Fitness for Operational Requirements of CAF Employment ( FORCE )

[Journeyman]

The standard will not change - it's been validated against the tasks that all CF members must be able to provide.

Breathe without assistance AND carry own tray at Mess Hall?! 

 

[dapaterson]

Breathe without assistance AND carry own tray at Mess Hall?!

You're confusing Commissionaires with CF.

The common military tasks are:

* Escape to cover
* Pickets and wire carry
* Sandbag fortification
* Picking & digging
* Vehicle extraction
* Stretcher carry

The FORCE test elements are strongly correlated with success at the common military tasks.  It's an applied sciene thing - you know, numbers, math, statistics - that kind of stuff...


(see https://www.cfmws.com/en/aboutus/psp/dfit/fitness/forceprogram/pages/cmtfe.aspx)

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I did FORCE for the first time last week.  A few comments:

1.  The PSP staff said incentive levels will be reintroduced.

2.  Like the EXPRES test, the FORCE test requirements will also have variations introduced for sex, age.  (stupid.  there is one standard when the SHTF and it doesn't care about your age or sex).

3.  Lastly, this is NOT a "combat fitness" test anymore than the EXPRES test was.  Thank unification, universality of service, whatever but it is what it is.  It is a test that is doable in terms of time and dollars that is "a decent predictor of a mbr's ability to do stuff". 

Personally, I think the standard is still low but the test is an improvement over EXPRES (which isn't saying much).

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Which is funny because a while ago on this thread I read that "The typical soldier is expected to be small and wirey"
I find that an old school mentality. Compare the Kit we would carry on a regular PP from more recent operations to those of past, we are carrying alot more.
We are becoming a more mobile force, more vehicles, faster vehicles, safer vehicles. The need to be able to run or march from here to the end of the earth is slowly going the way of the dinosaur.

You can't actually be serious?

If anything we need soldiers to be more physically fit then they have been in the past as modern technology has made things move a lot quicker and warfare is far more dynamic.  Take recent operations conducted by the French in Mali, I harp on this topic a lot but with the new Force 2021 model and our move towards Adaptive Dispersed Operations, we need soldiers to be more fit then ever, especially with our military wanting to be more focused on conducting expeditionary operations.  I think the way the french fought in Mali is exactly how we want to conduct future operations.

 

[Transporter]

Having completed the FORCE test recently, my general observation (other than what I mentioned earlier) is that it seems to be more focused on physical strength versus aerobic fitness, whereas i think the EXPRESS test was the other way. So, if you're a gym guy/gal, you'll probably like this test better. If you're predominantly a runner, you'll likely prefer the EXPRESS test. Either way though, most shouldn't have a problem.

 

[daftandbarmy]

You're confusing Commissionaires with CF.

The common military tasks are:

* Escape to cover
* Pickets and wire carry
* Sandbag fortification
* Picking & digging
* Vehicle extraction
* Stretcher carry

The FORCE test elements are strongly correlated with success at the common military tasks.  It's an applied sciene thing - you know, numbers, math, statistics - that kind of stuff...


(see https://www.cfmws.com/en/aboutus/psp/dfit/fitness/forceprogram/pages/cmtfe.aspx)

Those tasks seem defensive or 'run away and lick your wounds' focused.

Looks like they missed the most basic, and important, common military task:

Close with and destroy the enemy 

:nod:

 

[JorgSlice]

Those tasks seem defensive or 'run away and lick your wounds' focused.

Looks like they missed the most basic, and important, common military task:

Close with and destroy the enemy Double-Doubles

:nod:

FTFY

 

[OldSolduer]

Those tasks seem defensive or 'run away and lick your wounds' focused.

Looks like they missed the most basic, and important, common military task:

Close with and destroy the enemy 

:nod:

Agreed.

 

[Tank Troll]

Close with and destroy the enemy is only important to be able to do for a very low percentage of the CAF. So that should be a speciality training for those that need it. Like balance and load a 50 lb round while spinning around in close confined spaces is for others.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Close with and destroy the enemy is only important to be able to do for a very low percentage of the CAF. So that should be a speciality training for those that need it. Like balance and load a 50 lb round while spinning around in close confined spaces is for others.

