medicineman
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I would suspect it was more of a gargling/gurgling sound...
Missing Titanic Sub
- Thread starter Halifax Tar
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Booter
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More likely- “that’s weird…” followed by a gauge tap
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Honestly when the tube failed (can’t really say imploded as unlike metals it doesn’t deform and ‘crinkle’ like a crushed can) there would have been water rushing in and everything subject to almost 400x the pressure at sea level the air in the tube would have gone up but at .25% the volume it was when the tube was intact. Lungs, heart, brain etc all crushed to pulp - I suspect they had a few milliseconds, so time to register a noise and movement and then nothing.
FormerHorseGuard
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I think it would be like this
but not an expert
but not an expert
daftandbarmy
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Even faster than that - and Carbon Fiber failures at pressure are fairly dramatic-
For those who want to nerd out.
Note:
For thick composite pressure shells, there was still a lack of effective theoretical methods to predict critical buckling loads. The effects of shell defects formed by different processes, composite layer structure and thickness ratio on shell nonlinear buckling require further study.
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Not really. While the rapid compression of the air would generate heat, the water would also be sucking all of that heat out as it crushed the air bubble to 1/4 of a % of its initial volume. The water is around 2 degrees C at those depths.
I’m not at my computer to run any numbers on failure analysis atm - but based on some rough math, it would have taken less then .0025 of a second for the water to displace all the air at that depth.
medicineman
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I shouldn't laugh, but I did...out loud...in my office...with the door open
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They took their website offline now.
OldSolduer
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At this point it doesn't really matter to the average person WRT technicalities.
They died a very quick death, and possibly never knew what happened.
For the next asshole that tries this maybe someone should smack some sense into them.
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Doubt…
Based on James Cameron’s comments he knew about the implosion/failure on Monday.
The USN knew at the time of the incident on Sunday.
So there was almost 5 days of wasted efforts when all that needed to be done was send a RoV to the site to verify the debris field.
5 days that we debated telling the public (due to the nature of the sensors used) and both other USG entities (mainly the USCG) and Allies that they needn’t waste resources.
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apparently on the twitter the submersible was supposed to be derated due to repeated dives and the threat of delamination. Also bought expired resin from Boeing?
medicineman
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Can't see why...though HR are gonna HR.
daftandbarmy
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The Spectator weighs in....
When the news broke that the Titan submersible was missing, naval experts immediately recognised that the chances of saving the lives of those on board were, realistically, tantamount to non-existent.
With rare agreement, they swiftly concluded that the kindest outcome for the five passengers would be that the submersible had imploded.
Hard-hearted as this may sound, their deaths were vastly preferable to the terrifying demise of gradually suffocating in a cold, inky darkness
Ruptured parts of Titan’s titanium end caps found yesterday, mere metres from Titanic’s wreck, show that the vehicle did suffer from an abrupt, catastrophic hull collapse.
It may be that those on board were aware of a problem. But they would have had no inkling that death was imminent – the implosion would have taken far less than a second.
Given that Titan had by then dived to nearly 3,800m, the weight of sea water would have generated pressure of at least 5,500 pounds per square inch, meaning that their bodies will have almost undoubtedly been instantly decimated. It’s the grimmest of deaths, not least for families left with nothing to bury.
But hard-hearted as this may sound, it was vastly preferable to the terrifying demise of gradually suffocating in a cold, inky darkness.
One third of Royal Navy submariners perished during WW2, many of whom drowned in similar conditions and have no graves. The Senior Service knows many of these sailors suffered before death; it’s one of the reasons why they are deferentially referred to as being ‘on eternal patrol’.
It became clear as we neared the deadline for Titan’s oxygen supply running out that searchers were shifting their goal from rescue to recovery. Retrieving Titan’s remains from the seabed will cost millions but should yield some clues to its ending. It is possible that stress sensors on the hull might have been triggered and, if so, perhaps this information was retrieved. But OceanGate Expeditions has so far been mute about what it knows.
The search and rescue team believes that Titan imploded several hours after diving on Sunday, and it’s emerged that the US Navy picked up sounds of the suspected accident at a similar time to when communications with the submersible cut out.
The American Navy has had sensors on the coast for several decades. During the second world war, German U boats mounted Operation Drumbeat, which saw its submarines successfully attack America’s east coast. One boat even surfaced close enough to New York to see the city’s lights on the horizon. This led the US Navy to develop a classified early warning system, with seabed sensors installed along the coastline to pick up any future enemy submarines.
A more modern version of this, called the Integrated Undersea Surveillance System (IUSS), is now in place and, given the effectiveness of sea water as a conduit for sound, is very likely to have a recording of the submersible’s brief death rattle.
The Navy’s report into the incident will be extremely detailed – but also probably subject to classification.
IUSS successfully detected the implosion of the Argentine submarine ARA San Juan in November 2017 and was able to pinpoint not only its exact position, but that water entered her at 1,800 mph and the pressure hull collapsed in four milliseconds.
The Naval Intelligence lead analyst concluded: ‘They did not drown or experience pain. Death was instantaneous.’
The US Navy is currently being slated for not revealing what it knew about Titan’s collapse during the rescue – but it deems operational security far more important than releasing sensitive information into the public domain. It will also have given the coast guard as much information as possible.
Other questions still remain though about the quality of the Titan vehicle and OceanGate’s decision to desist from regulatory oversight. Compared to other well-established deep sea operators, bristling with sophisticated tech, the Titan seemed very rudimentary. This set alarm bells ringing for specialists years ago. Submitting Titan to independent scrutiny would not only have allowed proper assessment of its design but, crucially, meant that the submersible had a strict, clearly-defined maintenance programme.
