FELEX - Halifax Class Modernisation
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2 of the frigates (HMCS Halifax and HMCS Fredercton) are getting addtional Task force command features that currently only exist on Iroquois and Athabaskan. The biggest physical difference on the outside is the addtion of the 2 large communications domes on the hangar, which will sit on extensions under the aft fire control radar.
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Charlettown Due for refit April 1.
http://blog.halifaxshippingnews.ca/2013/02/felex-updates.html
http://blog.halifaxshippingnews.ca/2013/02/felex-updates.html
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So had HMCS Winnipeg just come out of FELIX? Then this collision. I hope the damage isn't too bad. Another article I read indicated that the Winnipeg had just undergone a massive refit and systems upgrade.
So, she was returned to the RCN on April 10th and then this happens. If you see the video it's quite a collision.
http://globalnews.ca/news/504436/u-s-fish-boat-collides-with-docked-navy-ship/
So, she was returned to the RCN on April 10th and then this happens. If you see the video it's quite a collision.
http://globalnews.ca/news/504436/u-s-fish-boat-collides-with-docked-navy-ship/
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Hmcs Halifax was tied up on the waterfront for Battle of the Atlantic Commemorations last weekend. I was able to get some close up photos
http://blog.halifaxshippingnews.ca/2013/05/hmcs-halifax-up-close-post-felex.html
http://blog.halifaxshippingnews.ca/2013/05/hmcs-halifax-up-close-post-felex.html
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Oldgateboatdriver
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Quote:
"As the Royal Canadian Navy undergoes its most extensive peacetime modernization in history, the 12 Canadian-built multi-role patrol frigates will continue to form the backbone of the fleet."
I underlined in yellow. My view: It would not have been even necessary to modernize at all if the government hadn't delayed the follow on program of SCSC's. Had they gone right into such program, as was recommended by the Navy, the first SCSC's would have come out around 2004-2005. After replacement of the last IRO around 2009, you would have kept on going to replace the oldest HAL as they got to about 20 years old. No need for any modernization program. You could even had put some of those HAL in reserve for five to ten years or sold them to less fortunate friendly navies, such as South American ones.
"As the Royal Canadian Navy undergoes its most extensive peacetime modernization in history, the 12 Canadian-built multi-role patrol frigates will continue to form the backbone of the fleet."
I underlined in yellow. My view: It would not have been even necessary to modernize at all if the government hadn't delayed the follow on program of SCSC's. Had they gone right into such program, as was recommended by the Navy, the first SCSC's would have come out around 2004-2005. After replacement of the last IRO around 2009, you would have kept on going to replace the oldest HAL as they got to about 20 years old. No need for any modernization program. You could even had put some of those HAL in reserve for five to ten years or sold them to less fortunate friendly navies, such as South American ones.
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Ahhh, you should never throw a challenge out like that:Occam said:
HMC Ships Anticosti and Moresby.
But, sadly, what you say is true. Not counting wartime ships, I think the only other one...ever, was the Tribal HMCS Micmac which was decommissioned just shy of 20 years. That was because of a collision in which her keel was bent though.
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Pat in Halifax said:
Doh...I probably should have been more specific. Anticosti and Moresby had more than 20 years of service (not all RCN) on their hulls when they were paid off, which is what I actually meant.
Some of the St.Laurent and Restigouche classes had fewer than 20 years on their hulls when they were paid off.
I think (and I'll have to confirm today at work) that the Halifax class was expected to have more than a 20-year service life - how much more, I can't recall.
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It is actually referred to as ELE - Estimated Life Expectancy and HAL (I am pretty sure) was 25-30. The issue up until IRO was not the hull but the combat system and it was never feasible to replace beyond obsolescence. Some of the STLs and follow on classes were actually in pretty sound shape mechanically when they decommissioned.
I remember doing a paper on this a couple years ago and the only non third-world country that kept ships around longer than us was the USN (USS Lexington for one-just shy of 50 years)
Oh, and only ST CROIX came close to less than 20 years service (15 Oct 54 – 15 Nov 74)
I remember doing a paper on this a couple years ago and the only non third-world country that kept ships around longer than us was the USN (USS Lexington for one-just shy of 50 years)
Oh, and only ST CROIX came close to less than 20 years service (15 Oct 54 – 15 Nov 74)
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That's the same figure I've seen - 25-30 years - but I'll be damned if I can find a reference this morning.
St.Laurent, Chaudiere, St.Croix, and Columbia were all commissioned fewer than 20 years. You're using laid-down dates, I looked at commissioning dates. Either way you look at it, they were pretty young compared to the long lives their sisters endured.
St.Laurent, Chaudiere, St.Croix, and Columbia were all commissioned fewer than 20 years. You're using laid-down dates, I looked at commissioning dates. Either way you look at it, they were pretty young compared to the long lives their sisters endured.
Oldgateboatdriver
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25 to 30 years is not a fast rule but a NATO average service time for the smaller ships (that is cruisers and smaller - 45 to 50 years for aircraft carriers and large phibs is pretty standard), with the Brits and American closer to 25 and the French and German closer to 30. All of this is, however without major redesign, like we do with our life extension programs all the time. The Brits tend to use ships for about 12 years in commission, then lay them up for a mid-life refit, where some aspects are modernized, but mostly all the machinery is taken apart and repaired/refurbished over a year, then go back in commission for another 10 to 12 years.
If, as I suggested (and was proposed by the Navy) we had started replacing the HAL's in 2010 (after replacing the IROs), and replaced them at a rate of one every 12 to14 months, the first ones would have been retired near 20 years of age - without the need for extensive life extension -and the last one would have been retired around 2023 after 27 years of service. The number of operationally available ships (15) would have been maintained throughout, with a reserve of 5 or 6 of the best retired HAL's on hand for a bit of quick expansion or replacement here and there as required due to long refits or major breakdown/accidents.
If, as I suggested (and was proposed by the Navy) we had started replacing the HAL's in 2010 (after replacing the IROs), and replaced them at a rate of one every 12 to14 months, the first ones would have been retired near 20 years of age - without the need for extensive life extension -and the last one would have been retired around 2023 after 27 years of service. The number of operationally available ships (15) would have been maintained throughout, with a reserve of 5 or 6 of the best retired HAL's on hand for a bit of quick expansion or replacement here and there as required due to long refits or major breakdown/accidents.
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I had a copy of the original SOR written in 1978. I'll see if I can find it.Occam said:
