Canada, U.S. ARCADE WARS

[ArcadeFire]

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=403d90d6-7a61-41ac-8cef-902a1d14879d&k=14984

I am not in the military and am new to Canadian Army Forums but was wondering what you guys think of this? I couldn't find a thread already started so I just made a new one. Do you think this a threat to Canadian Sovereignty? Since it would legally allow US Forces to come to Canada in the event of a "civil emergency" of some unspecified kind. They're calling it the civil assistance plan and saying that it would only be enacted with consent from the civilian leadership on either side. However, what if there is an ongoing threat of some kind to US interests here- like oil or water supply? The reason I'm asking you guys is you are the ones charged with defending our sovereignty so your opinions on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Could we end up with a permanent US presence on Canadian soil, and if so is that in our National interests? How about a North American Army? Would that make things easier for the defence of North America? I'm not saying that either is a bad idea, just askin for input.

 

[TCBF]

- Agreements like this are commonplace, they just get updated now and then.  If Dion was PM right now, the media would not even have reported it.

 

[ArcadeFire]

ahh, no one seems to have responded to the other posting of this topic.

Okay, the agreement may be commonplace, however, it still has implications. I don't think that because the agreement is not discussed by our politicians and enacted without much oversight means it has no consequences. I mean the scenario I outline that a time could come when the "threat" of a crisis is enough for our politicians to ask for help. What if there is some kind of ongoing threat that our leadership decides requires greater forces than our military  can provide? Maybe some new cold war type scenario since Russia is getting a bit nutty again. And what if the Americans just decide to stay? All we could really do is say, "please don't stay" because although man for man we are probably equal or better than US troops...they still have more men and firepower. We're just taking their word that they won't stay for as long as it takes them to decide the "emergency" is over. In a perfect world where politicians don't lie and foreign governments are our best friends maybe it would make sense but I'm not so sure from a Canadian perspective that this is in anyone's interests but theirs. Now if we are talking about establishing an actual North American Army then that's different. I mean really if you think about it if anything happened in the world requiring the US and Canada to join forces again we would basically be turned into NA Army anyway. Why not just join the forces under one umbrella? The sovereignty of Canada is pretty much non-existant anyways given the size of our neighbor. They could just take us by force at any time that they chose. So why not join forces? They "allow" us to maintain the impression of sovereignty as it is just so the Canadian people are happy, but really all our resources go south and if that were to stop for some reason, or be diverted to China, they would quickly have something to say about it. Playing devil's advocate (not totally seriously) I say why not just admit we have no sovereignty and make one NA Army? Would that be a bad idea? If so, why?

 

[1feral1]

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=403d90d6-7a61-41ac-8cef-902a1d14879d&k=14984

Do you think this a threat to Canadian Sovereignty?

Could we end up with a permanent US presence on Canadian soil, and if so is that in our National interests?

No, don't be silly.

 

[JBG]

The sovereignty of Canada is pretty much non-existant anyways given the size of our neighbor. They could just take us by force at any time that they chose. So why not join forces? They "allow" us to maintain the impression of sovereignty as it is just so the Canadian people are happy, but really all our resources go south and if that were to stop for some reason, or be diverted to China, they would quickly have something to say about it. Playing devil's advocate (not totally seriously) I say why not just admit we have no sovereignty and make one NA Army? Would that be a bad idea? If so, why?

I don't know where Canadians come to these kind of conclusions. Has Trudeau's fable of the elephant and the mouse permeated your media, schools and/or country?

The US is only a very reluctant occupier and empire builder. Perhaps, that's the problem in Iraq. The US has a revolutionary heritage and that does not mix well with being an occupying power.

 

[ArcadeFire]

I don't know where Canadians come to these kind of conclusions. Has Trudeau's fable of the elephant and the mouse permeated your media, schools and/or country?

The US is only a very reluctant occupier and empire builder. Perhaps, that's the problem in Iraq. The US has a revolutionary heritage and that does not mix well with being an occupying power.

Um...only because we give up our resources without a fight...sad but true. They have no need to take us over and Canada provides a lovely vacation spot after they messed up their own country so why not live and let live...for now. Just turn off the oil tap or the water and see how long we're best buds.....

Saddam and that Iranian guy tried that one....

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Any of you people worried about a US takeover need to pull out your credit card and visit this site:

http://www.ericisgreat.com/tinfoilhats/

 

[retiredgrunt45]

As the Honourable Mr. McKay told a member of the liberal party yesterday when this very subject was brought up during question period. I quote "Sir, your tin foil hats are getting really tight over there" Unquote. That pretty well ended the debate on the subject.

If the EU can do it why can't we? It just makes sense.

