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Great response Rick, glad we got someone like you on the CFs side.
Rick Mercer Fights Back!
- Thread starter simysmom99
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Rick, Thank You! 
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I'm a man but if it was possible to give birth to Rick Mercer's children, I would do it.
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Infantry_wannabe said:
Now that is down right creepy, get you back to radio chatter and stay there for a day or so...
dileas
tess
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First of all, kudos to Rick Mercer. I love that guy. Not just for this article and his endless support of the CF, but just his ongoing political commentary (in a humorous fashion) is terrific. As somebody else said, a true 100% Canadian.
Second, there were a few things I find interesting in her article.
You know, we hear this alot but what is the evidence to back it up? Where is this newer, stronger Taliban? Have I been missing something, but it seems to me that the Taliban keep getting their rear ends handed to them by the ISAF. Yes, there is the "new offensive" in the Spring coming, but it sounds like the ISAF is ready for it. I predict there will be more of the same in A'stan. The Taliban being forced into battles from fixed positions and they'll be annihilated. The Taliban will continue to ambush, and the ISAF will continue to counter ambush and beat them silly. The Taliban will continue to plant IEDs and conduct suicide bombings and the bulk of the casualties they cause will be this way.
I find this to be particularly ironic taken in the context of the quote above, and the entire claim that the West cannot win militarily. In Vietnam the US forces did win militarily. Following the Tet Offensive, the Viet Cong were all but eliminated (and I mean eliminated, not reduced, not nothing but eliminated) as a fighting force. The NVA suffered 45,000 deaths and an unknown number of wounded although estimated at perhaps 2-3 times the number of dead (note, prior to the Tet they had roughly 330,000 total troops). Some estimates put their combat strength as being reduced by 80%!!!
What happened in Vietnam is the political and popular will eroded because of media reports. The so-called "credibility gap" widened to a point where the gov't could no longer sustain the conflict.
Sound familiar at all?
I'd say we can have a military victory in A'stan. We can reduce or eliminate the Taliban. They can only sustain so many casualties. It isn't endless hordes of clones coming out of vats and test tubes. Eventually, they Taliban will be put into the same position the VC and NVA were put into. Make a big offensive, or lose via attrition. Either way they lose ... but here's the key ... they lose militarily.
Can we sustain the political and popular will to see it through or will we indeed have another Vietnam thanks to people like her?
Ahhh... the mandatory Bush bashing. You just can't have an anti-war article without some good old fashioned Bush bashing. What exactly has Bush done to maintain his grip on power? Has he suspended elections in the US? Nope. Executed his political rivals? Nope. Outlawed his political rivals? Nope. Sent death squads around to kill people who don't follow his rules? Nope. Executed women for teaching? Nope. etc. etc. etc.
So what exactly has he done that compares him to the Taliban? I tell you what.. if in Feb 2009 President Bush is still President of the United States of America. If he has usurped the political process there and declared himself president-for-life, AND the Unitied States armed forces haven't risen up to throw his a** out for usurping the political freedom of their nation, let me know, and then we'll start to compare Bush to the Taliban.
Second, there were a few things I find interesting in her article.
You know, we hear this alot but what is the evidence to back it up? Where is this newer, stronger Taliban? Have I been missing something, but it seems to me that the Taliban keep getting their rear ends handed to them by the ISAF. Yes, there is the "new offensive" in the Spring coming, but it sounds like the ISAF is ready for it. I predict there will be more of the same in A'stan. The Taliban being forced into battles from fixed positions and they'll be annihilated. The Taliban will continue to ambush, and the ISAF will continue to counter ambush and beat them silly. The Taliban will continue to plant IEDs and conduct suicide bombings and the bulk of the casualties they cause will be this way.
I find this to be particularly ironic taken in the context of the quote above, and the entire claim that the West cannot win militarily. In Vietnam the US forces did win militarily. Following the Tet Offensive, the Viet Cong were all but eliminated (and I mean eliminated, not reduced, not nothing but eliminated) as a fighting force. The NVA suffered 45,000 deaths and an unknown number of wounded although estimated at perhaps 2-3 times the number of dead (note, prior to the Tet they had roughly 330,000 total troops). Some estimates put their combat strength as being reduced by 80%!!!
