georgeharper: thinks Iraq = Afghanistan

[stegner]

:deadhorse:

 

[Teeps74]

Because you are so set in your ways you refuse to hear anything else.
I mean really.

After the Americans spend billions bombing innocent civillans, invading and occupying countries, then setting up elections, do you really think they are then going to accept a result that was not favourable to the Americans?

I mean think about it.
The Americans have had many democratically elected governments overthrown because they were not American freindly


Now please, show me how Jack Layton is Taliban friendly

If unable to do so, then offer a public apology on this site

What, you mean like this? NDP calls Canadian Soldiers terrorists (note, the webpage in question is using DIRECT screen shots from the NDP wepbage before the webpage was taken down).

This wiki article is actually fairly accurate (meaning GH will not bother to read it, or claim it is "propaganda" and dismiss it) OP Athena

Of course, the NDP claims there are no benchmarks for success. The right dishonourable Jack 'Taliban' Layton clearly has never heard of www.google.ca else he would have found this, the Afghanistan Compact (PDF) which has clear and concise mission objectives, and benchmarks. GH you are a liar, and a troll... And yet you are still here (though not for long), prove us all wrong, post links to verifiable sources, and you will be more welcome here.

 

[Flip]

It's sad really.
Most trolls at least put up a fight.
What we have here is a pitiful antagonism that will convince or be respected by no one.
I can't even get up any real indignation!

I am proud though.
ARMY.ca members have provided information and logic and more than a little patience.
I wish we had a more worthy troll. :

 

[armyvern]

Moderator Note for georgeharper:

GH,

Please be advised that all of your posts/threads have been merged into this one megathread (I'm posting this notice to avoid your claiming yet again that your posts have been deleted).

This has been done in order to allow you to find them. Keeping them in one spot and simple for you.

I will also be PMing you a link to this thread -- just to ensure your ability to find it.

ArmyVern
The Milnet.ca Staff

 

[a_majoor]

The ROI for this thread is in the negative numbers now, kind of like encountering a black hole in space. 

Too bad it is entertaining in the same way that looking at a train wreak is, we can drive by saying "wow, how did that happen" and "Thank God I wasn't caught in that......"

 

[vonGarvin]

Got to laugh.
People can come on here and say whatever nonsense they want and call Mr Layton names and refer to him as Bin Layton, but yet, you come on here and say truthful things like Canada is now a more dangerous place due to Canada being involved in the occupation of Afghanistan, and a post like that is removed.

Your statement is full of logical holes.  First, it is NOT truthful to say that Canada is now more dangerous than post "occupation" of Afghanistan.  Canada, as part of NATO, was a target for the USSR.  That former state had many nuclear weapons, some more  than likely pointed at The True North Strong and Free.  Second, Afghanistan is not  ("occupied".  There are numerous sources for you to see that (a) the government is a legitimate  one (elected, that is) and that (b) we  are there at the request of said government.

Now unless someone tells me who told and asked the U.S.to invade Afghanistan and then proceed to occupy it on October 7, 2001, I expect a complete apology for my post being removed

Ok, I will.  Nobody asked  the US to invade and then occupy Afghanistan.  First, the US didn't invade.  Second, it doesn't occupy it.  It did attack it, mostly with bombs from the air and did send in some troops (special forces), but the Northern Alliance did most of the ground work.  Once that was done, they asked in the US, NATO, etc to help restore security.  You see, as you may recall, international law gives authority to states to strike back at other states that attack them.  On 9/11, Afghanistan did NOT attack the US: Al Qaeda did, and they were, as you may recall, "guests" of Afghanistan.  When asked to give them up, Kabul refused, and you know the rest of the story.

By the Americans own admission terrorist attacks have increased dramatically since the invasion of both Iraq and Afghanistan

Pardon?

