Global Warming/Climate Change Super Thread

[Fishbone Jones]

Really, because he hasn't done one iota to change my mind.

Oh yeah, I forgot: I'm mentally inept, easily deceived, and a lemming.

Good thing there is the ignore button.

I don't think many, if any, change their minds on climate. No matter the discussion. People just won't do it.
Either you are a man made climate denier or a supporter. People are entrenched. They believe whatever science supports their position, and both have their science. I've been called all sorts of things here for my stances. Most recently a flat earther. I learned a long time ago, the more you try to defend your position, the more alienated you become, especially if you are in a minority stance. Nobody here has convinced me to become a supporter, simply because the data they use is different than mine. I also distrust the experts like Gore, Kerry, Thunberg, or anyone else that flys into Davos in private jets. People believe their professionals, I believe the scientists and experts on my side. I don't get into discussions about percents, graphs, papers and causes because you could type a tome about why or why not. It will be dismissed out of hand before it gets read because it doesn't fit someone's preferred narrative and it comes from the other side.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Get China, India and the US onboard and I am in.

View attachment 84409

Good luck with that.

 

[suffolkowner]

I don't think many, if any, change their minds on climate. No matter the discussion. People just won't do it.
Either you are a man made climate denier or a supporter. People are entrenched. They believe whatever science supports their position, and both have their science. I've been called all sorts of things here for my stances. Most recently a flat earther. I learned a long time ago, the more you try to defend your position, the more alienated you become, especially if you are in a minority stance. Nobody here has convinced me to become a supporter, simply because the data they use is different than mine. I also distrust the experts like Gore, Kerry, Thunberg, or anyone else that flys into Davos in private jets. People believe their professionals, I believe the scientists and experts on my side. I don't get into discussions about percents, graphs, papers and causes because you could type a tome about why or why not. It will be dismissed out of hand before it gets read because it doesn't fit someone's preferred narrative and it comes from the other side.

I dont think Gore, Kerry or Thunberg are experts but activists

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I dont think Gore, Kerry or Thunberg are experts but activists

Experts or activists. It doesn't matter. People don't make that distinction. If they say it's so, it becomes religious to some. I think they're grifters and carpetbaggers.

 

[lenaitch]

I notice that the article references more natural gas plants for Ontario.

Perhaps. I was just highlighting the fact that energy, including electrical, can be stored.

 

[OldSolduer]

Is the climate changing? Yes and it will forever
Do we have anything to do with it? Yes - we always have
Can we do something about it? Yes - and it should not be too painful.
Are there charlatans on both sides? yes there are.

 

[Kirkhill]

Perhaps. I was just highlighting the fact that energy, including electrical, can be stored.

I'm afraid that I am not persuaded that batteries are as efficient a method of storing energy as a lump of coal or a bucket of bitumen.

 

[OldSolduer]

I'm afraid that I am not persuaded that batteries are as efficient a method of storing energy as a lump of coal or a bucket of bitumen.

with an attitude like that, young man, a lump of coal is what you'll get for Christmas....except in 20 years that might be a great gift.

 

[daftandbarmy]

with an attitude like that, young man, a lump of coal is what you'll get for Christmas....except in 20 years that might be a great gift.

Especially BC coal!

Which China buys so they can make the stuff we buy from car dealerships, Amazon etc


Coal mining is a major industry in British Columbia. Coal production employs thousands of people and coal sales generate billions of dollars in annual revenue. Coal production currently represents over half of the total mineral production revenues in the province.

Over 95 per cent of coal currently produced in BC is metallurgical coal, which is used in the production of steel from iron ore. The province also produces some thermal coal. Most BC coal is exported internationally via coal ports on the west coast near Vancouver and Prince Rupert. A smaller percentage is sent by rail to steel mills in eastern Canada.

Overview of coal in BC

Overview of coal and coal geology in British Columbia

www2.gov.bc.ca

 

[lenaitch]

I'm afraid that I am not persuaded that batteries are as efficient a method of storing energy as a lump of coal or a bucket of bitumen.

Be that as it may, you said it can't, I pointed out that it can.

 

[Good2Golf]

Climate warrior Jane Goodall isn't sold on carbon taxes and electric vehicles — CBC News

World-renowned primatologist and climate activist Jane Goodall says carbon pricing schemes like the one Canada has deployed aren't a silver bullet to solve the pressing threat of climate change.

apple.news

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Climate warrior Jane Goodall isn't sold on carbon taxes and electric vehicles — CBC News

World-renowned primatologist and climate activist Jane Goodall says carbon pricing schemes like the one Canada has deployed aren't a silver bullet to solve the pressing threat of climate change.

apple.news

Well, she is an expert on chimpanzees after all.

 

[ArmyRick]

I dont think Gore, Kerry or Thunberg are experts but activists

Michael E. Mann and his fraudulent graph hockey stick graph need to own a lot of the blame on the global misdirection. Even his own peers (other physicist, geologist, meteorologist, etc) called his research as faulty when it first came out and they still do.

However certain opportunist jumped right on that and have derailed the global thinking into hyper focus only on carbon emissions from fossil fuels (and cows, blame cows, the only ruminants apparently to belch harmless CH4)

 

[suffolkowner]

Michael E. Mann and his fraudulent graph hockey stick graph need to own a lot of the blame on the global misdirection. Even his own peers (other physicist, geologist, meteorologist, etc) called his research as faulty when it first came out and they still do.

However certain opportunist jumped right on that and have derailed the global thinking into hyper focus only on carbon emissions from fossil fuels (and cows, blame cows, the only ruminants apparently to belch harmless CH4)

Michael Mann's study is the most replicated in the history of science

 

[ArmyRick]

Michael Mann's study is the most replicated in the history of science

And many reputable scientist have called it out as poor science with little to no accounting for so many variables (many beyond human control). Its still a very flawed study.