What happened in Vietnam is the political and popular will eroded because of media reports. The so-called "credibility gap" widened to a point where the gov't could no longer sustain the conflict.
Sound familiar at all?
I'd say we can have a military victory in A'stan. We can reduce or eliminate the Taliban. They can only sustain so many casualties. It isn't endless hordes of clones coming out of vats and test tubes. Eventually, they Taliban will be put into the same position the VC and NVA were put into. Make a big offensive, or lose via attrition. Either way they lose ... but here's the key ... they lose militarily.
Can we sustain the political and popular will to see it through or will we indeed have another Vietnam thanks to people like her?
Ahhh... the mandatory Bush bashing. You just can't have an anti-war article without some good old fashioned Bush bashing. What exactly has Bush done to maintain his grip on power? Has he suspended elections in the US? Nope. Executed his political rivals? Nope. Outlawed his political rivals? Nope. Sent death squads around to kill people who don't follow his rules? Nope. Executed women for teaching? Nope. etc. etc. etc.
So what exactly has he done that compares him to the Taliban? I tell you what.. if in Feb 2009 President Bush is still President of the United States of America. If he has usurped the political process there and declared himself president-for-life, AND the Unitied States armed forces haven't risen up to throw his a** out for usurping the political freedom of their nation, let me know, and then we'll start to compare Bush to the Taliban.
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Michael O'Leary said:
I have sent her an email asking if there is part of the article missing.....I actually did not really sit down to read it until last night....
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Perhaps she is an example of how over the years our universities have been 'Granting' Degrees to functionally illiterate people.
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Perhaps, but if I agree am I considered illierate
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William Webb Ellis said:
I suppose we could. ;D
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Wow Rick is awesome. They are having a mess dinner in Shearwater in April with him.....should be lively!
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George Wallace said:
Just checking your attention to detail........... :
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Got the complete article her it is......
Independent 12 01 07
Noreen Golfman
Blowing in the wind . . .
Between mouthfuls of fruitcake and blissful stretches of catch-up sleep, you couldn’t ignore the war (oh, sorry, is that peaceful restoration work?) in Afghanistan during the holiday season if you tried. On the one hand, you were given license to let go and savour slow food, idle afternoons, and the constant pleasure of friends and family—in other words, fully appreciate the privileges of life in the West; on the other hand, you were constantly reminded of Our Boys our on patrol, eating reconstituted turkey in the Afghan desert—in other words, invited to feel guilty for not chowing down sand and fighting the war on terror.
Every time you opened a newspaper or listened to the news, especially on the CBC, you were compelled to reach for the box of tissues. If it wasn’t a story about some poor sod’s legs being blown off then it was an extended interview with some dead soldier’s parents. Indulging in another bite of dark chocolate was meant to be more painful this year. Here, have a plate of guilt with your second helping, my dear, and pass the self-reproach.
Amidst all the cranked up sentimentality and the daily barrage of stories from the likes of reporter Christy ‘one of the boys’ Blatchford or Peter ‘not exactly on the front lines’ Mansbridge, The Globe and Mail’s television columnist, John Doyle, dared to question the nature of the coverage. Doyle openly wondered, as is his right and responsibility, what in the world the public broadcaster was doing, let alone his own privately owned newspaper, devoting so much mawkish attention to the Canadian troops?
It’s one thing to pay full respect to the men (and some women) who have chosen a life in uniform and are therefore more or less voluntarily enduring punishing conditions, risking their lives many thousands of miles away from the comforts of home.
It is another to report on their presence in that unfamiliar place without so much as a hint that they don’t belong there, that the campaign to restore order and keep the Taliban from returning to power might be doomed, that blood is obviously begetting blood and that Canadians, and especially the Newfoundlanders who comprise such a disproportionate percentage of the overseas troops (compare with the number of African-Americans fighting in the doomed project of Viet Nam), are destined to return in body bags.
