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The RCAF's Next Generation Fighter (CF-188 Replacement)

Ostrozac said:
I'm not so sure about that. I've seen suggestions that the bases that have the historically highest release rates are Ottawa, Edmonton and Halifax. City living alone doesn't seem to be a magic bullet for retention problems. It would be a shame to move the fighter force complete to Toronto and have them all immediately move over to the civilian aviation industry.

That release rate may be an effect caused by career managers moving people near their retirement/release to those bases for non-operational jobs. Just as cities with major hospitals show up as a cluster for various types of death from diseases, because people go there for treatment. If the data showed that people in high tempo operations were requesting releases early, then that might indicate issues. 
 
Well just found a source of "interim fighters" https://www.reuters.com/article/us-austria-eurofighter-idUSKBN19S0ZN?il=0
 
Makes far more sense for current users of the Typhoon to build up their existing fleet than for us to buy an incomparable microfleet. Maybe the RAF is the best possible customer to take the orphaned fleet.
 
Thucydides said:
Makes far more sense for current users of the Typhoon to build up their existing fleet than for us to buy an incomparable microfleet. Maybe the RAF is the best possible customer to take the orphaned fleet.

Towards the end of the cold war, Britain and three other European countries agreed to develop a new aircraft – initially called the Eurofighter, now the Typhoon – to engage in dogfights with Soviet pilots over the plains of northern Europe.

This month, Michael Fallon, the defence secretary, praised RAF Typhoon pilots for intercepting unidentified aircraft in incidents said to be reminiscent of the cold war. What he did not mention is that 30 years after it was conceived and despite some £20bn spent on the project, the Typhoon is unable to engage the enemy said by David Cameron to pose the biggest threat to Britain’s security. And it will not be able to do so until 2019 at the earliest.

Because the Typhoons are not yet equipped with the latest Brimstone “fire and forget” missiles, the smartest weapon and most accurate in the RAF’s armoury, British air strikes against Islamic State (Isis) fighters have been left to 30-year-old Tornado jets.

Typhoons are undergoing wind tunnel and aerodynamic tests before they can be fitted with missiles to the underside of their wings.

The (UK) government, meanwhile, has been trying to get some of its money back by selling Typhoons abroad. In February, after years of tough negotiations, the British manufacturer of the Typhoon, BAE Systems, agreed price escalation terms relating to a multibillion-pound deal to sell 72 aircraft to Saudi Arabia.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/dec/26/putin-raf-typhoon-aircraft-russia

The UK government bought more aircraft than the RAF wanted/needed/could afford to keep British workers employed with the intention of selling off the surplus.  The RAF won't be buying back any Typhoons.  Nor will Germany.
 
Two likely RCAF contenders now out of Belgian F-16 replacement competition:

Saab withdraws from Belgium's F-16 fighter replacement competition

Sweden today [July 10] declined to propose Saab's Gripen E fighter jet for the Belgian Air Force's Air Combat Capability (ACCAp) program, which intends to replace the BAF aging fleet of F-16 fighter jets, the Swedish Defence Materiel Administration (FMV) announced today.

"In their Request for Government Proposal, Belgium is also seeking extensive operational support from the delivering nation. This would require a Swedish foreign policy and political mandate that does not exist today. Therefore Sweden and the FMV choose not to submit an answer to the Belgian request," the FMV said.

"The procurement is ongoing and FMV will not comment further," the Agency added.

In April, Boeing first decided not to compete for Belgium's F-16 fighter jets replacement program. Boeing was supposed to answer the RfGP issued in March with its F/A-18 E/F Super Hornet.

Belgium approved in last December the purchase of 34 new fighter aircraft to be acquired from Spring 2018 for an amount of 3,573 billion euros.

Only three platforms are still competing: Lockheed Martin’s F-35A stealth fighter, the Rafale F3R from Dassault Aviation, and the Eurofighter Typhoon proposed by the eponym European consortium.
http://www.airrecognition.com/index.php/archive-world-worldwide-news-air-force-aviation-aerospace-air-military-defence-industry/global-defense-security-news/global-news-2017/july/3611-saab-withdraws-from-belgium-s-f-16-fighter-replacement-competition.html

Mark
Ottawa

 
More on Belgian fighter competition, 34 planes (note nuke role at end):

Gripen Withdrawn From Belgian Fighter Contest

Belgium’s short list for its future fighter has shrunk to three after the Swedish government withdrew Saab’s new-generation Gripen from the tender.

