the Infantry School, or maybe a Reserve unit). They might go into Battalion HQ or Combat Support or Combat Support Company for the following year, during which I would expect them to take ATOC.

So, this is a representative two year period. An officer who arrives while their battalion is deployed will have a different experience. Their platoon command time in the field might be shorter than their friend who arrived, training for a year and then deployed. But all is not lost. Assuming they are a fit, play well with others and demonstrate good leadership they might find themselves on any number of smaller training missions that pop up. Or not. Mars can be a fickle god. My advice to them is to keep their powder dry and be ready for an opportunity when it comes rather than moping about and having a reason to not deploy when the opportunity does present itself.

Anyhoo!

 

[deokid]

What is the first contract you are offered as a DEO applicant. Is it a VIE for 3 years? or a 5 year contract?

 

[sarahsmom]

What is the first contract you are offered as a DEO applicant. Is it a VIE for 3 years? or a 5 year contract?

It’s definitely longer than that. Most DEO contracts are no less than 9 years. Infantry (not officer) is a 3 year contract.

 

[deokid]

It’s definitely longer than that. Most DEO contracts are no less than 9 years. Infantry (not officer) is a 3 year contract.

I'm not 100% sure if I want to commit for that long. If you choose to leave early, can you VR with 6 months notice? even if your VR is post OFP?

 

[sarahsmom]

As long as you are not on obligatory service (as you would when you are an ROTP candidate) you can leave at any time. It is possible to leave with less than 6 months notice, but there are conditions that need to be satisfied, and I am not privy to those in my job. I imagine you need a firm offer from another employer stating they need you sooner than 6 months from now, for example. The CAF just wants to ensure you are not going to be homeless or destitute.
9 years may seem like a long time, but it will take 1 to 2 years just to complete your training. Time really flies.