And to those who fear the great Satan from the south invading us for our resources. why? As long as there's mega money to be made from our resources, we will will keep on selling them and they will continue to buy them.  They already invaded us years ago. Most of the major corporations in Canada are already American owned and operated.

 

[ArcadeFire]

As the Honourable Mr. McKay told a member of the liberal party yesterday when this very subject was brought up during question period. I quote "Sir, your tin foil hats are getting really tight over there" Unquote. That pretty well ended the debate on the subject.

If the EU can do it why can't we? It just makes sense.

And to those who fear the great Satan from the south invading us for our resources. why? As long as there's mega money to be made from our resources, we will will keep on selling them and they will continue to buy them.  They already invaded us years ago. Most of the major corporations in Canada are already American owned and operated.

Exactly. So why not join "forces" as well. One North American Army consisting of primarily Mexicans.

 

[aesop081]

Exactly. So why not join "forces" as well. One North American Army consisting of primarily Mexicans.

Do you have a point or just out to make stupid comments ?

 

[JBG]

Um...only because we give up our resources without a fight...sad but true. They have no need to take us over and Canada provides a lovely vacation spot after they messed up their own country so why not live and let live...for now. Just turn off the oil tap or the water and see how long we're best buds.....

Saddam and that Iranian guy tried that one....

Is it most Canadians or only some that enjoy taking gratuitous potshots at the United States. How'd you like to have a neighbor like Syria or Lebanon over a 5000 Trudeau Unit border?

 

[ArcadeFire]

Is it most Canadians or only some that enjoy taking gratuitous potshots at the United States. How'd you like to have a neighbor like Syria or Lebanon over a 5000 Trudeau Unit border?

I'm just not naive. I believe that the US looks out for the US- not Canada. Anyone who believes otherwise has no business having anything to do with our National Security. IMO

 

[TCBF]

Exactly. So why not join "forces" as well. One North American Army consisting of primarily Mexicans.

- I have the greatest respect and admiration for Mexicans, as do many other posters here.  Would you care to explain your comment?

 

[ArcadeFire]

- I have the greatest respect and admiration for Mexicans, as do many other posters here.  Would you care to explain your comment?

If you haven't been reading the news lately approximately 10% of the population of Mexico now resides in the US. If there were a North Amecian Army under some kind of NA union then it would be largely staffed by Mexicans. I have the greatest respect for them as well- I don't remember saying otherwise? They take the jobs that most americans don't want, and that includes military jobs. The North American army could be massive and those in charge could lower the pay due to cheap labor from the South. One step at a time, that's where we're headed. Don't think so? Look at the European Union.  It worked for them!

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Arcadefire,

The Internet is a flat medium, so it is hard to tell when you are trying to be sarcastic/clever and when you are actually suggesting something that you mean.  Comparing Europe to North America in terms of a "union" is a stretch to say the least.

Collective security is just that and it is something that pragmatic Allies do to protect themselves against real threats to their sovereignty.

 

[aesop081]

Anyone who believes otherwise has no business having anything to do with our National Security. IMO

And what have you done for our national security lately ?

 

[FascistLibertarian]

What % of Canadians live in America?

 

[ArcadeFire]

What % of Canadians live in America?

Hey you're also a Libertarian. Have you heard of Ron Paul? I'm not sure about the percentage of Canadians living in the US. In any case though, Canadians would likely be taking higher paying tech jobs and such and not signing up for Service there, since they have a higher education level. So if there was a North American Army then as a percentage there would be alot more people from Mexico signing up. Although it's tough to say what would happen once it's a NA free for all for jobs and once we have a common currency.

 

[ArcadeFire]

And what have you done for our national security lately ?

I can't claim to have done much literally but I follow National Defence news and known what the government is up to as far as funding the Military goes, which is more than a lot of Canadians. Most just take it for granted. I just don't believe that someone concerned with our National Sercurity should ever trust any foreign power absolutely, that includes the US. Don't you agree?  Or do you think that they will and do always have our best interests, and not their own, at heart? Hear the expression "trust but verify"?

 

[George Wallace]

If you haven't been reading the news lately approximately 10% of the population of Mexico now resides in the US. If there were a North Amecian Army under some kind of NA union then it would be largely staffed by Mexicans. I have the greatest respect for them as well- I don't remember saying otherwise? They take the jobs that most americans don't want, and that includes military jobs. The North American army could be massive and those in charge could lower the pay due to cheap labor from the South. One step at a time, that's where we're headed. Don't think so? Look at the European Union.  It worked for them!

???

Where in the world did you come up with this idea?

Mexican citizens, ( not naturalized US Citizens) are not likely to serve in any capacity in the US military.  Puerto Rican and Mexican descendants who are all American citizens do serve in the US military.  The US does not have a Foreign Legion.