Ontario Majority Government 2022-2026 (?)

[Eaglelord17]

Can't really discuss the major difficulties of any province without discussing the feds because of the amount of money in transfers.

Where powers are divided, federal governments (not just here) offer money to entice lower levels of government to do things in the latters' areas of responsibility on terms the former dictate. There can be no guarantee the transfers will be sufficient in perpetuity.

This division creates poor incentives. The lowers constantly badger their upper for more money, but the upper has not much control over how well the lowers manage the money and the lowers insist on protecting their turf; the upper is reluctant to be on the hook without control. Something analogous to "responsibility without authority" results ("financial responsibility without authority"?). I would have thought the perils of those situations would be Poli Sci 001 material, understood and respected and avoided by all the bright people with advanced degrees from prestigious institutions who are running things.

Its almost as though the Feds shouldn’t be involved in healthcare to begin with. Its a provincial responsibility, the taxes for it should be raised provincially.

The feds don’t want that though as A) people in this country don’t understand the division of powers and how they work, often thinking provincial issues are federal, and
B) most those provincial issues people think are federal are the wedge issues most people care about (healthcare, education, resources, etc.).

 

[Brad Sallows]

The feds shouldn't, which is why we have an instance of the "do it our way, and we'll give you money" solution template. One advantage is that the federal government can correct for fiscal capacity imbalances, but it already has equalization for that. We got a top-down solution because that is the way socialists situate most of their estimates. The flaw with top-down solutions is that they stagnate and stifle innovation.

To have more health care capacity, we have to resource it. The most effective and efficient mechanism for coordinating resource allocation is pricing in a free market. One or more provinces will have to find the political balls to push the boundaries and figure out how to attract health care entrepreneurs without violating the Canada Health Act, or in a way which reorients public opinion to demand amendment of the CHA.

 

[The Bread Guy]

... One or more provinces will have to find the political balls to push the boundaries and figure out how to attract health care entrepreneurs without violating the Canada Health Act, or in a way which reorients public opinion to demand amendment of the CHA.

I've read that Alberta is pushing the envelope the hardest in this respect, with a fair bit of private-sector health care delivered to folks under single-payer. One source I've read (if I understand it correctly) says they stay within the lines that way, as well as barring people from paying to jump the queue to get services that are covered by provincial health insurance. Happy to hear how that's working from anyone living there.

 

[suffolkowner]

I think Long term care homes get a pretty good revenue stream. My mom went from a $2200 a month retirement home to a $3300 a month to a $6600 a month while awaiting placement in a nursing home which got $5800 per patient of which my mom paid $2800 the government the rest. There is no excuse for the poor service and care in LTC homes.


Before the 3rd wave of covid BC had apparently caught up with all their backlogged elective surgeries while Ontario and I guess other provinces continue to fall further behind. If true what is the reason?

Although we often claim to have a public health system it is really a public payer/insurer

Imaging is private enterprise (Not MRI??)
lab testing is private enterprise
Doctors are private enterprises
Dental is private enterprise
pharmaceuticals are private enterprises

Really the big one is in Hospital management and the fact that the government limits earnings and operations. We could do more cataract surgeries and hip replacements and MRI's if we wanted too

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The feds shouldn't, which is why we have an instance of the "do it our way, and we'll give you money" solution template. One advantage is that the federal government can correct for fiscal capacity imbalances, but it already has equalization for that. We got a top-down solution because that is the way socialists situate most of their estimates. The flaw with top-down solutions is that they stagnate and stifle innovation.

To have more health care capacity, we have to resource it. The most effective and efficient mechanism for coordinating resource allocation is pricing in a free market. One or more provinces will have to find the political balls to push the boundaries and figure out how to attract health care entrepreneurs without violating the Canada Health Act, or in a way which reorients public opinion to demand amendment of the CHA.

Use the same template they use when we go to private clinics for blood work, x-rays and colonoscopies. The idea that all medical procedures in Ontario are done by state owned doctors/nurses and hospitals is something we need to dispell. Doctors are not provincial employees. They are private entities set up by the doctor. We've had a private/provincial system forever. Provincial LTCs can operate as clinics, for all intents and purposes. Let Nurse Practitioners open their own clinics.

But yeah, the sacred cow of social medicine is a scam, that for some reason has become a mantra to misinformed Canadians. There are tons of instances of private entities working within our 'free' system.

