Primary Reserve List (PRL)

[Gunner98]

The PRL is one way that the HS world hoped/s to attract or at least retain ties to "specialist" pers - especially for filling some operational taskings for Role 2+ or 3 taskings.   It in some ways admits that the Med Ops side of things needs only 14 days per year of maintenance employment or training. Which is somewhat better than sending civilian specialists into theatre with little "militarization" as we are doing now:

http://www.forces.gc.ca/health/recruiting/engraph/about_prl_e.asp?Lev1=3&Lev2=2&Lev3=2

Excerpt:

The CFHS Primary Reserve will be comprised of formed units with role specific supplementary and/or complementary mission elements and a Primary Reserve List (PRL).

The CFHS is experiencing difficulties in its ability to attract, train and retain personnel with highly specialized health services skills. These specific skill sets are, for the most part, those necessary to provide the role 3 medical capability. This role has historically been the sole domain of the regular force, with individual medical augmentees being provided from traditional role 1 and 2 medical reserve units. Building a pool of already highly qualified medical professionals, within the reserves, to address both the existing augmentation shortages and the development of a future reserve role 3 medical capability is seen as a realistic approach to address these issues. This mandate has been given to the Health Services Reserve Working Group (HS Res WG).

In order to evaluate the health services reserve role 3 capability within the SRR/SHR, the HS Res WG has canvassed selected SRR/SHR members through a national survey. The analysis of the survey results indicates a requirement for an HS Res organization that is adapted to the specific situation of health care providers. The outstanding response and interest from SRR/SHR members has contributed to the establishment of the CFHS PRL phase 1, a limited trial of a central pool.

The CFHS PRL phase 1 trial is a proof of concept phase and will consist of positions on the NDHQ PRL, that are to be filled IAW the following principles :

Members must maintain professional competencies within civilian employment;
Members must be a former member of the CF Res (P Res, SRR or SHR);
Members must commit to a minimum of 14 days a yr of training and/or employment; and
There will be no promotions or access to MOC, GMT or leadership courses, during phase 1.

During phase 1, the CFHS PRL will have available the following medical reserve MOCs:

R48 Health Care Administrator;
R51 Dental O;
R54 Pharmacist;
R55 Medical Officer including :
GDMO;
Anesthesiologist;
General Surgeon;
Internal Medecine;
Psychiatrist;
Orthopaedic Surgeon;
Diagnostic Radiologist;
Thoracic Surgeon; and
R57 Nursing Officer; and
R711/737 Med A (Reg F 6A & 6B).

 

[Donut]

Here's a little more info on the PRL, maybe we should resurrect that thread on it's own.

Phase 1 is complete, and we're into phase 2.  According to the MCpl who answers the phone in Ottawa, they are accepting applications from all ex reg and res CFHS pers except Res HCA.

The OC of my little happy sub-unit, a PRL Maj, mentioned last week that they're filling up fast.  I've also heard of and seen PRL mbrs who were loaded on additional training courses, so that's changed in Phase 2, too.  In fact, I've got one in my office most of next week for some OJT before she goes off east for a course.

If anyone has any additional info, please feel free to add to this.


PRL bound after 13 years...

DF

 

[Donut]

We had a visit from a team of CWO and MWO from the PRL the other day.

There is a non MO / NO application package out, and apparently they're still looking for people. 

CWO  ________ "so, when do you want to go to Afghanistan?"

Me  "I don't"


DF

 

[PRL ER NO]

Yes the CFHS PRL is up and running, 150+ in strenght.  And also looking for new members

For information : Two PRL members are loaded on ROTO 4 for Op Athena as R57 Nursing Officers.

 

[Donut]

Just thought I'd give this a bump, along with some new info for NCM's:

Contrary to several things I've heard, the HS PRL is NOT open to Res F NCM's unless they've got the elusive "QL5 Equivalency". PCP,  ACP, CCP, RT, doesn't matter.  If you're not QL5, you're not welcome.

That's not the "authorized to support tasks normally requiring a QL5 Reg F Medic" paper that some of us have gotten, that's not the "You're good to go on a TAV replacing a QL5 medic",  That's the actual PLA to a QL5 equivalency.  I honestly don't know why I'm surprised.

Shhhhh, if you listen real careful like, you can almost hear the experience walking away.

 

[Fraser.g]

Sooo now you can be a PCP medic on civi street and the PRL does not want you??? WTF???
I have yet to see anyone with a QL5 PLA.

