Islamic Terrorism in the West ( Mega thread)

[AbdullahD]

It's not spiritual?  It's warfare based on murdering anyone and everyone who isn't a believer.  Nothing about protecting borders or land.  It's murdering disbelievers where ever you find them.  Murdering people for religious reasons sure sounds spiritual to me.

Did you read any of the links I posted? I'm guessing no by this bit here. So please go back and do so otherwise there is no point to us discussing squat if your just going to ignore what I say.

1. A couple hundred thousand extremists aren't a significant percent?

Do you understand statistics? What percent is 200,000 let's say into.... 1.8 billion. Not very big.
 

2. I've previously gave you a great example of an every day village of regular Islamic followers who turned berserk in moments and physically ripped a woman apart.  A woman who was accused of ruining a book full if paper,  which turned out to be false.

Cool and that is accepted in Islam were? Because I saw a village of white Christians Lynch black guys before.... so that's Christianity right? Make sense? Just because idiots do something does not make it that they believe it is a religious need nor does it resemble the religion if it goes against that religions beliefs.

You're couple hundred thousand figure is vastly underestimated in my opinion.

Mhmm and were is you proof that more then that are radicalized and believe in extreme Islam?

http://m.csmonitor.com/World/Security-Watch/terrorism-security/2015/0113/How-many-Muslim-extremists-are-there-Just-the-facts-please

Oops sorry it is not 200 it is 300,000 out of 1.8 billion and this is from the Christian Science Monitor, seems unbiased to me.

I'm content watching the news and seeing what's being done in Allah's name by his followes.

Because that is were we all find unbiased and honest opinions on everything, I'm going to run to Russia today to develop a view of North America! Because it's legit! Kinda see the problem here?

Or should I go to BDS websites to develop a view of Israel? If reading the entire sentence before making an opinion on something is to much... I suppose I can't expect more. Your view is so entrenched I don't see it changing.

You literally went off over a fragment of a sentence. If that is not enough to make you think I can't help. Go back and read those links. Try developing an unbiased opinion.

I'm not trying to attack you, this is all meant in the best of ways. But I am seriously amazed you seem to be still holding to the position that the fragment represents everything you ever needed to know...maybe if I went around judging people or things because of fragments of sentences.... it would be very concerning.

Take care Jarnhamar
Abdullah

 

[AbdullahD]

The percentage, if that number is accurate is 0.01111111 percent.    Not that significant no.  But I'm more concerned about the impact that percentage can have.  clearly a big one.

Agreed, but then again I'd agree when any innocent blood is spilt period. But this discussion should happen on how to mitigate this .0 something percent into toothless muts.

Abdullah

 

[Bass ackwards]

She knew! Orlando terrorist's wife 'told the FBI she tried to talk him out of the attack', visited Pulse and other targets with him AND was there when he bought his arsenal of ammunition - but never called 911

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3641206/She-knew-Orlando-terrorist-s-wife-told-FBI-tried-talk-attack-cooperating-authorities.html#ixzz4BZxFcw8M
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Interesting development. It'll be pretty tough to justify not warning somebody.

I wonder what the story is behind that British (?) army shirt he's wearing in one of the photos in the article jjt linked to...?

 

[Remius]

 
Cool and that is accepted in Islam were? Because I saw a village of white Christians Lynch black guys before.... so that's Christianity right? Make sense? Just because idiots do something does not make it that they believe it is a religious need nor does it resemble the religion if it goes against that religions beliefs.

Really?  Seen it?  I've only heard and read about it.  No doubt also that some would be willing to keep at it if the law wouldn't stop them or if the rest of society wouldn't lynch them back.

I do get your point though.  Slavery in the US isn't that far off in their history and they fought a bloody internal conflict over it.  Something I think the Islamic world has yet to do (and may need, truth be told).  Back then, blacks had edited copies of the bible with things like exodus removed, for fear they might rebel against their owners.  Religion is sold a certain way based on the times, and the mood.

 

[mariomike]

I wonder what the story is behind that British (?) army shirt he's wearing in one of the photos in the article jjt linked to...?

He was also partial to NYPD attire.

 

[Remius]

Agreed, but then again I'd agree when any innocent blood is spilt period. But this discussion should happen on how to mitigate this .0 something percent into toothless muts.

Abdullah

This is key.  The 0.01 percent is convincing the world that that Islam isn't what the remaining 99.99% claims it to be.  So how does the 99.99 percent convince the world otherwise? 

You previously mentioned that blacks were lynched by whites before.  It used to be an acceptable act back then, even sanctioned.  So if a white comes in to shoot blacks today it isn't so much seen as whites vs blacks.  Just some black hating white guy bigot racists.  Because society there (and in the west in general  for  that matter) does not want to put up with that type of thing.  Western society won't tolerate that.  Black or white. 

