Tricky bind for politicians. They have no role in directing the operations of police, but it’s clearly a public order policing issue at this point with some of what we’re seeing. There’s some unquestionable criminality within some of these events and some of what’s being said and expressed. There needs to be some direct and conscious communication from political leadership to police leadership that they will have support in the political sphere should they choose to act. The policing profession is very accustomed to becoming the whipping boy whenever anything ugly to watch happens, and this government has very explicitly expressed its expectations of gentler public order policing and restrictions on the tools used therefor.
Hamas invaded Israel 2023
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Brad Sallows
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Be interesting to see if any complaints are filed.
McG
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There must be something possible and of more substantive than a strongly worded tweets from ever cabinet minister.
OldSolduer
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Does it start with tweets, or does it end with tweets?
If all there is is tweets, then it's vain repetition, and pointless.
If all there is is tweets, then it's vain repetition, and pointless.
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Are you saying that all the Liberal MPs releasing their Xeets an appropriate number of minutes after Trudeau’s scathing and most decidedly non-moistly worded Xeet, isn’t going to put some sense into Hamas? It worked to shame MBS when his operatives chopped up Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi…oh wait…no it didn’t…
OldSolduer
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Maybe a strongly worded Xeet?
Well, like I said, it’s tricky.
Do you want the PM / government in power to specifically direct certain law enforcement action? Because that would be a massive upheaval in how our executive branch of government interacts with police. In other contexts, that would have many members of this page (myself included) in an uproar.
As the PM he can attempt to legislate new offences, but lack of applicable offences isn’t the issue here.
He can specifically earmark some of the budget for particular law enforcement initiatives- say, increased police funding to combat hate speech and other hate motivated offences. But while that can pay for some new police positions to be established, it doesn’t knit cops to fill them. And, local policing is a provincial jurisdiction, delegated in the case of most cities to the local municipality. Do you propose the government try to tell Ottawa Police or Toronto Police what to do? That pulls us right back to the first problematic COA.
So back to you I guess. What do you want our Prime Minister/cabinet to have the power to do as it pertains to specific actions of law enforcement? Think carefully, because the power you want them to have today, they will have next month and next year.
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So what I’m hearing is “is this worthy of the Emergencies Act?”
It would be interesting to see whether the folks who saw the EA for the Convoy as overreach support an EA for this. As I see it, both situations are Canadians being manipulated in various ways by folks outside Canada.
I actually wasn’t going there- I don’t think that’s even conceivably in play for any of these ‘last a couple hours’ protests where everyone then goes home.
Halifax Tar
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McG
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To whom are the police accountable if the government of the day can’t point out that this is your job and it needs to done?
I certainly wouldn't want the Government to be awarding itself any extraordinary powers - the present leadership has proved itself all too eager to do that - but they could ask the police to enforce existing laws properly.
Hamas is a terrorist organization, and some of these protests are clearly openly supporting it.
Police are generally accountable, specifically, to their Police Service Boards for the municipality. Board can set objectives and strategic direction, but nobody external dictates operational matters. Historically we’re considered that arms-reach balance very important to have. Any change to that balance would need to be carefully measured. Again, do you want the government - this one, or any - to be able to specifically target individual protests for crowd suppression/public order enforcement?
To be clear, I agree that what we’re seeing in these Gaza protests definitely necessitates some criminal investigation and charges for some of the incitement of hate. I take no issue there. I’m replying specifically to political leadership talking about how it’s unacceptable, and you and others having a “do something” expectation of then, when the actual doing would be a police matter. Lots of hazard there if we aren’t careful.
If the operational decision was made to start doing stick a shield work because of mass disturbances of the peace, I’d gear up and go; it’s literally my job. I just urge caution about who exactly we want calling those shots.
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TacticalTea
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Wasn't everyone's conclusion of the Freedom Convoy debacle that the core of the problem was the incompetence of local authorities?
So yes. Military experience should have taught everyone here that if no one will do the job, then you take charge and do it. You don't just sit there and go "welp, if only someone - not me - did something about it, wouldn't that be great".
Naturally, this government won't, because those are his minions and the predictable - and likely, desired (notwithstanding the milquetoast twits) - result of a self-destructive ideology.
Not sure what you’re proposing. Are you suggesting the feds unilaterally send the RCMP into downtown Ottawa and Toronto and… I’m not sure what exactly?
Any national security threats arising out of this are squarely RCMP responsibility, but the public order and incitement of hatred aspects are squarely municipal/provincial. Sending your lever of government’s police force unilaterally into another jurisdiction absent legal mechanism to do so would explicitly be a usurpation of the province’s constitutional authority, and in most cases the devolved powers of the municipality under the respective enabling provincial legislation for policing.
Please be specific in the idea you propose for action here. It’s tough to test against reality and the law otherwise.
TacticalTea
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With great power comes great responsibility. That same province having already shown to be severely derelict in this duty, it has no grounds to protest. That said, my criticism is directed at all levels of government. As you said, the police could just decide to do their job, but they won't. It has lasted for 6 months, why would it change now?
And we know they could, because Quebec did it in 2012 against a much less radical ideology.
It doesn't matter, this government won't do anything.
Let's be honest, here. If you wanted to fix the issue durably, you'd end the DEI cult, cut down 95% on migration, end federal and provincial funding for universities that propagate racist, anti-West "decolonial" ideologies, fire and prosecute teachers that indoctrinate minors with the idea that anti-White racism doesn't exist, and teach a positive vision of the country and its history in schools and media.
Naturally, none of that is ever going to happen in the constitutional construct that is modern "Canada", so it's just hilarious to see folks pretend that this is still a country, despite its leader himself declaring it wasn't anything more than a post-national state.
You can't fix this if you can't see the direct line from decolonialism to anti-Israel sentiment. It's a sociological issue long before it has anything to do with public order.
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Halifax Tar
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History shouldn't make anyone feel anything other than educated. History can also be corrupted. Be careful what history you ingest, and try to learn from multiple positions.
No body living today has any guilt for things they weren't alive for.
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