Shouldn’t we—the media, our public intellectual, citizens in general—at least be questioning, not merely glorifying or going sloppy over this fact?
Any time anyone questions the coverage, as Doyle did and as this column is venturing to do, you can practically hear the rage mounting in the neck veins of the military huggers. Peter Mansbridge threw a public hissy fit, obviously protesting too much. And Doyle told his readers that he’d been receiving some pretty nasty hate mail after his columns in December, not surprising, really, when you consider how defensive people are about the troops. I expect I’ll get some ugly stuff, too. It is a trite irony that you are chastised for daring to question the purpose of the military mission when that very mission is allegedly about restoring democracy and freedom of speech.
Which leads me to kick at another sacred cow--that is, Rick Mercer and that whole lot of star Newfoundlanders who went over to entertain Our Boys (and Girls) over Christmas, reportedly flown to unmarked destinations and, presumably, forced to share some dehydrated food and wear really ugly clothing for a few days.
What in the world is going on? Where are the protest songs of yesteryear? I guess, when General Rick ‘MUN Graduate’ Hiller invites you to come along and share the joy ride you have to join up faster than you can say ‘Bob Hope is dead.’ Reading Mercer’s widely circulated piece on the joys of serving gravy to the grateful Canadian boys was almost as painful as watching Peter McKay flirt with Condoleezza ‘Condee’ Rice.
Just when did the worm turn? When was it suddenly acceptable for your garden variety progressive, satire-loving celebrity to hug the troops, praise military actions, and pass the ammunition without so much as a hint of dissent or any questioning of the value of the mission, not to mention its obviously USA-linked agenda? Can you imagine popular talk show host Jon Stewart flying overseas over for a few feel-good shows in Iraq?
What looking-glass world have Rick and his talented cronies walked into?
Inevitably, in the United States the right-wing White House mongers who first encouraged the post 9/11 invasion of Iraq are now retreating faster than a camel in heat. It’s taken an awfully long time and thousands of body bags, but public opinion is finally forcing an undignified about face. The buzzword for 2007 is ‘exit strategy.’
But not here, not if you listen to Stephen Harper, not if you are getting all warm and fuzzy about how meaningful it is to stand in line waiting for a double double at the Tim Horton’s shop in Kandahar, not if Christy Blanchard’s columns make you cry, and you want to make Rick Mercer and his buddies honourary soldiers.
It is really hard to see how the road to open debate, let alone peace, can be paved with military offensives and the song and laugh shows of Newfoundland talent, and there is something deeply disturbing about the unquestioning belief that it can.
Independent 12 01 07
Noreen Golfman
Blowing in the wind . . .
Between mouthfuls of fruitcake and blissful stretches of catch-up sleep, you couldn’t ignore the war (oh, sorry, is that peaceful restoration work?) in Afghanistan during the holiday season if you tried. On the one hand, you were given license to let go and savour slow food, idle afternoons, and the constant pleasure of friends and family—in other words, fully appreciate the privileges of life in the West; on the other hand, you were constantly reminded of Our Boys our on patrol, eating reconstituted turkey in the Afghan desert—in other words, invited to feel guilty for not chowing down sand and fighting the war on terror.
Every time you opened a newspaper or listened to the news, especially on the CBC, you were compelled to reach for the box of tissues. If it wasn’t a story about some poor sod’s legs being blown off then it was an extended interview with some dead soldier’s parents. Indulging in another bite of dark chocolate was meant to be more painful this year. Here, have a plate of guilt with your second helping, my dear, and pass the self-reproach.
Amidst all the cranked up sentimentality and the daily barrage of stories from the likes of reporter Christy ‘one of the boys’ Blatchford or Peter ‘not exactly on the front lines’ Mansbridge, The Globe and Mail’s television columnist, John Doyle, dared to question the nature of the coverage. Doyle openly wondered, as is his right and responsibility, what in the world the public broadcaster was doing, let alone his own privately owned newspaper, devoting so much mawkish attention to the Canadian troops?