Or a sonobuoy/other ord, and throw in bouncing around off a sea state a few hundred feet off the deck/pulling a few Gs that make your X lb's of ord go to XX, XXX in a flash all the while NOT dropping that sandwich you just made. 

* critical component(s) are highlighted in yellow.


In all seriousness though, the new test does apply to some things we actually do:

- In my primary job, the sandbag lift kind of ties in to the loading of ordnance, so some relevance there.  Check.
- the sandbag casualty bag ties into dragging a wounded crewmember down the tac tube to a ditching station, so some relevance there.

I know some people have mentioned the tiny person who struggles with the casualty drag and question its validity in todays world.  For me, this one matters.  If we wet ditch and I eat a console or something and am out cold, that 80lb person might end up having to drag my 220lbs carcass down the tac tube that is filling up with water and likely nosing in.  If they can't, I don't get out and my wife gets a Memorial Cross.  There doesn't have to be a war going on for that to happen, its a possibility every time you go up.  The standard for the drag, IMO and world, should be the weight of the heaviest person on Sqn who works in the tube. 

 

[darknsmelly]

i'll be taking my FORCE evaluation on the 28th of this month. if the standards are any different than what's been posted, i'll give an update.

 

[PuckChaser]

Not sure if it was posted here previously, but as of 1 Apr 2014, if you do not have a valid FORCE completion on file, you are not allowed to participate in the CAF Sports Program (regional/national sports). I hadn't heard this policy before for the EXPRES, but its a good change to ensure those 1% who are "hurt" and can't do a PT test but can play softball/hockey etc.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Not sure if it was posted here previously, but as of 1 Apr 2014, if you do not have a valid FORCE completion on file, you are not allowed to participate in the CAF Sports Program (regional/national sports). I hadn't heard this policy before for the EXPRES, but its a good change to ensure those 1% who are "hurt" and can't do a PT test but can play softball/hockey etc.

Not that I doubt you, but is this a CANFORGEN, LFCO, or something?  Didn't hear anything yet...

 

[PuckChaser]

Not that I doubt you, but is this a CANFORGEN, LFCO, or something?  Didn't hear anything yet...

When I'm back to work Monday, I'll grab the document. Wasn't in the form of anything like that, came from PSP to the unit Sports O.

 

[MJP]

Not sure if it was posted here previously, but as of 1 Apr 2014, if you do not have a valid FORCE completion on file, you are not allowed to participate in the CAF Sports Program (regional/national sports). I hadn't heard this policy before for the EXPRES, but its a good change to ensure those 1% who are "hurt" and can't do a PT test but can play softball/hockey etc.

I think that is an excellent idea.  I have always wondered how a person unable to do the basic pt test was able to continue playing sports to their hearts content.

 

[Haggis]

1.  The PSP staff said incentive levels will be reintroduced.

Not surprising.

2.  Like the EXPRES test, the FORCE test requirements will also have variations introduced for sex, age.  (stupid.  there is one standard when the SHTF and it doesn't care about your age or sex).

I daresay your PSP are mistaken.  The CMFTE "the Gold Standard of CAF Fitness" makes no allowances for gender or age.  Never did.

You're bang on.  The 20 kg ammo box (Army), keg of rum (Navy) or suitcase (Air Force) doesn't get any lighter as you age. 

 

[Franko]

Did it last week. Definitely requires some tweeking with tighter timelines to take into account for age.

Pretty bad when I beat a guy half my age in every activity. It wasn't by a little bit either.

Regards

 

[daftandbarmy]

Close with and destroy the enemy is only important to be able to do for a very low percentage of the CAF. So that should be a speciality training for those that need it. Like balance and load a 50 lb round while spinning around in close confined spaces is for others.

"We're not the public service of Canada. We're not just another department. We are the Canadian Forces, and our job is to be able to kill people."

The Big Cod

 

[Tank Troll]

"We're not the public service of Canada. We're not just another department. We are the Canadian Forces, and our job is to be able to kill people."

The Big Cod

That is the roll of the infantry, it is not every on else's roll. It would not make sense for a hard Navy trade to train to do that. The test is the basic fitness level. If your trade or branch wants/needs some thing more then have at it.

 

[Bird_Gunner45]

Reading this blog led me to this conclusion-