If you want to believe that the government is anything but an American installed government, then fine,but the reason Canada is in Afghanistan is because Canada, thankfully because of Chretien is not in Iraq, and going to Afghanistan was just a way of making the Americans think Canada cared about America created wars

Funny,
I bet all the posters on this forum wish they were in Iraq, because after all, the reason for that invasion and occupation was to make life better for those people also

Revisionism rocks.  You "priase" Chretian for us not going to Iraq, yet you revile the fact that we are with ISAF in Afghanistan.  Hypocrite.  Chretien sent us to Kabul to AVOID making a decision on Iraq.  At the time, had he listened to polls, Canada would have gone in to Iraq.  No doubt in my mind.  It was the right thing to do (but it wasn't done right).  I think that the US is  doing quite  well now.  But, I'm sleepy.  I have to go poke my eyes out.

 

[armyvern]

Revisionism rocks.  You "priase" Chretian for us not going to Iraq, yet you revile the fact that we are with ISAF in Afghanistan.  Hypocrite.  Chretien sent us to Kabul to AVOID making a decision on Iraq.  At the time, had he listened to polls, Canada would have gone in to Iraq.  No doubt in my mind.  It was the right thing to do (but it wasn't done right).  I think that the US is  doing quite  well now.  But, I'm sleepy.  I have to go poke my eyes out.

I'm going to have to insert a point of clarification on this bit Rockpainter.

As I recall, the Op Athena (the deployment of pers into Kabul in May/June 2003) TAT arrived overseas to be greeted by people like me who had already been deployed into our area of operations since Jan 2002 -- well before President Bush spoke a word about Iraq. Op Apollo, did not end with the removal of Canadian infanteers from Afghanistan in 2002.

When you arrived with that TAT, and found yourself faced with moi to harass you, I had already been there 5.5 months -- as had a few hundred other pers with me. There was no lag between operations at all -- although the infantry was not involved during the whole time period, many hundreds of other Canadian soldiers/sailors and airmen certainly were.

There exists a common misperception that Canada was not involved in the region between the withdrawal of our Infantry in 2002 from Op Apollo and their return in 2003 as part of Op Athena. That is simply not the case.

Indeed a couple hundred of us sat around the satellite link-up watching the beginning of the American actions in Iraq ... while we listened chuckling to Media commentary on the news which was speculating that there were less than 10 Canadian Troops in the region -- wondering how our own Canadian media could possibly have determined that we didn't exist simply because the infantry had departed the previous year.

 

[George Wallace]

It seems that having been there and done that, means nothing to these people.  If it isn't officially recorded in a sound bite from a Left leaning Anti-military, Anti-government organization, it isn't "Official", nor is it true.  Why we can't see this, is beyond these people's comprehension.  The world is such a mess because we are off trying to bring Peace and Good Government to other nations by military means, as opposed to the fantasy dreamt up a Dope smoking Philosophy Professor at an "Institution of Higher Learning" who has probably never held a 'real' job in their life.  Unfortunately society has permitted these people to habitate the wrong types of Institutions and brainwash the young and impressionable minds of career students.  It is amazing to see how many of said students find a "change of life" philosophy and become Conservatives once they find themselves raising families and wage earners like their parents were.  Suddenly their parents became quite intelligent.

georgeharper has not reached that stage of evolution yet.

 

[MARS]

It is amazing to see how many of said students find a "change of life" philosophy and become Conservatives once they find themselves raising families and wage earners like their parents were.  Suddenly their parents became quite intelligent.

+1 GW.  Your line, and georgeharper's posts remind me of this quote: "Not to be a socialist at twenty is proof of want of heart;
to be one at thirty is proof of want of head" (Georges Clemenceau (1841-1929))

MARS

 

[vonGarvin]

I'm going to have to insert a point of clarification on this bit Rockpainter.

As I recall, the Op Athena (the deployment of pers into Kabul in May/June 2003) TAT arrived overseas to be greeted by people like me who had already been deployed into our area of operations since Jan 2002 -- well before President Bush spoke a word about Iraq. Op Apollo, did not end with the removal of Canadian infanteers from Afghanistan in 2002.

When you arrived with that TAT, and found yourself faced with moi to harass you, I had already been there 5.5 months -- as had a few hundred other pers with me. There was no lag between operations at all -- although the infantry was not involved during the whole time period, many hundreds of other Canadian soldiers/sailors and airmen certainly were.