Swedish defense materiel organization FMV, which would facilitate any Gripen sale, said in a July 10 statement that while the aircraft meets all the operational requirements in Belgium’s request for proposals, Sweden itself could not meet Brussel’s need for “extensive operational support.”

“This would require a Swedish foreign policy and political mandate that does not exist today,” the FMV said.
The agency added that it would not submit answers to the Belgian request for proposals.

The Gripen becomes the second aircraft to exit the Belgian tender. In mid-April, Boeing said it was withdrawing the F/A-18 Super Hornet because the competition was not a “truly level playing field”—a hint that Belgium’s requirement is skewed in favor of the Lockheed Martin F-35, a type already purchased by neighbors the Netherlands and the other European Participating Air Forces, which, like Belgium, flew the F-16.

With the Gripen and Super Hornet out, just the Dassault Rafale, Eurofighter Typhoon and F-35 are left.

Belgium wants to purchase 34 new fighters to replace the existing 54-strong F-16 fleet, and is budgeting €3.59 billion ($3.858 billion) for the procurement, the government announced March 17. A fleet of 34 will meet Belgium’s requirement to have six fighters available for expeditionary operations [emphasis added].

It has long been suggested that Belgium likely will favor the F-35 to maintain commonality with the Netherlands, with which it works closely on international operations and a joint quick-reaction alert air policing mission [emphasis added--NORAD?]. The Benelux sky initiative, launched this year, allows a Belgian F-16 to be scrambled to deal with an issue in Dutch airspace, and vice versa.

Brussels also wants to continue its involvement in NATO’s nuclear-sharing agreements, which likely would demand the use of a U.S.-produced aircraft to carry the weapon [emphasis added].

Under a dual-key arrangement, an unknown number of U.S.-owned B61 nuclear bombs are housed at Kleine Brogel air base and would be flown in the event of a conflict by Belgian F-16s.
http://aviationweek.com/defense/gripen-withdrawn-belgian-fighter-contest

Mark
Ottawa
 
No country other than CAN/US are part of NORAD.  European countries operate under NATO Air Policing, a similar but different arrangement.
 
@ SupersonicMax....

Any thoughts on how this is all going to play out?

It feels like Boeing has fumbled the ball with the Bombardier sanctions to the point it will now be "Anything but the SuperHornet.", which re-opens the door to the F-35, as well as potentially the Rafale if Trudean & Macron continue their love-fest.


M.  :salute:
 
Canada will probably end up with an orphan fleet of fighters unless Trudeau et al grow up. Possibly recent events @ $10.5M will smarten them up.
 
Cdn Blackshirt said:
It feels like Boeing has fumbled the ball with the Bombardier sanctions to the point it will now be "Anything but the SuperHornet.", which re-opens the door to the F-35, as well as potentially the Rafale if Trudean & Macron continue their love-fest.

Harper was pretty buddy buddy with France too, we almost got a Mistral if it wasn't for the bureaucrats, I wouldn't be surprised if we end up with more French designed kit in the future.
 
The Van Doo's have a link to French naval infantry as I recall, they might have become our " Le Marines"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compagnies_Franches_de_la_Marine
 
Cdn Blackshirt said:
@ SupersonicMax....

Any thoughts on how this is all going to play out?

It feels like Boeing has fumbled the ball with the Bombardier sanctions to the point it will now be "Anything but the SuperHornet.", which re-opens the door to the F-35, as well as potentially the Rafale if Trudean & Macron continue their love-fest.


M.  :salute:

Gut feeling:  Government announced we'll buy a total of 88 fighters.  That sounds a lot like 18 interim (Super Hornet) and 70 future (JSF).  Again, just a gut feeling.
 
I appreciate your gut feeling.  It's far more valuable than anything I bring to the table in this discussion.

Thank SSM.  :salute:
 
SupersonicMax said:
Gut feeling:  Government announced we'll buy a total of 88 fighters.  That sounds a lot like 18 interim (Super Hornet) and 70 future (JSF).  Again, just a gut feeling.

The Super Hornet is about 99% dead as long as Boeing doesn't kill their compliant against Bombardier, IMO.
 
While I hope so, I have much less confidence in that than you have.

Unless you have insider information.
 
Loachman said:
While I hope so, I have much less confidence in that than you have.

Unless you have insider information.

I do not - just reading the public statements.
 
I wouldn't put too much any stock in anything that Liberals say publicly, especially the son of "I won't introduce wage and price controls".
 
Loachman said:
I wouldn't put too much any stock in anything that Liberals say publicly, especially the son of "I won't introduce wage and price controls".

A son is not his father.
 
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