Hk416 to Direct Impingment

[KevinB]

Cobra-6 and I (well my son to but he did not take much part in the discussion) where discussing the Hk416 on the way back to Ottawa yesterday - along with where or not I should set him up with my GF's sister.

His comment after watching MG34 strip the gun and see it carbon free (chamber/bolt and botl carrier) was that it is like the Staples "Easy" button -- and came up with the great Hk commerical too.
  If you think the system needs to be cleaned maybe evvery 15-20k of rounds -- how much time does that save troops, recruits etc?
Where we can do valueable training in its place, yes I know cleaning can be used to teach attention to detail -- but we get the troops so caught up in it - that cleaners are used that are harmful to the weapon lifespan -- and items are cleaned that actually damage the weapon.  Rather 15min of kim's games that 15 min of wasted cleaning.

We had officers, NCO's and has beens, and background from SOF to reservists, 20+ years to 18months and all enjoyed the Hk coolaid and wanted to deploy with it...

 

[TCBF]

...-- but we get the troops so caught up in it - that cleaners are used that are harmful to the weapon lifespan -- and items are cleaned that actually damage the weapon.  ...

- I've always said that we wore out more weapons from cleaning than we did from shooting.

 

[MG34]

The HK Kool Aid was drunk in volumes, thanks for the chance. I still feel that the HK system is more suited to a specialized role and there is a place for DI rifles, but afte4r seeing a couple in action and more importantly afterwards I can say I have not seen a more reliable system yet.

 

[KevinB]

true - we agree that it does not make sence to throw out a working rifle/carbine

However if your buying new guns or replacement guns -- the Hk416 series will also last 3-4x as long (bolt life - not so much barrel with the C7 and C8 being CHF'd as well, but other heat affected components).

 

[Tuukka]

The factory M4 weapons are good, reliable weapons that continue to serve around the world.

But if the HK416 is an available option, it is a worthwhile update.

I also agree with the benefits mentioned here and elsewhere in professional discussions.

My experiences with the HK416 so far have been extremely good, both reliability and accuracy wise.

Regarding the accuracy, on the last range trip I got on average 3.5 cm - 4.5 cm ( 1.2 MOA - 1.6 MOA ) at 100 meters with the 10" upper receiver. Ammuntion was Sako 62 gr SP.

At 150 meters I had a better support and the same ammo shot c. 1.1 MOA.

There will be much more rounds fired in the coming months and I would say that even the 10" upper has potential for more, but that kind of accuracy is good enough for that particular configurations.

 

[xavier]

Kevin

When you cleaned your barrels, what did you use?


Thanks!

xavier

 

[KevinB]

I use MPro-7 cleaner.  1) It was the one McMillan recommended for the Tac-50's when the ealier ones where suffering throat cracking - and 2) It is available from Brownels in a nice kit that they can mail (unlike most other cleaners), and I need mail transport boing where I am.

 

[xavier]

Kevin:
Thanks! That's very helpful to now.
Quick question: how long does it take to install the barrels to the lower receiver?

Thanks again!
xavier

 

[chanman]

true - we agree that it does not make sence to throw out a working rifle/carbine

However if your buying new guns or replacement guns -- the Hk416 series will also last 3-4x as long (bolt life - not so much barrel with the C7 and C8 being CHF'd as well, but other heat affected components).

A few months late, but I don't suppose it would be politically feasible to sell the existing uppers to civilians as milsurps and use the proceeds to partially finance buying 416 uppers, would it?

Do the 416 lowers differ significantly from other AR-15 lowers in any way?

 

[KevinB]

The CF could sell the uppers via Crown Assets - and if done in dribs and drabs could likley more than finance the purchases.


  The Hk416 mag well is not shaped the same and it wont take PMAGS due to its unusual bevel

The Hk417 lower and upper are proprietarial, and they cant be swapped - but the Hk416 and Hk418 (6.8x43mm SPC uppers) can drop on any mil spec lower, or any in tolerance civy lower

 

[chanman]

The CF could sell the uppers via Crown Assets - and if done in dribs and drabs could likley more than finance the purchases.

Looking at some of the AR-15 threads on CGN, I wouldn't find that surprising at all.