The explicit reason why the UK built four Trident Vanguard-class submarines was to allow for periods when the boats could be painstakingly maintained and brought back to the standard required for another patrol.
Admirals are all too aware that submarine and warship hulls degrade from being submerged and endlessly hit by waves – this is why some Type 23 frigates are currently being retired early.
Surely OceanGate must have been aware of this cyclic degradation – but did they properly test and research it?
Perhaps Titan had a black box, which can be recovered and we’ll eventually learn more. More likely it didn’t and these latest Titanic deaths will generate another enduring mystery. What’s abundantly clear already, though, is that these five deaths were utterly avoidable.
The Titan deaths were utterly avoidable | The Spectator
The Titan deaths were utterly avoidable
When the news broke that the Titan submersible was missing, naval experts immediately recognised that the chances of saving the lives of those on board were, realistically, tantamount to non-existent.
With rare agreement, they swiftly concluded that the kindest outcome for the five passengers would be that the submersible had imploded.
Hard-hearted as this may sound, their deaths were vastly preferable to the terrifying demise of gradually suffocating in a cold, inky darkness
Ruptured parts of Titan’s titanium end caps found yesterday, mere metres from Titanic’s wreck, show that the vehicle did suffer from an abrupt, catastrophic hull collapse.
It may be that those on board were aware of a problem. But they would have had no inkling that death was imminent – the implosion would have taken far less than a second.
Given that Titan had by then dived to nearly 3,800m, the weight of sea water would have generated pressure of at least 5,500 pounds per square inch, meaning that their bodies will have almost undoubtedly been instantly decimated. It’s the grimmest of deaths, not least for families left with nothing to bury.
But hard-hearted as this may sound, it was vastly preferable to the terrifying demise of gradually suffocating in a cold, inky darkness.
One third of Royal Navy submariners perished during WW2, many of whom drowned in similar conditions and have no graves. The Senior Service knows many of these sailors suffered before death; it’s one of the reasons why they are deferentially referred to as being ‘on eternal patrol’.
It became clear as we neared the deadline for Titan’s oxygen supply running out that searchers were shifting their goal from rescue to recovery. Retrieving Titan’s remains from the seabed will cost millions but should yield some clues to its ending. It is possible that stress sensors on the hull might have been triggered and, if so, perhaps this information was retrieved. But OceanGate Expeditions has so far been mute about what it knows.
The search and rescue team believes that Titan imploded several hours after diving on Sunday, and it’s emerged that the US Navy picked up sounds of the suspected accident at a similar time to when communications with the submersible cut out.
The American Navy has had sensors on the coast for several decades. During the second world war, German U boats mounted Operation Drumbeat, which saw its submarines successfully attack America’s east coast. One boat even surfaced close enough to New York to see the city’s lights on the horizon. This led the US Navy to develop a classified early warning system, with seabed sensors installed along the coastline to pick up any future enemy submarines.
A more modern version of this, called the Integrated Undersea Surveillance System (IUSS), is now in place and, given the effectiveness of sea water as a conduit for sound, is very likely to have a recording of the submersible’s brief death rattle.
The Navy’s report into the incident will be extremely detailed – but also probably subject to classification.
IUSS successfully detected the implosion of the Argentine submarine ARA San Juan in November 2017 and was able to pinpoint not only its exact position, but that water entered her at 1,800 mph and the pressure hull collapsed in four milliseconds.
The Naval Intelligence lead analyst concluded: ‘They did not drown or experience pain. Death was instantaneous.’
The US Navy is currently being slated for not revealing what it knew about Titan’s collapse during the rescue – but it deems operational security far more important than releasing sensitive information into the public domain. It will also have given the coast guard as much information as possible.
Other questions still remain though about the quality of the Titan vehicle and OceanGate’s decision to desist from regulatory oversight. Compared to other well-established deep sea operators, bristling with sophisticated tech, the Titan seemed very rudimentary. This set alarm bells ringing for specialists years ago. Submitting Titan to independent scrutiny would not only have allowed proper assessment of its design but, crucially, meant that the submersible had a strict, clearly-defined maintenance programme.
The explicit reason why the UK built four Trident Vanguard-class submarines was to allow for periods when the boats could be painstakingly maintained and brought back to the standard required for another patrol.
Admirals are all too aware that submarine and warship hulls degrade from being submerged and endlessly hit by waves – this is why some Type 23 frigates are currently being retired early.
Surely OceanGate must have been aware of this cyclic degradation – but did they properly test and research it?
Perhaps Titan had a black box, which can be recovered and we’ll eventually learn more. More likely it didn’t and these latest Titanic deaths will generate another enduring mystery. What’s abundantly clear already, though, is that these five deaths were utterly avoidable.
The Titan deaths were utterly avoidable | The Spectator
medicineman
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It took a whole page to say "DUH!!!???" ?
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Probably didn’t have time too. Carbon-fiber fails catastrophically in *most cases. 2-3msec implosion at that depth. Human brain itself takes ~20msec to register something. They didn’t even know it. For reference, the pressure was close to 2 tonnes/sq.in.
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BLEVE
Toronto propane explosion - Wikipedia
If they ever send you to one,
BLEVE – Response and Prevention
Awareness material (alerts, advisory notices and publications) has been produced by the TDG Directorate to assist individuals in complying with the Transport Dangerous Goods Regulations
Blackadder1916
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