Now I know why I got danger pay ;D

This is actually quite illuminating.  I wasn't aware that so many were there when we arrived.  Still, my point to bugger head was that JC didn't "decide" to keep us out of Iraq.  He instead decided to "up" our committment to Afghanistan, less than six months after saying that we didn't have the troops to go back.  (By "troops", I mean a BG or something like that).

 

[TCBF]

It seems that having been there and done that, means nothing to these people.  If it isn't officially recorded in a sound bite from a Left leaning Anti-military, Anti-government organization, it isn't "Official", nor is it true.  Why we can't see this, is beyond these people's comprehension.  The world is such a mess because we are off trying to bring Peace and Good Government to other nations by military means, as opposed to the fantasy dreamt up a Dope smoking Philosophy Professor at an "Institution of Higher Learning" who has probably never held a 'real' job in their life.  Unfortunately society has permitted these people to habitate the wrong types of Institutions and brainwash the young and impressionable minds of career students.  It is amazing to see how many of said students find a "change of life" philosophy and become Conservatives once they find themselves raising families and wage earners like their parents were.  Suddenly their parents became quite intelligent.

georgeharper has not reached that stage of evolution yet.

- Fact is, our taxdollars are funding the emasculation of Canada by educating people beyond their capacity to reason then hiring them at inflated salaries to advance the 'progressive' direction of Canadian politics. 

- Look into those 'foundations' established by the last government, to the tune of billions of dollars annually and all of it out of reach of the auditor general.  What direction do you think those agencies are taking us?

- If you want the truth, follow the money - a dollar bill never lies.

 

[George Wallace]

- Fact is, our taxdollars are funding the emasculation of Canada by educating people beyond their capacity to reason ........

Well.  That seems to have been the opinion of the Student Union at the U of Vic when they felt that they must ban CF Recruiting on Campus.  The same thing has been happening in other Universities, where the Student Unions have taken it upon themselves to dictate what the Student Body should do as they are incapable of independent thought by themselves.  Is our Education System breeding sheeple and/or are we unwittingly breeding a new crop of elitists/dictators to control the thoughts of the sheeple?

 

[georgeharper]

Canadians were in danger BEFORE we went into Afghanistan -- remember all those innocent Canadians killed on Sept 11th by any chance (that occured BEFORE we went in)?

Last I heard, the Saudis had NOT launched a terrorist attack on the scale of 911,

Oh please.To now suggest that Canada and Canadians were a target for a terrorist attack prior to 9/11 simply because some Canadians happened to be in the wrong place( the United States) at the wrong time is laughable.
Now because Canada is helping the U.S with the occupation of Afghanistan , Canada indeed is a target.

Last I heard, Afghanistan had not launched a terrorist attack on the scale of 9/11

But I did hear for fact almost all the 9/11 terroist were Saudis, and not Afghanis.
Last I heard, the Saudis are doing nothing to stop the growing number of terrorist camps and the brutality of the civillians .
But then again, the Saudis control the American economy also.
Dont want to step on any toes in that country by making life better for those people

 

[George Wallace]

Oh please.To now suggest that Canada and Canadians were a target for a terrorist attack prior to 9/11 simply because some Canadians happened to be in the wrong place( the United States) at the wrong time is laughable.
Now because Canada is helping the U.S with the occupation of Afghanistan , Canada indeed is a target.

As Al Queda has stated in its "Press Releases".  It is sad that you have such a lax grip on reality.

Last I heard, Afghanistan had not launched a terrorist attack on the scale of 9/11

Afghanistan hasn't but Al Queda has.  They have launched several attacks around the world from Spain to Bali.

But I did hear for fact almost all the 9/11 terroist were Saudis, and not Afghanis.

???  So what?  They were Saudis trained in Terrorist Training Camps in Afghanistan.  They definitely were not Afghan monetary units.

Last I heard, the Saudis are doing nothing to stop the growing number of terrorist camps and the brutality of the civillians .

They have sent aid to Afghans.  They have not interfered in the Internal matters of State in Afghanistan.  It would be illegal for them to do so.

