Sailor who injured another calls assault ‘disgusting’

[IN HOC SIGNO]

This is this reporter's way of doing business. Whenever he mentions that we shot a missile he'll mention how much the missile costs. Or how much it costs to feed and house sailors while we are out on exercise. He plays on the emotions of his readers here in Halifax who probably make less than that.
It's a lazy man's way of writing a story....and sensationalizes things at the same time.

 

[Sig_Des]

This is this reporter's way of doing business. Whenever he mentions that we shot a missile he'll mention how much the missile costs. Or how much it costs to feed and house sailors while we are out on exercise. He plays on the emotions of his readers here in Halifax who probably make less than that.
It's a lazy man's way of writing a story....and sensationalizes things at the same time.

In that case, everytime he writes an article, he should post how much he makes.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

In that case, everytime he writes an article, he should post how much he makes.

No argument here.

I was so P.O.ed when I was in Victoria. Everytime they wrote a story in the Victoria paper that concerned a sailor misbeving in his private life they would print his rank and what ship he was posted to. I wrote a letter to the paper asking why sailors who were charged in civil offences were singled out and whether they would do the same if the guy worked for Canadian Tire. They seemed to get better for a while but I'm not sure things are now.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

What was their reaction/response to your letter?

 

[17thRecceSgt]

Yes- it would have been a story about the air farce.

Okay THAT was funny!

 

[17thRecceSgt]

I read and re-read the article, and it "appears" that the can of beer was thrown, but not with the intent to hit the guy it did.  I am no lawyer, but, the intent was for MS 1 to punch out MS 2.  LS was in the wrong place at the wrong time.  Bah.   :

I don't agree with military courts swinging the way our civilian courts do.  Thats just me.

Regardless of intent, a sailor injured, potentially for life and career-ending in nature,  a subordinate.  So it was out of character.  So?  Doesn't change the fact that it happened.  So he has good integrity.  Buddy's eye is still AFU isn't it?  $500 fine?  For ruining someone's eye?   :.

Soft sentence for the deed IMHO. 

Fact?  A LS has a injured eye, that required 2 operations so far, because someone a higher rank than him threw a can of beer.  He didn't mean to hit him doesn't change the fact that he did hit him.  Thats a fact.  The rest?  It can be disputed.  Sounds like a bad episode of Law and Order to me... :

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

What was their reaction/response to your letter?

It was a letter to the editor so it was published but never any official reaction.

 

[Navalsnpr]

I'm not playing down severity of this issue, however if this happened to an average Joe on civie street, it would not be  getting the current media coverage. The media in Canada actively seeks out and loves to exploit any wrong doing by any member of the service, thus the reason that salaries were thrown into the article. Remember, they (the media) are in the business in selling papers and/or getting ratings, so any additional information that they can add to the article to get the desired effect will be added.

On another point, if the LS is perusing a civilian lawsuit against the MS, then I hope the glasses in question are tested to ensure that they were properly constructed and issued to the LS in the first place.

 

[M Feetham]

My big problem with all this is that a MS, who is supposed to be more responsible caused the injury to a subordinate possibly for life. Big no no. Also, the article says that he was out with friends and did not return until 2 a.m. So here is the million dollar question. What were they doing in any part of the ship at 2 o'clock in the morning with beer. All the messes on a ship close at the latest 1 o'clock in the morning if they have an approved extension for the bar. Seems like a lot of people were doing something they probably should not have been. MS can thrower as well. As far as the comment that the whole incident was out of character for the individual, what would have caused him to act this way. I have seen a lot of very level headed people act "out of character" when they have spent upwards of 12 hours throwing booze into their gullets. I have to agree with the nail in the coffin comment. I sailed for 12 years on the east coast and I have seen too many 2 stores parties and late night binge drinking when the bar was supposed to be closed to count.Usually everyone turns a blind eye if nothing gets out of hand, but a few times I have seen guys so drunk that they could not even stand their HQ 1 roundsman watches. Results? Nothing, not even extra duty watches.  I think the courts martial should have at least put the MS in cells for a week or two. He got off real easy, he should be kissing his lawyers feet. That's my bit.
Thanks, Marc.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

and he didn't lose his leaf.....usaully a reduction in rank for that kind of foolishness.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

So for one momentarily lack of good sense he should be thrown to the wolves?

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

So for one momentarily lack of good sense he should be thrown to the wolves?

I attended a court martial some years ago where a medical person fudged a document so someone could get a medical pension. It was a momentary lack of good sense and it was an act of compassion to someone who was being released with return of benefits after serving with distinction.

He was reduced in rank, fined $5000 and severely reprimanded. The Military prosecutor (a Major who was trying to make his name) had recommended release with disgrace from Her Majesty's Service.
That person did not injure anyone but rather only tried to help them and he was fried.
I wasn't suggesting that he lose his rank but I was surprised after some of the cases I've seen that he didn't lose his leaf.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Big time fine I agree with, paying the LS medical expenses yes, but loss of rank definitely no.

 

[Stoker]

Sometimes the punishment does not always fit the crime in the CF. I've seen a few cases where persons have gotten off with light punishment for things that they should of got released. A number of years ago on one of the ships a member of the senior command team was falling down drunk(not the first time, he liked to party in every port), he went ashore with a number of his "wingers". A new member on OJT who wasn't drinking happens to go ashore at the same time and asks the drunk senior guy where he could find a bar, SMACK the senior guy kicks the new member square in the guts. Clear cut case of assault Right? Wrong!. Never was charged with assault. This senior person gets a severe reprimand, gets put in a shore draft to finish his employment off and gets sent home. This person is employed at home and now after a few years is right back in the same position and on the same ship as he was before.
I'm sure this person is sorry and what I have seen he has cleaned up his act, should that person have been released from the forces or suffered some sort of career death? My faith in the military justice system went out the window after that one.

 

[geo]

The road to hell is paved in good intentions...........
He who has never sinned, throw the 1st stone.......

The individual tried to bump the two who were fighting with that well placed Full can of beer.  Sailor to the side gets the can in the face & is injured for his trouble (of minding his own business).

This could have been a case of someone wading into a fight - to break it up - and some bystander gets creamed with a couple of stray punches....

The actions of the thrower were full of good intentions - and someone got hurt.  Should his career suffer for it? I'm not convinced that it would be for the good of the service to punish him.

 

[GO!!!]

We all know of "some guy" who got off easy and another who did'nt.

All of it is BS unless you are familiar with the pers files and conduct sheets of the people involved, and even then it's a stretch.

I agree with Geo - every young man I know has gotten himself into hot water with alcohol at some point in his life, be it major or minor, so I think it is pretty weak for a bunch of soldiers (a traditionally hard drinking bunch)sitting here to criticise the punishment another got.

If this guy was an exemplary sailor, with an impeccable record of conduct and performance, why throw the book at him? We all have off days, this was his.

Finally, the media coverage of this is crap too. A few years ago, a guy in my unit was slashed in the face with a broken beer bottle, giving him 50 odd stitches and a 26 inch smile. It did'nt even make the paper, but when a "combat veteran" punches out someone who "struck him in the face several times" it's news.

 

[aesop081]

....and with that ( who knew i could agree with GO!!!) i think we are done.....

Usual caveat