Unfortunately, a good chunk of the Islamic world hates homosexuals.  So when a Muslim man walks into a gay bar and ends 49 lives it is very hard to not link him to his religion when the religion itself encourages hatred of a certain group.  While 0.01 percent are doing this, 99.99 percent aren't really doing much to convince us that it isn't  their way of thinking.

 

[AbdullahD]

Really?  Seen it?  I've only heard and read about it.  No doubt also that some would be willing to keep at it if the law wouldn't stop them or if the rest of society wouldn't lynch them back.

I do get your point though.  Slavery in the US isn't that far off in their history and they fought a bloody internal conflict over it.  Something I think the Islamic world has yet to do (and may need, truth be told).  Back then, blacks had edited copies of the bible with things like exodus removed, for fear they might rebel against their owners.  Religion is sold a certain way based on the times, and the mood.

Sorry, I have not seen it. Correct. I used that to convey my point. Which seems to have worked.

Also.... nevermind I won't get into civil war stuff here... that would thoroughly and completely derail this thread lol

But another thing is that these extremists are getting worse lately, back in history we did not have extremism like this. This is not necessarily a new thing, but in the way it is being carried out is new.

It is so sad at least to me everyone hears these isolated verses so much they become programed to thinking that is all there is and won't even entertain an opposing view.

But it is what it is. I thoroughly love these boards and Jarnhammer seems like a good guy but we all are each and every one of us programmed with our own version of the truth. I just wish I could sway him a little bit more to mine but alas me thinks that will not happen. But his replies dont even seem hostile so it is honestly refreshing, in a sense.

Whereas on other places I frequent.... it is not as... respectful.

Now also I will note if you did read the links Jarnhamar I didn't see you addressing the information in them and that is why I assumed you didn't. If you did please explain why you discounted them.

Remius, what more could we have done in this specific instance? We arranged prayers for the deceased denounced etc etc etc. What more do we need to do? Or is it a matter of people not watching? Also we are supposed to dislike the act of homosexuality not the homosexuals, which is something a lot of Muslims can't seem to do.

OK I'm trying to sleep here... so I'm out lol

Abdullah

 

[Loachman]

https://ca.style.yahoo.com/muslim-mans-post-on-donating-blood-after-orlando-171608774.html

Muslim man’s post on donating blood after Orlando shooting goes viral

Sarah Rohoman

June 13, 2016

Although some were quick to blame Islam for the act of terror that claimed 50 lives in Orlando early Sunday morning, Mahmoud ElAwadi’s Facebook post is a reminder of the good in the world.

“Yes my name is Mahmoud a proud Muslim American,” ElAwadi shared online. “Yes I donated blood even though I can’t eat or drink anything cause I’m fasting in our holy month Ramadan just like hundreds of other Muslims who donated today here in Orlando. Yes I’m sad, frustrated and mad that a crazy guy claim to be a Muslim did that shameful act.”

His post has been shared more than 125,000 times and has received positive responses from around the world.

“As a human this was the least I could for my fellow Americans who were injured,” ElAwadi said in an interview with Buzzfeed. “I know they need my blood. I had to give blood.”

ElAwadi goes on to explain that he witnessed the greatness of his country in the sheer amount of people that were lined up in the heat to donate even though they knew it would be a 5-7 hour wait.

He ends his post with this rallying statement:

“Yes our community in central Florida is heart broken but let’s put our colors, religions, ethnicity, sexual orientation, political views all aside so we can UNITE against those who are trying to hurt us.”

 

[jollyjacktar]

Nice to read that.

 

[mariomike]

ElAwadi goes on to explain that he witnessed the greatness of his country in the sheer amount of people that were lined up in the heat to donate even though they knew it would be a 5-7 hour wait.

Hopefully they keep it up for the rest of the long hot summer,

Orlando victims account for fewer than half of people killed with guns in America last weekend
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/orlando-fatally-shot-u-s-weekend-article-1.2672337

 

[Jarnhamar]

Hopefully they keep it up for the rest of the long hot summer,

Orlando victims account for fewer than half of people killed with guns in America last weekend
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/orlando-fatally-shot-u-s-weekend-article-1.2672337

Yup.  In Florida it's a tragedy,  in Chicago it's a Friday night. (Not saying that to take away from the attack)

 

[Jarnhamar]

The percentage, if that number is accurate is 0.01111111 percent.    Not that significant no.  But I'm more concerned about the impact that percentage can have.  clearly a big one.

Come on.  300'000 extremists?  There's probably 5 times that in Iraq and Syria alone. 

