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US Presidential Election 2024 - Trump vs Biden 2 - Vote Hard with a Vengence

I'm not getting into a long drawn out discussion. I'm simply saying the Republicans don't have a lock on racism. There's plenty of blame to go around, on both sides. Take it or leave it, it makes no difference to me.

Everyone has their favourite and will be pissed their candidate didn't get the nod.
 
I'm not getting into a long drawn out discussion. I'm simply saying the Republicans don't have a lock on racism. There's plenty of blame to go around, on both sides. Take it or leave it, it makes no difference to me.

Everyone has their favourite and will be pissed their candidate didn't get the nod.

Well no, that’s not simply what you’re saying. You claimed “no more than Biden’s” base (present tense), specifically in response to white nationalists getting upset the contender VP has a brown wife. That’s a pretty bold claim to make, that the Democrat base is as bad as that portion of Trump’s, and I’m challenging that claim. Your decision to defend it or not, but I’m skeptical that anyone could with any real evidence.
 
Well no, that’s not simply what you’re saying. You claimed “no more than Biden’s” base (present tense), specifically in response to white nationalists getting upset the contender VP has a brown wife. That’s a pretty bold claim to make, that the Democrat base is as bad as that portion of Trump’s, and I’m challenging that claim. Your decision to defend it or not, but I’m skeptical that anyone could with any real evidence.
You're putting words in my mouth and I claimed nothing of the sort. You went on one of your speeches about MAGA racists as is your want. I simply responded that there are racists on both sides. A general observation. There is no wheat or chaff.
 
Well no, that’s not simply what you’re saying. You claimed “no more than Biden’s” base (present tense), specifically in response to white nationalists getting upset the contender VP has a brown wife. That’s a pretty bold claim to make, that the Democrat base is as bad as that portion of Trump’s, and I’m challenging that claim. Your decision to defend it or not, but I’m skeptical that anyone could with any real evidence.
Party affiliation requires no test or entrance fee. It's a simple self declaration on a voter registration form that requires no authorization from the parties. The parties are powerless in affiliation. There are scummy elements on the fringes of the Republican Party and greasy elements on the outskirts of the Democratic party. When you see posts like you see and rightly call out don't assume these idiots have any sway in party policy or are even welcome.
 
You're putting words in my mouth and I claimed nothing of the sort.
I literally quoted the words you used.

You went on one of your speeches about MAGA racists as is your want.
False, and nonsense. I challenge you to find anything in my posting history suggesting this is ‘my want’ [sic]. I observed, on this one time basis, something I’ve seen today that I found interesting given the dynamic in the MAGA base, and I showed receipts.

I simply responded that there are racists on both sides. A general observation. There is no wheat or chaff.

No, as I quoted you, and I’ll quote you again to help you out:
No more than Biden's base.

Taking your plain language at face value, you’re saying Biden’s base is at least as racist - as that’s the context you were relying to - as that particular subset of the MAGA crowd. You’re free to offer evidence of that if you choose, I’m just not going to ignore a shifting of goalposts on this.

You weren’t a part of this thread, until you chose to enter it with a direct replying to me. You did so with something that I don’t think you can show is true. If you don’t like the plain meaning of your words being pointed out and challenged, offer enough evidence to back it up or clarify where maybe you misspoke the first time. That’s if you feel you’ve made some claim here that you can support.

A reminder to situate the conversation: I was talking about white nationalists in the MAGA crowd getting all cranky that Trump’s VP pick has a brown wife. That’s the subject I was speaking to.
 
Party affiliation requires no test or entrance fee. It's a simple self declaration on a voter registration form that requires no authorization from the parties. The parties are powerless in affiliation. There are scummy elements on the fringes of the Republican Party and greasy elements on the outskirts of the Democratic party. When you see posts like you see and rightly call out don't assume these idiots have any sway in party policy or are even welcome.
And there is little, if any, support amongst the majority of both parties for these fringe elements. Trying to blame a whole party politic based on some offside crazies is lazy and ludicrous.
 