 

[suffolkowner]

And many reputable scientist have called it out as poor science with little to no accounting for so many variables (many beyond human control). Its still a very flawed study.

Which studies? Mann's original or the over 2000 that have been done since? To even reference Mann is ridiculous, why not Osman?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Is the climate changing? Yes and it will forever
Do we have anything to do with it? Yes - we always have
Can we do something about it? Yes - and it should not be too painful.
Are there charlatans on both sides? yes there are.

Which studies? Mann's original or the over 2000 that have been done since? To even reference Mann is ridiculous, why not Osman?

Thanks for validating my point guys.

 

[FSTO]

Hey the University of PEI Ag department has made an amazing discovery! Mixed Farming with cows in the rotation helps with soil health and sequestering carbon. Isn't that fantastic?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-cropping-grazing-climate-change-1.7171206

 

[ArmyRick]

Which studies? Mann's original or the over 2000 that have been done since? To even reference Mann is ridiculous, why not Osman?

You can do 10,000 studies where you pick up an orange and drop it to see if gravity works and 10,000 times it will be replicated.

There are numerous problems with his studies, here are some key points
-WHERE and at WHAT altitude temperatures are recorded makes a huge difference (Record daily temperatures inside of a large city or 30 minutes away in a rural countryside will throw you completely different results meaning man made infrastructure such as concrete and buildings changes recordings, also recording temps as ground or at 10,000 or 30,000 feet makes a difference)
-What carbon is generated by man made technology and what carbon is natural emissions? There is no way to break it down which is which. At best we can do a statistical estimation on the technology we control and know those numbers
-Methane has so many sources yet cows are fucking blamed over and over again. Its a nothing burger anyways because of how it breaks down into water and atmospheric carbon
-Water vapors in the atmosphere have a far greater impact on weather than the hyper focus on the element carbon (and man kind way over focuses on it)
-How much carbon, H2O, sulfur, etc is blasted into the atmosphere from wild fires, volcanoes, meteor impacts, land slides, etc. No one knows exactly
-If weather can not be accurately predicted for the next 2 weeks but climate alarmist (who get huge grants BTW) can predict when the next cataclysmic climate event is going to occur? Bullshit
-LOTS of money in the climate alarmist business
-The atmospheric temps and carbon levels panic graph can be replicated many, many times over in the past from the days the dinosaurs ended up until now.

The studies are flawed and even worse, have lots of financial backing.

Man kind does cause pollution and carbon emissions. But some of the alternatives are even worse. You don't cure a mosquito itch by blasting it with a shotgun.

We live in a damn cold country and one way or another we need to generate energy for transportation and heat source. People piss themselves in fear at the word "nuclear power" (fuck I don't why) and unfortunately fossil fuels are rather cleaner than most of the alternatives presented. Or fuck it, lets evict 99% of the population OUT of Canada.

We need real solutions that are put into practice with a proper audit (full audit) and course corrections as necessary, no more hyperbole or cult bullshit.

 

[suffolkowner]

You can do 10,000 studies where you pick up an orange and drop it to see if gravity works and 10,000 times it will be replicated.

There are numerous problems with his studies, here are some key points
-WHERE and at WHAT altitude temperatures are recorded makes a huge difference (Record daily temperatures inside of a large city or 30 minutes away in a rural countryside will throw you completely different results meaning man made infrastructure such as concrete and buildings changes recordings, also recording temps as ground or at 10,000 or 30,000 feet makes a difference)

land temperature stations record temperatures at 2m

-What carbon is generated by man made technology and what carbon is natural emissions? There is no way to break it down which is which. At best we can do a statistical estimation on the technology we control and know those numbers

you can isolate Carbon sources by isotopes

-Methane has so many sources yet cows are fucking blamed over and over again. Its a nothing burger anyways because of how it breaks down into water and atmospheric carbon

we are measuring point source methane emissions from satellites now

-Water vapors in the atmosphere have a far greater impact on weather than the hyper focus on the element carbon (and man kind way over focuses on it)

water vapour is a feedback

-How much carbon, H2O, sulfur, etc is blasted into the atmosphere from wild fires, volcanoes, meteor impacts, land slides, etc. No one knows exactly

the difference is the difference, all these continue to be measured and accounted for there is literally tons of work being done on this everyday

-If weather can not be accurately predicted for the next 2 weeks but climate alarmist (who get huge grants BTW) can predict when the next cataclysmic climate event is going to occur? Bullshit

long term events have always been easier to measure this is documented. What cataclysmic climate events are you talking about?

-LOTS of money in the climate alarmist business

Oil companies are lacking money?

-The atmospheric temps and carbon levels panic graph can be replicated many, many times over in the past from the days the dinosaurs ended up until now.

i dont see how this helps your argument

The studies are flawed and even worse, have lots of financial backing.

still waiting for a refutation to stand the test of time

Man kind does cause pollution and carbon emissions. But some of the alternatives are even worse. You don't cure a mosquito itch by blasting it with a shotgun.

alternatives to what? alternative to burning carbon? Your opposition to specific policy suggestions have nothing to do with the evidence

We live in a damn cold country and one way or another we need to generate energy for transportation and heat source. People piss themselves in fear at the word "nuclear power" (fuck I don't why) and unfortunately fossil fuels are rather cleaner than most of the alternatives presented. Or fuck it, lets evict 99% of the population OUT of Canada.

Again irrelevant to the evidence

We need real solutions that are put into practice with a proper audit (full audit) and course corrections as necessary, no more hyperbole or cult bullshit.

what is the hyperbole and cult bullshit? How can you determine what is what?