Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle - RG-31, LAV Coyote, and (partial) G-Wagon Replacement

[GR66]

I believe the VBL comes in a stretched variant. Carries 2-3 more people.

It's likely the VB2L Command Post variant you're referring to.

From Wikipedia:

• VB2L POSTE DE COMMANDEMENT: ("VBL Long") Command version. Lengthened version[17] that operates a VHF system with two PR4G radios, a HF System with one SSB radio for long range and a Radio/intercom system for the crew. Its armament is a ring-mount fitted with a 7.62 mm machine gun (1400 rounds). Specific equipment: A work station with map board and folding table, additional batteries to meet the requirements of the radio and auxiliary services giving up to 8 hours additional endurance, and a folding seat for 4th crew member.[18]

Some pics here. Even with some reconfiguration looks like it would be very difficult to fit more than the 4th crew member in.

 

[Kirkhill]

I believe the VBL comes in a stretched variant. Carries 2-3 more people.

Equally the LAV came in a shortened variant. Carried 7 fewer people. (With the driver and the CC sitting in the tunnel beside the engine)

Army Guide

Army Guide - information about the main battle tanks, armoured vehicles and armament of the land forces and also the information concerning other army subjects - SPY, Reconnaissance Vehicle, Armoured Vehicles

www.army-guide.com

7700 kg,
4.55 m long, 1.66 m high 2.6 m wide
0.39 m (15") ground clearance
Crew of 3

 

[KevinB]

I still think at this point some of the smaller vehicle sneaky stuff can be done by UCV and UAS. With over watch / control from a CV90 sized system (or even a LAV for those of you wheeled folks).

The TAPV being neither fish nor fowl.

 

[Kirkhill]

I still think at this point some of the smaller vehicle sneaky stuff can be done by UCV and UAS. With over watch / control from a CV90 sized system (or even a LAV for those of you wheeled folks).

The TAPV being neither fish nor fowl.

I'm not disagreeing. I'm looking at the Short LAV or the long VBL as an armoured hatchback/station-wagon/SUV. Driver and CC up front with room in the back for 1 or two bodies and some extra kit like an HMI station, rucks and some heavier weapons and uavs.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

I still think at this point some of the smaller vehicle sneaky stuff can be done by UCV and UAS. With over watch / control from a CV90 sized system (or even a LAV for those of you wheeled folks).

The TAPV being neither fish nor fowl.

That was the concept the Brits had with the Ferret, Fox and Saladin/Scorpion. to bad the Vixen never made it into service, would have been good for the Armoured Reserves.

 

[Kirkhill]

Getting back to the TAPV. The discussion about Hybrids triggered me. Positively.

Here's the Ford F150 hybrid drive train. It strikes me that that tunnel at the back provides lots of room for a major battery pack and electric motor (with ancillary gearbox). The additional weight might even level up the vehicle by balancing out the weight of the engine on the driver's side.



Some other minor modifications -

Larger wheel hubs to shorten the sidewalls of the tires
Lower the ride height 6 inches to that of the M1117 ASV
Strip the RWS back to just the C6 and reconfigure to a lower profile - strictly for self defence and operated by the CC/Co-Driver
Move the spare wheel to the front glacis.
Remove the Gunner's position.

Give the Driver and the CC the best seats in the house - rather than riding on movable stools.
Place two rear facing seats outboard behind the Driver and CC.
Place four folding web seats across the rear wall of the compartment.

2+6 Protected Mobility Vehicle.



I pushed the rear bulkhead forwards to include the transfer case.
The guys on the rear bulkead have about 3 to 4" between their shoulders.

An overweight Foxhound.

 

[GR66]

We could just drop them from the Recce role and keep them for use by MP's, convoy security, security force assistance & training missions, advisors to counter-insurgency missions, etc.

They are useful in certain roles. Hang on to them and use them when required. Don't try to find a way to shoehorn them into a role for which they are not really suited. Get the proper vehicles to fulfill those roles.

 

[KevinB]

We could just drop them from the Recce role and keep them for use by MP's, convoy security, security force assistance & training missions, advisors to counter-insurgency missions, etc.

They are useful in certain roles. Hang on to them and use them when required. Don't try to find a way to shoehorn them into a role for which they are not really suited. Get the proper vehicles to fulfill those roles.

You and your logic.