Taking your plain language at face value, you’re saying Biden’s base is at least as racist - as that’s the context you were relying to - as that particular subset of the MAGA crowd. You’re free to offer evidence of that if you choose, I’m just not going to ignore a shifting of goalposts on this.
Difficult to measure, but the pro-affirmative-action faction is large in Biden's base, and some fraction of that is people who are basically hostile to whites and "asians". I doubt anyone has tried to measure it.
 
Difficult to measure, but the pro-affirmative-action faction is large in Biden's base, and some fraction of that is people who are basically hostile to whites and "asians". I doubt anyone has tried to measure it.
And see, that’s actually a articulable position that could potentially be argued with evidence. I’d be very surprised if someone hasn’t tried to measure it (with or without good faith), but in any case at least it’s cogent. In terms of magnitude I suspect it would be difficult to defend a claim that it’s remotely close to equal to some of the open and blatant racism on frequent display from some in the other camp, but I’ll give you credit for at least offering an idea of where one could look.
 
Twist it however you want. I said nothing about candidates and their families. There are fringe racists on both sides. That's the point I was speaking to. But go ahead and keep trying to make this something it not. Have a good night.
 
Twist it however you want. I said nothing about candidates and their families. There are fringe racists on both sides. That's the point I was speaking to. But go ahead and keep trying to make this something it not. Have a good night.
You were directly replying to my very short post, the first line of which was “no, but Melania is white”. You specifically quoted it. But sure. You were talking about something different, you just didn’t bother letting us know.
 
Yes, I quoted your post. I was replying to the last sentence. I'll take care in the future to strike all that isn't pertinent to my point, so as not to confuse you. :salute:
 
And see, that’s actually a articulable position that could potentially be argued with evidence. I’d be very surprised if someone hasn’t tried to measure it (with or without good faith), but in any case at least it’s cogent. In terms of magnitude I suspect it would be difficult to defend a claim that it’s remotely close to equal to some of the open and blatant racism on frequent display from some in the other camp, but I’ll give you credit for at least offering an idea of where one could look.
Sure. Look in the institutions where a few people are teaching about "white" behaviours like punctuality and objective thinking. Actual universities, with actual accredited professors and real grad students in real programs, actually advancing those propositions, many funded by governments. Not a bunch of redneck nobodies on the fringes of society living in small towns few people are aware exist.
 
Sure. Look in the institutions where a few people are teaching about "white" behaviours like punctuality and objective thinking. Actual universities, with actual accredited professors and real grad students in real programs, actually advancing those propositions, many funded by governments. Not a bunch of redneck nobodies on the fringes of society living in small towns few people are aware exist.
Yup, fair points and those are certainly things that do exist.

I’m not sure that abjectly racist cohort within the MAGA movement can be so blithely dismissed as a bunch of hicks like you’re trying to do- while not the mainstream of the party, there are certainly enough influential figures there with significant followings. I provided an example above; there are plenty of others.

In any case, as I said, building the big Republican tent for Trump will bring some challenges when some decisions don’t align with the expectations of some of his more extreme devotees on the fringe. I just found the blatant white supremacist backlash to Vance’s family noteworthy. It could equally have gone in the ‘fractured’ thread, but given the direct tie in to the VP pick, this seemed more on point. If the Democrats face similar blatantly and openly racist dissension in response to candidate selection, I would find that (and their response to it) interesting as well. I’m just not thinking it likely the Dems will see that kind of of fringe internal backlash to, and I quote some rather shitty people here, “race mixing”.
 
I’m just not thinking it likely the Dems will see that kind of of fringe internal backlash to, and I quote some rather shitty people here, “race mixing”.
If you broaden your criteria just a little bit to "race traitor" - which is really what is at the heart of "race mixing" - you shouldn't have to wait long. The rhetoric boils out of the various centres of Democratic politics - academia, politicians, popular media - almost every time someone like Clarence Thomas or Tim Scott does something that tweaks their noses. "Uncle Tom" is often uttered/written. I suppose it's so common that people have ceased to recognize it for what it is. It shouldn't matter what the political alignments of the targets are. What matters is who speaks up, what platforms they occupy, and whether their own people sanction them.
 
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