If that is the case then lets start getting the PCP medics done their PLA for the QL5 for the PRL (How is that for a run of TLAs)

ArmyMedic,

Can you get your hands on the description and MTPs for the Regular Force QL5?

If it is a matter of getting people on their ICP course and some hospital time then we can make this happen.

Shhhh the experience is still walking,

GF

 

[Armymedic]

I can get the MCSP skills from the DIN, as can you if you have access to the Health Services site.

 

[Fraser.g]

True,

I was hesitant to treat that list as Gospel due to some delays in updating the site.

If you believe it is good to go then I will try and look at it and see what we can do.

Without looking at the requirements but knowing what a ICP medic can do I don't think there will be much of a problem getting the skills done. Heck perhaps we can set up a proposal to get our 4s qualified medics up to the 5s level as long as they hold the required medical skill sets.

GF

Remember the end point of this is the reserves (Primary and PRL) supporting the regular force on taskings. Not getting people overseas because they want to get a nickle on their chests.

 

[Donut]

In conversation with some other res medic types, the implications of this for P Res pension came up.

I don't see myself parading every Thursday and three weekends a month for the next 11 years, which is what I'd need to get the 25 year pension, regardless of how many years of Cl B and C I've got invested in this organization.  Neither do any of the others I was discussing this with. 

If reserve health care professionals can't finish out 25 years on the PRL, and virtually none of us can continue to meet the current p res parade schedule indefinitely, then the full benefits of the pension simply aren't accessible to us, which will, well, I don't want to say it's going to make recruiting and retention harder (because we haven't had this carrot before) but it's certainly going to reduce the benefit the pension plan would have provided in these areas.

Food for thought, anyway.

DF

 

[rogsco]

The elusive Reg F QL5 PLA equivalency. The QL5 scope contains components that are not part of most PCP or ACP programs or found in the NOCP for those provider levels. The PLA process works, but you have to be able to document training/experience in all of the QL5 areas of comptency, not just the pre-hospital care portion.

 

[Hot Lips]

If the theory is to take those who have already been Reg force...will those individuals be taken first before someone with the education and experience in the Civi world?
I have read the info on the website and still am unclear as to the specifics that apply to those of us who have not been in the service before.  I applied last Jun as an NO and passed all necessary testing without a hitch.  I have a varied background which includes ER and psych nursing just to mention a few.
The process has been long and drawn out, my appy has bounced back and forth to the CFRC, Ottawa, Unit, back to Montreal and will then go back to the unit...sighhhhhh

 

[Bart Nikodem]

Rogsco,
Do you know where a guy could track down a document outlining the QL5 scope of practice? It would be interesting to see what one needs to get to that level.
All the best,
Bart

 

[Gunner98]

Some direction can be found at:
http://www.forces.gc.ca/health/policies/medServiceInstructions/engraph/msi_cf_3000-004_e.asp

 

[herseyjh]

Hotlips,

Wow, it seems that your application is taking a long time.  I just started my PRL NO paperwork last month and I was given a timeline of 4 months, give or take.  I guess only time will tell.

The one issue that the military has never addressed is how to use the reserve medical branch.  For example, say you join a reserve infantry unit, over time there is a good chance that you could be deployed if you want to.  The converse can not be said for the medical branch.  If I think about it I can maybe think of two people who have been deployed.  I understand that the reserve training is not the same as the regular force training but there must be a way for these two world to meet especially if the individual has civilian training and experience.  For me the PRL is the meeting of these two world and this is because I went to nursing school, but say I just stayed a paramedic?  It would be a no-go.  I don't think it should be this way.

 

[Fraser.g]

OK,

Lets take a FINAL look at the whole, "I'm a medic in the reserves but Nurse on Civi Street" issue.
The roles of the two are different. The trades are different, the responsibilities are different, the career paths are different. If you want to nurse in the army then commission and become a Nur O. If you want to be a medic in the army and be a nurse on Civi Street then keep them separate. In some cases the skill sets are complementary but not the same.

Make Up Your mind, make a plan and then act on it.

A similar line of thinking is "I am an Infanteer in the Reserves but I am an Accountant on civi street"
I should be able to deploy as the Fin O.

NO!

I am a Combat Engineer in the reserves but I work in EMS on civi Street, I should be able to deploy as a medic

NO!

Why is the first one so hard to comprehend?

K, I hope this clears up that little topic. It certainly made me feel better.