But then again, the Saudis control the American economy also.

Now I have heard that the Jews controlled Amerika.  I have heard that the Mormons controlled Amerika.  I have heard that the Masons control Amerika.  Now you are telling me that the Saudis control Amerika.  How many conspiracies must we put up with before we stop believing in the person "crying wolf"?

Dont want to step on any toes in that country by making life better for those people

No need to reply to that, as it has been stated to you several times over now, and you still haven't clued in.

And please learn how to use SPELL CHECK!

 

[Panzer Grenadier]

I'm afraid arguing with a wall can only go so far...

 

[McG]

Last I heard, Afghanistan had not launched a terrorist attack on the scale of 9/11

The organization which conducted the 9/11 attacks was hosted & protected by the Afghan government of the time.  You know this.

But I did hear for fact almost all the 9/11 terroist were Saudis, and not Afghanis.

Again with your red herring.  The Saudi government had nothing to do with sheltering AQ or conducting the attack.  Regardless, even if you want to suggest that NATO should invade Saudi Arabia, this is not an argument for or against actions in any other nation.

You have still not met the obligation of your public warning:  Provide complete backed-up arguments & not rhetoric. 

 

[Teeps74]

Oh please.To now suggest that Canada and Canadians were a target for a terrorist attack prior to 9/11 simply because some Canadians happened to be in the wrong place( the United States) at the wrong time is laughable.
Now because Canada is helping the U.S with the occupation of Afghanistan , Canada indeed is a target.

Last I heard, Afghanistan had not launched a terrorist attack on the scale of 9/11

But I did hear for fact almost all the 9/11 terroist were Saudis, and not Afghanis.
Last I heard, the Saudis are doing nothing to stop the growing number of terrorist camps and the brutality of the civillians .
But then again, the Saudis control the American economy also.
Dont want to step on any toes in that country by making life better for those people

Can you provide a single solitary link to back your nonsense up? Just one? Hell, I will even take one of your garbage enmasse type links.

 

[Loachman]

Now because Canada is helping the U.S with the occupation of Afghanistan

What "occupation"?

If we were "occupying" Afghanistan, then the Afghan population would rise up and easily push us out.

There simply are not enough NATO/US troops to "occupy" even a small part of Afghanistan.

This is a lefty myth religious fundamental, which none of you can see past.

Canada indeed is a target.

No more and no less than we were before we accepted the Afghan invitation to assist them.

Last I heard, Afghanistan had not launched a terrorist attack on the scale of 9/11

You do have a problem understanding things, don't you?

Nobody here said that "Afghanistan .... launched a terrorist attack". This is your own mental construct. The fact - understood by everybody else here except you - is that the Taliban government harboured Al Quaida and provided it with safe training facilities. Nobody here claimed that any Afghans were amongst the September 2001 mass-murderers. We know full well from whence they came.

And it's "Afghans", by the way. "Afghanis" are their currency.

For all of its faults, the Saudi standard of living is far above that of Afghans.

But you refuse to see any of this.

You're still highly entertaining, however, so feel free to keep displaying your wilful ignorance for our collective amusement.

 

[Flip]

Oh please.To now suggest that Canada and Canadians were a target for a terrorist attack prior to 9/11 simply because some Canadians happened to be in the wrong place( the United States) at the wrong time is laughable.

The "target for terrorist" attacks is any western liberal democracy that offends the Islamist sense of "justice".
Canada could never avoid being a target as we have long and deep historical and economic ties to the US and the UK.
Even if they never attack Canada per se, an attack on our partners is an attack on Canada.

As for Afghans, you're a little confused. They are on the same side of this as WE are.
They have been the victims of the Taliban and AQ to a far greater degree than have been.
And the government of Afghanistan have invited ISAF in to secure the country and remove Taliban.
The government of Afghanistan has also been elected and recognized by the UN.

To disregard these facts is to obfuscate the argument.  That is, try to take the argument out of the realm of reality.

 

[Loachman]

the realm of reality.

A too-completely alien concept for the poor wee thing.