It’s one thing to pay full respect to the men (and some women) who have chosen a life in uniform and are therefore more or less voluntarily enduring punishing conditions, risking their lives many thousands of miles away from the comforts of home.
It is another to report on their presence in that unfamiliar place without so much as a hint that they don’t belong there, that the campaign to restore order and keep the Taliban from returning to power might be doomed, that blood is obviously begetting blood and that Canadians, and especially the Newfoundlanders who comprise such a disproportionate percentage of the overseas troops (compare with the number of African-Americans fighting in the doomed project of Viet Nam), are destined to return in body bags.
Shouldn’t we—the media, our public intellectual, citizens in general—at least be questioning, not merely glorifying or going sloppy over this fact?
Any time anyone questions the coverage, as Doyle did and as this column is venturing to do, you can practically hear the rage mounting in the neck veins of the military huggers. Peter Mansbridge threw a public hissy fit, obviously protesting too much. And Doyle told his readers that he’d been receiving some pretty nasty hate mail after his columns in December, not surprising, really, when you consider how defensive people are about the troops. I expect I’ll get some ugly stuff, too. It is a trite irony that you are chastised for daring to question the purpose of the military mission when that very mission is allegedly about restoring democracy and freedom of speech.
Which leads me to kick at another sacred cow--that is, Rick Mercer and that whole lot of star Newfoundlanders who went over to entertain Our Boys (and Girls) over Christmas, reportedly flown to unmarked destinations and, presumably, forced to share some dehydrated food and wear really ugly clothing for a few days.
What in the world is going on? Where are the protest songs of yesteryear? I guess, when General Rick ‘MUN Graduate’ Hiller invites you to come along and share the joy ride you have to join up faster than you can say ‘Bob Hope is dead.’ Reading Mercer’s widely circulated piece on the joys of serving gravy to the grateful Canadian boys was almost as painful as watching Peter McKay flirt with Condoleezza ‘Condee’ Rice.
Just when did the worm turn? When was it suddenly acceptable for your garden variety progressive, satire-loving celebrity to hug the troops, praise military actions, and pass the ammunition without so much as a hint of dissent or any questioning of the value of the mission, not to mention its obviously USA-linked agenda? Can you imagine popular talk show host Jon Stewart flying overseas over for a few feel-good shows in Iraq?
What looking-glass world have Rick and his talented cronies walked into?
Inevitably, in the United States the right-wing White House mongers who first encouraged the post 9/11 invasion of Iraq are now retreating faster than a camel in heat. It’s taken an awfully long time and thousands of body bags, but public opinion is finally forcing an undignified about face. The buzzword for 2007 is ‘exit strategy.’
But not here, not if you listen to Stephen Harper, not if you are getting all warm and fuzzy about how meaningful it is to stand in line waiting for a double double at the Tim Horton’s shop in Kandahar, not if Christy Blanchard’s columns make you cry, and you want to make Rick Mercer and his buddies honourary soldiers.
It is really hard to see how the road to open debate, let alone peace, can be paved with military offensives and the song and laugh shows of Newfoundland talent, and there is something deeply disturbing about the unquestioning belief that it can.
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Oh my. That deserves a response from me!
She just doesn't get it. It was Mercer's choice to go, although the "Big Guy" can be very persuasive if he wants to be.
She just doesn't get it. It was Mercer's choice to go, although the "Big Guy" can be very persuasive if he wants to be.
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simysmom99 said:
In the interests of brevity you could just have ended after "She just doesn't get it." :
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Opinionated little cuss ain’t she. I kind of liked the original bit with the missing sections better . While confusing it was at least are not as vitriolic as the full article. Any doubts (and there were none) that this woman is in dire need of a cyber throat punch or at least a reality check are now gone.
