CADPAT for CIC

[2ltairparker]

Recently I was on course with fellow CIC officers, like most of our early training we are out in the field and occasionally we have to be scrutinized by the Reg force, while eating in their mess halls, or dining establishments.  A few of my counterparts were wearing the new CADPAT combats and were instructed that they couldn't wear them.  Someone in the dining hall had made some comment regarding why a CIC officer is wearing the combats.    I had to buy my combats at a local surplus store, they don't look all that great, and being the average size that I am, the pickings are mightly slim, so they aren't in the best condidtion.    I think that as an member, CIC, Reserve, or Regforce....we should all be allowed to wear the CADPAT.   

 

[Burrows]

Land CIC Members ARE Entitled to 2x Pants, Combat and 2x Tunic, Combat.  My officers recieved CADPAT when they went to the clothing stores. 

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/23398.0.html - CIC Scale of Issue

 

[combat_medic]

At whose expense? Whose training and equipment budget would cover the cost?

 

[Burrows]

If you were on a qualification course to become CIC then they might refuse you the right to wear them but as far as I know the Kit is paid for by DND and you are entitled to what is in the link.

 

[ctjj.stevenson]

Hi!

Seeing that I am a "navy type" I've only worn a CADPAT uniform for one weekend in my life, and that was because I was on my MOC(N) course, and we were permitted to have two sets as a temporary issue.

As I've stated many times in the past, I understand why CIC officers were not the first to get this uniform ... they had to be introduced to the people that needed them more urgently. However, now that CADPAT are the normal army operational uniform, Army CIC officers should have the right (and they do - at least here in Québec) to get them. CIC officers are CF officers, and are the most visiable representives of the Canadian Forces in most communities in Canada. Therefore, they should wear the Canadian Forces Uniform that is in vogue.

I beleive that it is unfortunate that members of the Primary Reserves or the Regular Forces then to mock the CIC. Okay, our job is not the same, and we do not have as much training as they do. But even do it is not our primary job to recruit people in the Canadian Forces, we are meant to be an example, and we can help young people that are interested in enroling.

I know that on the Navy side of the cadet world, we do have Navy League Cadets that exists, and they have officers that are not members of the Canadian Forces. However, they send their free time to work with even younger children. This should be respected, and not insulted (as I know some CIC officers would do towards them).

In closing, like General Hillard said, the CF is a family. We should respect each other as a good family does, and not spend our time insulting one another because of our jobs.

Good day!

 

[PViddy]

Sorry but CIC Members ARE Entitled to 2x Pants, Combat and 2x Tunic, Combat.  My officers recieved CADPAT when they went to the clothing stores. 
 

Wrong.  Only the Land element is entitled to be issued fatigues as the rules stand now, as that is their work dress uniform.

Unfortunately it often depends on what ASU supply you draw from as to what you will be issued regardless of elementa; affiliation.  Us air types purchase all of our own CF combat uniforms unless we were lucky enough to be issued them by fluke.


PV

 

[Burrows]

Ah... Sorry.. Corrected above post.

 

[badpup]

It is unfortunate for the Air and Sea elements, that CADPAT is not on your kit list. I do believe, that we should follow the example of the Americans, and develop and kit the Air and Sea with Elemental Combats. An aquantaince of mine is an  AME servicing F-15's in Florida, and absolutely loves the fact that the USAF now has an elemental combat uniform. Prior to the new issue, of those sharp looking Blue pattern BDU's he wore standard US Army issue Woodland, before that dress that was similar to our own phased out work dress uniform.

A note to those Air and Sea officers out there, you might well have to purchase them, and may not be entitled to have them issued, but as comissioned officers of the CF you DO have the right to wear them, so long as they are worn complete, and correctly.

 

[PViddy]

With the new CEMS project (airforce equivalent to clothe the soldier) program being implemented currently; the 3e work dress is, as i understand it, being replaced by the airforce cadpat uniform.  It is my pure speculation that a few years down the road, CIC air may see initial issue of CEMS cadpat as the 3e uniform is somthing we wear currently. rarely but non the less, it's issued.

i can only hope   


PV

 

[ctjj.stevenson]

As of my knowledge, Aviation CIC officers will be getting their combats A-SAP. Hopefully one day we navy CIC officer might get them because our Naval Combats in the woods does not make any sence (and this is why our FTX is always in civies for everyone).