 

[Hot Lips]

Well I must say the demeaning replies of many on this website make me wonder.  For those of you with many years in, it may be second nature to know all of the intricate details about the CF.  Keep in mind at some point in time many or even all of you had no knowledge of this huge all encompassing system and hopefully someone was kind enough to help you out when you needed it.  Is it not a team approach that is nurtured/required in the CF?

I would hope that I as a nurse with many years of experience would not bash and demean anyone for asking questions that they would obviously know little about.  Professionalism helps me to rise above the need to bash others who seek information that I just take for granted or comes to me second nature.

We are in A-Stan fighting people who would harm us...why do the same to fellow Canadians regardless of their role here in Canada.

Had to get that off my chest...

HL

 

[the 48th regulator]

OK,

Lets take a FINAL look at the whole, "I'm a medic in the reserves but Nurse on Civi Street" issue.
The roles of the two are different. The trades are different, the responsibilities are different, the career paths are different. If you want to nurse in the army then commission and become a Nur O. If you want to be a medic in the army and be a nurse on Civi Street then keep them separate. In some cases the skill sets are complementary but not the same.

Make Up Your mind, make a plan and then act on it.

A similar line of thinking is "I am an Infanteer in the Reserves but I am an Accountant on civi street"
I should be able to deploy as the Fin O.

NO!

I am a Combat Engineer in the reserves but I work in EMS on civi Street, I should be able to deploy as a medic

NO!

Why is the first one so hard to comprehend?

K, I hope this clears up that little topic. It certainly made me feel better.

So let me get this right,

A nurse on civvy street, would not add any value what so ever as a medic in the reserves?  The fact that they aid people heal, to me seems similar.  Why do you state that one must draw the line between civy and military employment??

A similar line of thinking is "I am an Infanteer in the Reserves but I am an Accountant on civi street"
I should be able to deploy as the Fin O.

The Majority of the officers in my unit including Colonel, were accountants, never heard them wanting to deploy as a Fin O.  You are right they were able to draw the line.

I am a Combat Engineer in the reserves but I work in EMS on civi Street, I should be able to deploy as a medic

Then this person has been either duped into joining the engineers, by a witty recruiter or is confused.  Had he wanted to deploy overseas as a medic, I am sure he would have joined a medical unit...

Unfortunately, RN PRN, I do not agree with you manner of thinking, and your examples seem weak.  I as a troop on the ground would welcome a medic, that has loads of real time experience treating me in a time of need.

And I can say this from first hand experience.  Many of the American reservists posted had worked in actual US Hospitals of major cities treating gunshot wounds.  They then took a deployment helping the UN in Zagreb.

Dileas

tess

 

[Fraser.g]

48th,

My line of thinking is this:

If you want to be a medic in the reserves then sign up as a medic, If you want to be a Nur O then sign up as one, If you want to be an Engineer in the Reserves then sign up as one, If you want to be an Infanteer then sign up as one.

There are many people that want to do one thing on Civi street and another totally different thing in the reserve.
As examples:
I know of a Nurse that I work with in the ER who was a medic, when he got his degree he re-mustered to Infantry because he did not want to do the same thing on weekends that he did during the week,

I know of another fine WO in Toronto who does not want to commission so she is a medic and not a Nur O.

I know of another Infantry Sgt that is a medic on civi street,

I believe there is a Trauma Doc in Alberta who is an Infantry Cpl but that is rumor,

There is an HCA with our local health region that is the TN O with the local Svc Bn...

The list goes on. My point is that if you have chosen a trade then work in that trade. If you want to do something different then VOT do not expect to work in that other trade if you are not employed by the CF to do so.

Could their skills be used differently if they chose, yes! But that is not their choice.

I hope this clears up my POV.

 

[the 48th regulator]

so your line of thinking is a person who deals with medical situations in their civillian life, should not go to the medics expecting to be able to offer that experience?  That it would not work at all??  And therefore be a complete waste of their time?

Answer me that.

dileas

tess

 

[Fraser.g]

That is not what I said AT ALL,

I said that if you want to be a medic then join as a medic,
IF you want to be a nur O then go to school, get your BSN and join as a nurse,

If you have previous experience in the health care field then join and then complete a prior learning assessment (PLA) and get is signed off from the School in Borden.

Do not join as an infanteer and then expect to work as a medic because that is what you do on civi street and if you do then you are out of scope. If you practice out of scope then the licencing body will leave you high and dry.