 

[OceanBonfire]

UPDATE: Ontario court strikes down wage-limiting law for public sector workers

Groups representing several hundred thousand public sector employees challenged the constitutionality of Bill 124, a law passed in 2019 that limits wage increases at one per cent per year for Ontario Public Service employees as well as broader public sector workers.

ottawa.citynews.ca

Doug Ford government will appeal Ontario court decision to strike down Bill 124

The Ontario government intends to appeal a court's decision that struck down a controversial bill that limited wages for public sector workers.

toronto.ctvnews.ca

 

[brihard]

UPDATE: Ontario court strikes down wage-limiting law for public sector workers

Groups representing several hundred thousand public sector employees challenged the constitutionality of Bill 124, a law passed in 2019 that limits wage increases at one per cent per year for Ontario Public Service employees as well as broader public sector workers.

ottawa.citynews.ca

Doug Ford government will appeal Ontario court decision to strike down Bill 124

The Ontario government intends to appeal a court's decision that struck down a controversial bill that limited wages for public sector workers.

toronto.ctvnews.ca

That legal decision was inevitable, it just took a while to get there. A number of unions will be going at them for back pay now. I’m not sure why the government ever thought this kind of violation of collective bargaining rights was gonna fly. And of course, they’ve also just been read the riot act by organized labour on the political consequences of the Notwithstanding Clause. Ford’s up a creek on this one.

 

[Furniture]

That legal decision was inevitable, it just took a while to get there. A number of unions will be going at them for back pay now. I’m not sure why the government ever thought this kind of violation of collective bargaining rights was gonna fly. And of course, they’ve also just been read the riot act by organized labour on the political consequences of the Notwithstanding Clause. Ford’s up a creek on this one.

Unless he can delay things long enough for the current cost of living problems to hit average working people... Unionized public workers get sympathy when people aren't struggling to put food on the table. Unionized workers making more than most others aren't going to get much sympathy if private sector wages don't climb soon.

 

[brihard]

Unless he can delay things long enough for the current cost of living problems to hit average working people... Unionized public workers get sympathy when people aren't struggling to put food on the table. Unionized workers making more than most others aren't going to get much sympathy if private sector wages don't climb soon.

The law’s already struck down as a Charter breach. Ontario can appeal, but the law is still dead in the meantime. That means that any collective bargaining currently ongoing no longer has this as a statutory barrier. The province simply needs to actually push that at the bargaining table rather than hiding behind bad law.

Public sentiment does matter in big union negotiations, but it’s by no means a be-all end-all. Nurses in particular, as an essential workforce, have access to binding arbitration. Recent arbitration decisions have been capped by Bill 124, and now it’s of no force or effect. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them fight for past years too. And they should. It was an abusive and sexist law.

 

[suffolkowner]

The law’s already struck down as a Charter breach. Ontario can appeal, but the law is still dead in the meantime. That means that any collective bargaining currently ongoing no longer has this as a statutory barrier. The province simply needs to actually push that at the bargaining table rather than hiding behind bad law.

Public sentiment does matter in big union negotiations, but it’s by no means a be-all end-all. Nurses in particular, as an essential workforce, have access to binding arbitration. Recent arbitration decisions have been capped by Bill 124, and now it’s of no force or effect. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them fight for past years too. And they should. It was an abusive and sexist law.

Can they notwithstanding it?

Also Im surprised at the lack of attention to what looks like some obvious corruption with Ford/De Gasperis family and opening up land for development

 

[brihard]

Can they notwithstanding it?

Also Im surprised at the lack of attention to what looks like some obvious corruption with Ford/De Gasperis family and opening up land for development

Yes. S.2(d) of the Charter can be notwithstood. But they’d be on a crash course for a major brawl with labour if they tried to Notwithstanding crap against collective bargaining twice in quick succession. The province already faced that once and caved.

I think the possible government/developer corruption will be a slow burn, but will gain traction. Some property parcels in Ottawa are being identified too as having sold fairly questionably.

 

[suffolkowner]

Im not super in favour of the notwithstanding clause or cutting off collective bargaining but the Province has to be able to create budgets that drive down debt somehow. People are tired of the tax burden. Personally I have never had a government strike impact me in a negative way.

the real estate scam has to have an impact somehow. Im curious where it leads

 

[The Bread Guy]

So, lasting insider trading damage for Ford, or "not enough people feel strongly enough to care?" We'll see ...