I really do love the oh so patronizing comparison between Newfoundlanders serving in Afghanistan and Afro Americans in Vietnam. This of course from a self declared, self appointed member of the Intelligentsia at MUN. Many of whom are “Come From Aways”, including Ms Golfman if memory serves me, who often look down on the native born Newfoundlanders, and all but replaced the Brit robber barons who ran the place a century ago as the political, academic, social elite (at least in their own minds) and wonder why the ungrateful natives ain’t all lined up smiling and tugging the forelocks in gratitude for being force fed the PC tripe that is spewed from the edifice on Elizabeth Avenue.
The passage about expecting to receive hate mail in response to her views also sounds almost like a challenge to us. A badge of honour she can wear at the next gathering of the cap and gown clad sheeple. Sometime tells me that she won’t be disappointed by the volume of negative responses she has and/or will be receiving over this. However that fact that us poor knuckle dragging war mongers are able to convey our disgust in coherent sentences and words of more than four letters may come as a surprise to her.
Anyway it appears that she’s also rather opinionated on other matters too. Fortunately between her various committees, other events and writing to tell us how to think and act, she must not have too much time left over to “teach.” Which I feel is a small mercy for the next generation of MUN undergrads.
A few random excerts from a five second Google search:
http://www.fedcan.ca/english/about/exec/bionotes-golfman.cfm
http://www.friends.ca/News/Friends_News/archives/articles02110501.asp
http://friendscb.org/Resource/briefs/policy05130401.asp
http://www.friends.ca/news/letters/letters04250101.asp
http://misc-iecm.mcgill.ca/media/golfman.pdf
http://www.media-awareness.ca/english/resources/articles/sovereignty_identity/watch_wish.cfm
EDIT: If my above passage was lengthy, long winded, and hard to read, remember in my defence Noreen Golfman was my English Prof at MUN. 8)
I really do love the oh so patronizing comparison between Newfoundlanders serving in Afghanistan and Afro Americans in Vietnam. This of course from a self declared, self appointed member of the Intelligentsia at MUN. Many of whom are “Come From Aways”, including Ms Golfman if memory serves me, who often look down on the native born Newfoundlanders, and all but replaced the Brit robber barons who ran the place a century ago as the political, academic, social elite (at least in their own minds) and wonder why the ungrateful natives ain’t all lined up smiling and tugging the forelocks in gratitude for being force fed the PC tripe that is spewed from the edifice on Elizabeth Avenue.
The passage about expecting to receive hate mail in response to her views also sounds almost like a challenge to us. A badge of honour she can wear at the next gathering of the cap and gown clad sheeple. Sometime tells me that she won’t be disappointed by the volume of negative responses she has and/or will be receiving over this. However that fact that us poor knuckle dragging war mongers are able to convey our disgust in coherent sentences and words of more than four letters may come as a surprise to her.
Anyway it appears that she’s also rather opinionated on other matters too. Fortunately between her various committees, other events and writing to tell us how to think and act, she must not have too much time left over to “teach.” Which I feel is a small mercy for the next generation of MUN undergrads.
A few random excerts from a five second Google search:
http://www.fedcan.ca/english/about/exec/bionotes-golfman.cfm
http://www.friends.ca/News/Friends_News/archives/articles02110501.asp
http://friendscb.org/Resource/briefs/policy05130401.asp
http://www.friends.ca/news/letters/letters04250101.asp
http://misc-iecm.mcgill.ca/media/golfman.pdf
http://www.media-awareness.ca/english/resources/articles/sovereignty_identity/watch_wish.cfm
EDIT: If my above passage was lengthy, long winded, and hard to read, remember in my defence Noreen Golfman was my English Prof at MUN. 8)
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Can you please explain "brevity". I am not sure how "being brief" should come into play in my opinion on the subject.
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simysmom99 said:
Simysmom,
I think that was the Padre's way of making a sarcastic remark about the article originator.
I think he's wanting to employ that K.I.S.S. rule for her because she just doesn't get it. ;D
Edited to clarify: By employing the KISS rule, I mean no offense to anyone who posts on this site, or Rick Mercer's site either!!
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After reading this thread and all its response's. Audra you are right she just doesn't get it.
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