Question on Brownings and Tactical Holsters

[PJOsborne]

Sorry to revive this thread, but the contents are relevant to my line of inquiry. Amazing what happens when one searches for something, eh?  ;D

Long story short, I'm looking to get a Serpa 1911 holster for the issue BHP, after having done the CFSAC matches with a nylon setup that I wasn't fully pleased with. I just have one problem: how am I supposed to use the rig? the holster attaches to the "Paddle mount", but i'm totally lost after that. Does the Serpa system require a separate form of rigging, or is there a way to attach it to a PALS leg rig? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

edited to fix typo

 

[KevinB]

I have some SEVERE issues with the SERPA.
  I have a BHP 6004 if you want to check it out on loan...

 

[MG34]

I used the SERPA tactical rig while on TF 3-06 and for the pretraining, absolutly zero issues of any kind with the holster. There were no issues with clogging with sand,mud or anything else. I suspect that 90% of the bitching about the SERPA are based on " a friend of a friend", and usually well deserved Blackhawk bashing, well in this case they have got something right..
  I carried it through dust and rain storms, with no issues,the retention is excellent better I'd say than the 6004 series and you don't have to cut anythng to carry cocked and locked.
  The retention system is such that upon drawing the pistol your trigger finger indexes above the trigger guard, right where it sould be I found that during the raw stroke you can can get your hand in a more natural position than with the 6004 as the thumb has only to achieve it's normal place on the grip without doing anything else.
The SERPA Tactical leg platform is more comfortable than that on the 6004 and no modification is required to achieve this comfort.
    I own and use several 6004/6005 holsters, they are a good rig as well but I deployed with a SERPA and left them at home.

 

[Journeyman]

My Serpa Drop-Leg is sitting in the bottom of a barrack box somewhere. I prefer the CQC on my belt when inside, and "molle'ed" (is that a word) to my chest rig when going out; I've had zero problems with it, and it's smooth (and we all know, "smooth is fast"  )

Mind you, I'm also not with an operationally dysfunctional group that's charged people for "improper holsters"  :

 

[KevinB]

One of our guys uses the ligth mount one - with the odd hood - seems to work okay.

I'm a spaz, so I like to minimize my chances of incidents - I had no personal problems with the SERPA - but we had two ND's with them with DOS - and they shitcanned them after the FBI etc decerted them.  So from what I saw with the two ND's at the range - both happend on a times draw/turn fire routine - made me leery of using

Personally I use a Bladetech IWB in civvies - no retension 1M rule 
Jocked up - the 6004 works for me since my 1911, Glock, Sig etc. have X200's
- I've high cut all mine and run them just below my armor level.

 

[PJOsborne]

I've looked at the Safariland, and I think that i'm going to go with the Serpa for no other reason than the draw is more natural, at least to me. I'm still totally lost as to how to wear it as a thigh mount though. Can someone shed some light?

 

[Fraser.g]

Now granted, I was a Kafasaurus on my tour but found that this one from OST fit the bill for my time in the sandbox. http://www.oneshottactical.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=oneshot&Product_Code=HO-HSGIDropHolster&Category_Code=HO

The issue one is a total POS even for us behind the wire.  I replaced it as soon as I possibly could.

 

[medaid]

Oh yeah, that HSGI one is nice I played with it in the store... well I touched it... picked it up and set it down and moved on to Safariland stuff but hey, it was a nice holster I had to admit that!

 

[PJOsborne]

Update: I found an Ebay store that had the Serpa holster and the proprietary thigh rig, in OD no less. As far as I know, the paddle mount is for your belt. An added bonus was that since the store was in the US, i actually saved a little money on the price, although to be fair, i ended up coughing those savings right into my shipping fees :blotto:

 

[DesertVengeance]

safariland.  HANDS DOWN.  Outstanding holster in every way.  I've yet to be beaten by anyone on a timed draw and i'm not that good.  Transitioning is just ridiculously easy... which is nice when the only other thing your carrying is a C6.  It's comfortable as anything, you could bash that sucker for 20 minutes and unless you hit that release catch that sucker isn't coming out.  The one made for the beretta 92FS fits the browning fine.

 

[mudgunner49]

safariland.  HANDS DOWN.  Outstanding holster in every way.  I've yet to be beaten by anyone on a timed draw and i'm not that good.  Transitioning is just ridiculously easy... which is nice when the only other thing your carrying is a C6.  It's comfortable as anything, you could bash that sucker for 20 minutes and unless you hit that release catch that sucker isn't coming out.  The one made for the beretta 92FS fits the browning fine.

I don't know what your definition of "fine" is, but the fit of these holsters is pretty specific.  The Beretta 92 is a large pistola and the BHP is significantly slimmer so I really don't think that it would fit all that well at all.  Unless I personally tested this, I would have to view it as "bad data"...

YMMV (a lot)

blake

 

[medaid]

I really doubt that it fits it fine. All of Safariland's holsters are thermal molded around their intended pistols. Even though the BHP MAY in fact fit into the holster, I don't think its retention and stability is as good as it would be if it were holstered in the 6004-1376-121 (with hammer down) or the 6004-76-121.

The fact that the length of either weapons' are not the same also raises the question of whether said holster would be adequate in retaining the pistol. The BHP BBL being 4.625" and the Berreta 92FS BBL being 4.9". This by the way is a direct quote from Safariland's website under the 6004 drop leg holster page here -----> http://www.safariland.com/product.aspx?pid=6004 The fact is they don't even have the same model number.... leads me to question your statement further. However, maybe someone else who possesses both firearms and the 6004 holster can clear it up and give the final yay or nay.