 

[mariomike]

Yup.  In Florida it's a tragedy,  in Chicago it's a Friday night. (Not saying that to take away from the attack)

Networks Cover Gorilla Death 54 Times More Than Chicago Shootings
http://www.truthrevolt.org/news/networks-cover-gorilla-death-54-times-more-chicago-shootings

2016
"Memorial Day weekend closes with 69 shot in Chicago"

 

[Teager]

Yup.  In Florida it's a tragedy,  in Chicago it's a Friday night. (Not saying that to take away from the attack)

Well 70 shootings within the last week.

https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Crime%20Statistics/1_pdfsam_CompStat%20Public%202016%20Week%2023.pdf

 

[Loachman]

Orlando victims account for fewer than half of people killed with guns in America last weekend
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/orlando-fatally-shot-u-s-weekend-article-1.2672337

I do not wish to get into an off-topic discussion/debate here, although that appears to be starting already, but this is a spurious article.

The largest proportion of US "gun deaths" are suicides. Suicide is means-independent, ie nobody intent on killing him/herself will change his/her mind merely because there is no convenient firearm. They will simply select another, equally lethal, method. Reducing "gun deaths" while driving up "rope deaths" or "bridge deaths" or "jump-in-front-of-train deaths" while leaving the overall suicide rate unchanged achieves nothing of value.

The next-largest proportion of US "gun deaths" are gang-related killings, either intentional or due to lack of target discrimination or shooting skills.

"Regular" murders represent only a small portion of the total.

Murder, like suicide, is also means-independent. There is no shortage of available methods of killing people, either individually or en masse. Eliminating every single firearm on this planet will not make much of a difference in murder rates, if any, or rates of other violent crimes. The violent will always be violent, until stopped by violence. It has always been so.

Focussing on a single means of suicide or murder is a fool's game. It achieves no benefit, and may have the opposite effect. Defensive uses of firearms, against human or animal aggressors, far outweigh criminal misuses of firearms in the US. Many more people likely remain alive and unharmed because of their enhanced ability to exercise their basic right to life, and seldom have to even fire a shot to do so. Criminals have no greater wish to die or be injured than anyone else, and will usually flee when their intended victims demonstrate a lack of need to co-operate with their predations.

The anti-gun crowd likes to deceive the naïve by talking about "gun deaths". They do not like guns, or fear them, but engaging in discussion about overall murder and violent crime rates works against them. The single most significant fact against their feeble arguments is that, over the last couple of decades, the US murder rate has dropped dramatically, while firearms ownership has risen, and almost all jurisdictions now permit open or concealed carry of defensive firearms, or both.

Criminals do not like to be shot.

The highest murder and violent crime rates are found in those larger US cities that "enjoy" strict firearms regulations, including up to outright bans. They are also havens for gang activity.

The anti-gun crowd will not allow themselves to acknowledge these simple truths. To them, an unarmed, raped, and strangled woman is more acceptable than a woman standing over the bleeding body of her would-be rapist while holding a warm pistol.

The anti-gun crowd also, inexplicably, cares not one whit about the stabbed, strangled, bludgeoned, poisoned, or burned. Only the shot matter to them. The means of death is more important, for some twisted reason, than the death itself.

 

[Remius]

Come on.  300'000 extremists?  There's probably 5 times that in Iraq and Syria alone.

I have no idea if 200,000 or 300,000 or 5 times that amount is accurate or not and neither do you it seems.  You asked if 200000 was a significant percentage or not.  I did the calculations.  It is not a significant number when taken against 1.8 Billion. 

Syria and Iraq make up a combined 50 million give or take. Not sure how many are Muslims though.  Then you would have to break it down by sect.  Also consider that the vast majority of Muslims aren't even in the Middle East.  The majority populate the Asia pacific rim. 

That being said, you would need 18 million extremists world wide to even get to 1%.  Seems high.

Ultimately my point is that a very small percentage is defining the vast majority.  Further to that the majority don't seem to be winning the propaganda war. so the question is what can the majority do to change that? 

 

[mariomike]

The means of death is more important, for some twisted reason, than the death itself.

Nothing new about death. It was our job and pension security! 

 

[Loachman]

The unpleasant side of humanity creates opportunity for many, sadly.

It has paid me well, too.

 

[mariomike]

The unpleasant side of humanity creates opportunity for many, sadly.

It has paid me well, too.

We joked about it. A lot.    They say it's a defence mechanism? I don't know.

But, all kidding aside, I wonder if this guy was expecting a reward more along this line?

Virgins in Heaven for Suicide bombers 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/63624.0;nowap

 

[Loachman]

All of the virgins are male Star Trek fans in their mid-thirties who still live in their parents' basements.