If I become a gunnery officer this summer, I will probably have two pairs of CADPAT. I will wait and see.

Good day!

 

[amos933]

At whose expense? Whose training and equipment budget would cover the cost?

First of all, it won't be out of your pocket!!!!!!!!

Secondly, I'm tired of Reservist that think that every dollar spent on cadets is a dollar less spent on the Reserves. Cadet funding is out of a separate pocket, and if for some crazy reason cadets no longer existed that funding would be spent on other national youth programs. Just because the money falls under DND doesn't mean that it will be redistributed to the Reserves or even the Regular Forces for that matter.

 

[amos933]

Personally I feel the CF as a whole needs to show unity. Everyone should be entitled to the uniform(s) they require to fulfill there job requirements. This would include CADPAT being issued to all three elements of the CIC as Field Training is a mandatory requirement in the CCM.

That being said, there are priorities that must be meet. Kitting of all uniforms and equipment must follow an Operational priority. The Regular Forces are near completion of kitting CADPAT to those members requiring issue. Next step is to kit Reserve members with operational requirements and then so on until such time as the CIC is kitted.

 

[badpup]

With the new CEMS project (airforce equivalent to clothe the soldier) program being implemented currently; the 3e work dress is, as i understand it, being replaced by the airforce cadpat uniform.  It is my pure speculation that a few years down the road, CIC air may see initial issue of CEMS cadpat as the 3e uniform is somthing we wear currently. rarely but non the less, it's issued.

i can only hope   


PV

just so long as it doesn't take as long as the Issue of Elemental Uniforms when the CF was de-unified I know I was there  and even my abilities at playing the system in supply did not help at all.

 

[combat_medic]

amos933: I think you read my question and assumed it was a personal attack against you. You're quite mistaken. If you re-read it, you would see that it was a question that asked, if there was an entitlement for the CIC to wear CADPAT, who would be footing the bill?

A bit quick to jump to the gun for a relatively simple question.

Everyone should be entitled to the uniform(s) they require to fulfill there (sic) job requirements.

I don't need a shiny new uniform in order to fulfill my job requirements. I was just as able to do my job in olive drab as I am in cadpat.

 

[George Wallace]

Why is there a requirement for CIC to have CADPAT?  I personally think that they should not.  They are a youth organization, as are the Boy Scouts, the Boys and Girls Clubs, Guides, etc.  What real reason is there for a Youth Organization, even one partially sponsored by DND, to have CADPAT and uniforms like those of Regular and Reserve members?  They have their 'distinct' Cadet Uniforms.  What are the problems with that?  This whole conversation gives me the impression that they are a whole bunch of whining "Wanna Be's" and posers.    Geeesh!

 

[Burrows]

Well said George.

 

[badpup]

Why is there a requirement for CIC to have CADPAT?  I personally think that they should not.  They are a youth organization, as are the Boy Scouts, the Boys and Girls Clubs, Guides, etc.  What real reason is there for a Youth Organization, even one partially sponsored by DND, to have CADPAT and uniforms like those of Regular and Reserve members?  They have their 'distinct' Cadet Uniforms.  What are the problems with that?  This whole conversation gives me the impression that they are a whole bunch of whining "Wanna Be's" and posers.    Geeesh!

The cadets are members of that Youth organisation, the CIC are not.
Like it or not CIC Officers are Officers in the CF and do have a requirement for the elemental work dress which currently for land is CADPAT. I am not saying that CIC should be issued TAC vests ot other operational gear. Taken to the fullest extent why would a pencil pusher at NDHQ, or in a supply office somewhere have a need for CADPAT?

 

[PViddy]

They are a youth organization, as are the Boy Scouts, the Boys and Girls Clubs, Guides, etc.

Actually the CIC are the largest corps of Officers in the CF- not a youth org.  read, members of the CF.

 

[Da_man]

Well they arent really officers... even though we have to salute them, wich i find very stupid.

 

[Burrows]

You've got to be kidding me.

I second that.