 

[Loachman]

And what's with the colours on these? That page says "Available in Brown Flat Dark Earth, Olive Tactical Green or Black finishes", but further down, where it lists all of the individual models, it only gives "Tactical Black" for each - no other colour options. Are these, in fact, available in OG or Tan, or not?

 

[Kendrick]

Some CWO somewhere didn't have any fancy holster, and ordered the entire TF to use Bianchi's POS, and now everyone gets charged left and right for using proper holsters. 

 

[medaid]

Loachman,

  I think they do come in tan/coyote what ever they wanna call it. You just gotta ask them.

 

[MG34]

I really doubt that it fits it fine. All of Safariland's holsters are thermal molded around their intended pistols. Even though the BHP MAY in fact fit into the holster, I don't think its retention and stability is as good as it would be if it were holstered in the 6004-1376-121 (with hammer down) or the 6004-76-121.

The fact that the length of either weapons' are not the same also raises the question of whether said holster would be adequate in retaining the pistol. The BHP BBL being 4.625" and the Berreta 92FS BBL being 4.9". This by the way is a direct quote from Safariland's website under the 6004 drop leg holster page here -----> http://www.safariland.com/product.aspx?pid=6004 The fact is they don't even have the same model number.... leads me to question your statement further. However, maybe someone else who possesses both firearms and the 6004 holster can clear it up and give the final yay or nay.

The holsters are not interchangable, the Browning will drop into the Beretta holster but will not be fully secured as the holster is NOT designed to retain it properly, it about s ill advised as sticking a Browning into a Bianchi UM-84 Holster and making troops use it. It can be done,as can playing in traffic  but neither is a good practice.

 

[medaid]

Well that confirms it MG34 has spoken ;D

 

[mudgunner49]

I really doubt that it fits it fine. All of Safariland's holsters are thermal molded around their intended pistols. Even though the BHP MAY in fact fit into the holster, I don't think its retention and stability is as good as it would be if it were holstered in the 6004-1376-121 (with hammer down) or the 6004-76-121.

The fact that the length of either weapons' are not the same also raises the question of whether said holster would be adequate in retaining the pistol. The BHP BBL being 4.625" and the Berreta 92FS BBL being 4.9". This by the way is a direct quote from Safariland's website under the 6004 drop leg holster page here -----> http://www.safariland.com/product.aspx?pid=6004 The fact is they don't even have the same model number.... leads me to question your statement further. However, maybe someone else who possesses both firearms and the 6004 holster can clear it up and give the final yay or nay.

Yeah - that too.  I was just making an (admittedly poor) attempt at being PC and mentoring...


blake

 

[fletchsd]

This is my first post on this site, I finally feel I have something to say worth something.
I have also been trying out quite a few holsters for the browning.  Here are a few things I have found, and I'll try to stick to comfort, security, and operation under high stress.  (By high stress I mean loss of fine motor skills)
I had the issued Bianchi holster (http://www.bianchi-intl.com/product/Prod.php?TxtModelID=UM84III)  for Roto 8 Op Palladium and although secure, it had several problems.  The dropleg thigh adapter is very stiff and is a poor choice when getting in and out of vehicles and can be uncomfortable.  The big flap makes drawing quickly very difficult and in a high stress situation the little hook on the bottom is hard to manipulate.  Overall it is my last choice.

I then purchased the Blackhawk Omega VI dropleg with thumb break for the browning/1911  (http://www.blackhawk.com/product1.asp?P=40MLH1&C=C0902) .  Fits the browning great, and the dropleg is more comfortable than the Bianchi, but a good belt is required to attach it to.  The elastic thigh straps are great compared to the in-elastic single Bianchi straps.  Quick draw with the thumb break, HOWEVER, the thumb break strap doesn't work well when the pistol is cocked.  So, drawing is quick, but then you have to ready it, costing time.  Reholstering blind is sometimes difficult but muscle memory practice can fix that.

Next try was the issued black safariland. http://www.safariland.com/product.aspx?pid=6004 . The thumbreak style is much better with the rotating head than the Omega's strap, and the molded plastic is fantastic for drawing speed.  I really like the comfort of the molded plastic platform that rests against your leg as well.  However, the problem I have with the rotating thumb break is that you are drawing the pistol with your 4 fingers and don't get your thumb around the grip until the band is rotated forward.  This costs very little time, but hey, we are being picky on purpose here right?  On that note, the fit of the browning in the holster isn't perfect too.

The Serpa level 2 tactical thigh (http://www.blackhawk.com/product1.asp?P=43050&C=C2094)  is what I am using now and for me, is by far the best!  I purchased the dropleg version that is made for the 1911.  One problem.  The pistol fit perfectly, but the slide locking lever pin on the right side sticks out causing the operation of the release to get caught on the pin!  So, easy fix with the gerber.  A small groove cut in the release makes this holster as smooth as butter.  (I'll add a pic of the groove i cut) I like it better than the safariland because your hand is in a perfect grip from the start, the pistol can be readied and on safe in the holster, and your trigger finger is automatically lined up with the trigger guard.  It has a large open top so re-holstering blind is easy.  Comfort wise it is the best!  Big molded plastic back and elastic leg straps are super comfortable and it has two drop down straps from your belt so they don't get in the way of your pocket.  Plus, the LCF is very high with this holster.
I liked it so much that I bought the smaller duty belt version and attached it with malice strips to my tac vest in a cross draw position.  I like the cross draw for quick transition drills and when working in tight spaces.  It is very quick to draw and punch out but I have had it catch on my sling a few times.
I'll be adding pictures of my rig as soon as I take them so you have a better idea.
Overall, I recommend the Serpa to the troops in my coy, the only downside is cost.

 

[MG34]

I've never had to mod a SERPA  to fit the Browning (both belt or tactical thigh mounted), I shudder to say this but it is the only piece of Blackhawk kit I would recommend to anyone.