AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)

[Snafu-Bar]

I guess lease to own is out of the question  ;D

Seems to me that the money is set aside, why not invest it till the amount needed is secured before settling for refits and less than's, only to compound the problem down the road.

Cheers

 

[geo]

You missed an option...

Save up till you CAN afford one.  ;D

Add to the assumption that the car you have is well worn & on it's last leggs.
You have to replace it within 24 months or have to spend a bundle or repairs AND
there is the distinct possibility that the licencing authority will not licence your current vehicle beyond same said 24 months...

SO, what are ya going to do ???

 

[aesop081]

Seems to me that the money is set aside, why not invest it till the amount needed is secured before settling for refits and less than's, only to compound the problem down the road.

Ok, while i understand that you brain has already hit max processing capacity, i will say this again for you.......

We dont have that kind of time. We are the family whos car doesnt start and cant pass the safety inspection anymore.

The current AORs are life-expired. JSS turned out to be too expensive. Do-it-all-and-then-some things always cost too much. Why not get something a little less gucci, that does the jobs we really need as oposed to be without a vital capability.

 

[Neill McKay]

Seems to me that the money is set aside, why not invest it till the amount needed is secured before settling for refits and less than's, only to compound the problem down the road.

It's just a number on a sheet of paper (somewhere in the defence budget).  It wouldn't make sense to specifically invest that sum of money for a time as that would tie up the money when it could be used for any of the thousands of things the federal government does, anything from another defence project to new weather forecasting equipment for Environment Canada to paying the janitors in the House of Commons.  It's all part of the federal pot, and if a decision is made to procure some other vessels to replace the JSS programme (which I imagine we all hope it will be) then X millions of dollars will be budgeted at that time.

 

[viper3ca]

  What ships  currently being  built for AOR do you think  would be the best  suited for the Canadian Navy? The first two that come to mind are Spains Canabria  and the German Berlin class? Another option is to go with the Dutch JSS.

 

[aesop081]

Seems to me that the money is set aside, why not invest it till the amount needed is secured before settling for refits and less than's, only to compound the problem down the road.

Furthermore, its not like the gov just hands the builder a check for 1.2 billion dollars and says " build us a ship"

The money is paid to the builder over several years during construction of the ship program. The builder usualy gets given a bunch of money at first to purchase long-lead items and then gets so much at each stage of construction.

 

[gwp]

The Minister is taking a positive approach

OTTAWA — Renewing the coast guard fleet and ensuring the Armed Forces have the equipment they need remains a key government priority, Public Works Minister Christian Paradis said yesterday, even as his government moves to scuttle its multimillion-dollar plans to purchase a resupply ship for the navy and new patrol vessels for the coast guard.

“Our first wish was to have this procurement to be finalized that we could go forward. Unfortunately, there is a major budget constraint here, so this is why we had to announce that the procurements are over,” Paradis said. “We have to make sure that the taxpayers get the most for their dollars.”

The two programs to rebuild Canada’s maritime capabilities were thrown into limbo Friday night after the Conservative government announced it had rejected the bids it had received for the navy’s $2.9-billion Joint Support Ship project. Both bids were significantly over the established budget for the shipbuilding program.

But Paradis said the government would continue to work toward getting the military and the coast guard the equipment they needed.
“This is our key priority … since we got into office that we will give Defence the supplies that they need and the renewal of the coast guard ships,” said Paradis. “Fisheries and Oceans and DND [the Department of National Defence] are looking on their side to see what will be the next step . . . but for now, the procurement process [is] over.”

The solution lies in the Canadian Shipbuilding Industry becoming more efficient or the Government establishing a shipbuilding policy that would allow the Shipbuilding Industry to trust that there is sustainable work. Or both (which chicken which egg).

The boom-bust approach to shipbuilding generally in Canada has not generated the infrastructure or the workforce that competes internationally. Yet, there is real politics of "Buy Canada."

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

So we have to wait until the Canadian Shipbuilding industry wakes up before the Government looks into getting new ships for the Navy and the CCG again???

 

[Retired AF Guy]

Here's a recent write-up on the subject in the Hill Times from Darcy Knoll who is a senior writer for Esprit de Corps , Scott Taylor's magazine.

http://www.thehilltimes.ca/html/index.php?display=story&full_path=2008/august/25/program/&c=2

Not a bad write-up in my opinion. I found it pretty informative, however, I haven't really been following the program, so some the info may be old news to other posters. However, I found the Headline [i]"Joint Support Ship program has floundered in a 'minefield' [/i] to be may be a little overboard.

 

[Snafu-Bar]

The news(cbcn "The National") reported the plans haven't been scrapped and that it was on hold. What that entails is yet to be seen.

Cheers

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

  What ships  currently being  built for AOR do you think  would be the best  suited for the Canadian Navy? The first two that come to mind are Spains Canabria  and the German Berlin class? Another option is to go with the Dutch JSS.

I would hope they would go with either the Pantino class or Berlin class

 

[geo]

Ex D,
Pantino Command functions sits in the back while Berlin's sits in the front.
any preference over where the Command function should be located ???

 

[hugh19]

I would say forward. As both the Protectuer and Provider had the bridge forward.

 

[aesop081]

I would say forward.

But why ?

Other classes of AORs have the superstructure aft.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Ex D,
Pantino Command functions sits in the back while Berlin's sits in the front.
any preference over where the Command function should be located ???

I am in the bowels of a ship...for me it does not matter as its usually the CO up there...

 

[Nfld Sapper]

HMCS PROTECTEUR

B.A.C. "Patiño"

FGS Berlin

Does it really make a difference where the bridge sits?

 

[geo]

was just wondering if there were any practical considerations.....
Mechanicals concentrated in the rear
Noise issues of being over the engine room

Remember... am a green Engineer - confortable on Zodiacs and rafts

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

*Snicker* I am an Operator so placement of the superstructure only matters on how it blocks my sensors

 

[FSTO]

The best person to ask would be a Nav Arc mainly for stability issues. As a MARS Officer with the bridge aft you will be able to see everything that is going on the RAS deck. Other than that its pretty much a saw off weather you have one or two superstructures.

 

[Kirkhill]

The best person to ask would be a Nav Arc mainly for stability issues. As a MARS Officer with the bridge aft you will be able to see everything that is going on the RAS deck. Other than that its pretty much a saw off weather you have one or two superstructures.

Or you can build a Trawler Bridge.  Bridge forard with glass fore and aft so that the fishing master can direct  both navigation and net operations on the trawl deck.

Edit - OK, I give up.  Could somebody please link to the image above and post it properly?

Thanks.