 

[IKnowNothing]

We could just drop them from the Recce role and keep them for use by MP's, convoy security, security force assistance & training missions, advisors to counter-insurgency missions, etc.

They are useful in certain roles. Hang on to them and use them when required. Don't try to find a way to shoehorn them into a role for which they are not really suited. Get the proper vehicles to fulfill those roles.

Like I said in F2025, 1x LAV Inf Bde, rest of LAV's to RCAC to build Cavalry regiments, TAPV's to 2x Light Inf Bde's to draw for COIN / Protected Mobility when needed. Round pegs in round holes.

 

[KevinB]

Like I said in F2025, 1x LAV Inf Bde, rest of LAV's to RCAC to build Cavalry regiments, TAPV's to 2x Light Inf Bde's to draw for COIN / Protected Mobility when needed. Round pegs in round holes.

It’s not a round peg though. It’s a square peg trying to be smashed into a round hole for the Infantry.

 

[IKnowNothing]

It’s not a round peg though. It’s a square peg trying to be smashed into a round hole for the Infantry.

Is it that off shape for COIN/Chapter 6 and other low(er) intensity conflict? Giving survivable wheels for convoy escort, route recce, getting from A->B, laison etc to otherwise light units?

 

[KevinB]

Is it that off shape for COIN/Chapter 6 and other low(er) intensity conflict? Giving survivable wheels for convoy escort, route recce, getting from A->B, laison etc to otherwise light units?

It may get to A to B, but it doesn’t let anyone off at B…
Give it to the Service Bn’s and MP’s.
Convoy Escort and Local Defense Tasks are it’s only bread and butter

 

[Kirkhill]

It may get to A to B, but it doesn’t let anyone off at B…
Give it to the Service Bn’s and MP’s.
Convoy Escort and Local Defense Tasks are it’s only bread and butter

And when you say Local Defense Tasks you mean Base Security. Right?

That's the reason you don't need a spare wheel. You are always in reach of Base Maintenance.

 

[McG]

And when you say Local Defense Tasks you mean Base Security. Right?

That's the reason you don't need a spare wheel. You are always in reach of Base Maintenance.

Not base, but BSA & DSA.

 

[GK .Dundas]

I have always suspected that the CA is convinced that they will never fight a conflict any farther away from their barracks then twenty minutes....OK, maybe 30 .

 

[Kirkhill]

Not base, but BSA & DSA.

Define please. For the uninformed.

 

[McG]

Brigade Support Area
Division Support Area

In a capable Army, these are mobile and follow the fighting formation that they support. Bases are fixed infrastructure.

 

[Kirkhill]

Brigade Support Area
Division Support Area

In a capable Army, these are mobile and follow the fighting formation that they support. Bases are fixed infrastructure.

Thanks - fixed infrastructure. Like Airfields, ports, railway yards, factories and warehouses. Got it.

 

[McG]

Bases are fixed. The BSA & DSA are not.

 

[FormerHorseGuard]

I think after looking at various wars and the big one going on right now. Recce is not going to be done by any armoured vehicle, it is going to be done by small hand held drones. Forward group, launches said drone from a relative safe area, it over flies the area of concern. Transmits it view back to the troops that launched it or a higher HQ and they recover the drone if required, make a plan for the attack or or defence of the area they control. They get real time intell, very little risk to the troops, cheaper than building a recce vehicle and equipping it with troops, weapons and spy gear. Drones today have great cameras, image quality beyond belief, they can fly in almost any weather, almost silent, and more than one set of eyes can view the feed at the same time. The enemy already knows the satellite over flight times, unless they redirect or retask a satellite to an area. Drones can fly over at any time of day, range of drones is getting better, from 15 minutes to now hours depending on the power source. Digital Cameras are getting better every day. 12 years of Nikon DSLR 3/4 sensor cameras have gone from 6 MP to 24.2, a 24 MP picture from 1200 feet is and beyond is possible So I think more of the recce work will be done with troops using drones and pre planned flight paths. All programed even before the drone is launched.
Attached picture was taken from the CN Tower, 343 meters up or 1122 feet, taken with a nikon d3200 18-55 lens (crappy starter lens). 24.2MP. But I can see the runway at what use to be CFB Toronto, a better quality lens and it would not blur out as much. That is a 12km away from the airport. Good glass and I wonder how much better I could see. This why I am thinking recce vehicles are going to be gone

I was Inf before I was Fin clerk,now out, so I am looking from the outside in.