Toronto, Canada and Global Breaking News – CP24

Most recent News News business news stories and video from CP24

www.cp24.com

From the Auditor General's info machine:

... Political staff had substantial control over the entire Greenbelt amendment exercise. The Housing Minister’s Chief of Staff provided a small team of non-political public service staff in the Housing Ministry the criteria to be used in the selection process, directed the team to alter the criteria to facilitate the selection of many sites provided by the Chief of Staff, and imposed a three-week timeline and confidentiality provisions, limiting the team’s time and ability to assess the land sites and provide alternatives. Even though hundreds of site removal requests had been submitted to the Housing Ministry since the Greenbelt was established in 2005, only 22 land sites were considered in the 2022 selection exercise. Of those, only one was proposed by the Housing Ministry’s non-political public service staff, while 21 were provided directly by the Housing Minister’s Chief of Staff. Of the 15 land sites ultimately approved for removal in December 2022, 14 were brought into the exercise by the Housing Minister’s Chief of Staff and one was identified by the Housing Ministry’s non-political public service staff. About 67% (4,900) of the approximately 7,400 acres ultimately removed from the Greenbelt are on two land sites for which information was given by two developers to the Chief of Staff in September 2022 at an industry function they all attended. One of these developers subsequently provided information on the removal on three additional land sites, one of which related to a third developer. Overall, 92% (6,800) of the approximately 7,400 acres ultimately removed from the Greenbelt related to five land sites involving three developers ...

More in the full report attached.

 

[IKnowNothing]

So, lasting insider trading damage for Ford, or "not enough people feel strongly enough to care?" We'll see ...

Toronto, Canada and Global Breaking News – CP24

Most recent News News business news stories and video from CP24

www.cp24.com

From the Auditor General's info machine:

More in the full report attached.

I'm leaning towards the latter, but by all rights this should be a massive scandal. The stench of this contaminates everything that has happened with this file over the last year- everything had the appearance of being overly solicitous to the wants of developers, cloaked in the veneer of being the solution to the housing crisis. Now it's blatantly clear that it's pure corrupt opportunism.

 

[lenaitch]

I'm leaning towards the latter, but by all rights this should be a massive scandal. The stench of this contaminates everything that has happened with this file over the last year- everything had the appearance of being overly solicitous to the wants of developers, cloaked in the veneer of being the solution to the housing crisis. Now it's blatantly clear that it's pure corrupt opportunism.

Normally I think it would be a massive scandal, but we don't seem to do that anymore, either at the provincial or federal level. Public fatigue? Partisanship? Urban/rural divide? I don't know, but this seems to be just the latest escapade in politicians playing fast and loose with their public trust.

It seems that Ford is "taking full responsibility", but not for what transpired. He takes full responsibility for 'a better process'; AKA, next time, they won't get caught out. He is unapologetic on his push for more housing, but it seems there was already enough land available in the so-called 'white belt'.

Without reading the A-G's report and the basis for her conclusions, media coverage sure makes it sound like the Housing Minister's Chief of Staff could find himself subject of a criminal investigation.

 

[Good2Golf]

Ford needs to score a few more ethical failures before he comes close to Federal level awesomeness.

 

[mariomike]

Public fatigue?

Could be. < shrug emoji

18% of Ontario voters handed Doug Ford a majority government. Whether that’s a bad thing depends who you ask

18% of Ontario voters handed Doug Ford a majority government. Whether that’s a bad thing depends who you ask

The 83 seats won by Ford’s Progressive Conservative party came from just 41 per cent of ballots cast by 43 per cent of all eligible voters.

www.insideottawavalley.com

 

[Furniture]

Could be. < shrug emoji

18% of Ontario voters handed Doug Ford a majority government. Whether that’s a bad thing depends who you ask

The 83 seats won by Ford’s Progressive Conservative party came from just 41 per cent of ballots cast by 43 per cent of all eligible voters.

www.insideottawavalley.com

If people can't bothered to vote, it likely indicates they aren't too worried about how government is working, or they don't trust the alternatives to be better.

The LPO, and NDP have nobody but themselves to blame for being distrusted by voters...

 

[Fishbone Jones]

If people can't bothered to vote, it likely indicates they aren't too worried about how government is working, or they don't trust the alternatives to be better.

The LPO, and NDP have nobody but themselves to blame for being distrusted by voters...

I was about to say, let's not forget the scandals that plagued the McWynnety governments.

 

[Eaglelord17]

Normally I think it would be a massive scandal, but we don't seem to do that anymore, either at the provincial or federal level. Public fatigue? Partisanship? Urban/rural divide? I don't know, but this seems to be just the latest escapade in politicians playing fast and loose with their public trust.

It seems that Ford is "taking full responsibility", but not for what transpired. He takes full responsibility for 'a better process'; AKA, next time, they won't get caught out. He is unapologetic on his push for more housing, but it seems there was already enough land available in the so-called 'white belt'.

Without reading the A-G's report and the basis for her conclusions, media coverage sure makes it sound like the Housing Minister's Chief of Staff could find himself subject of a criminal investigation.

Taking full responsibility would be enacting all 15 recommendations instead of 14. The one he refuses to enact is the most important one, i.e. the one which cancels the change in status.

Basically I acknowledge this was a corrupt process (which directly benefited my buddies, and likely me) but instead of undoing the corruption we shall just pretend it didn't happen and carry on. What a joke.