RMC Officer Sues to Avoid Saluting, Toasting Queen?

[brihard]

While I hope we are someday freed from the facade of the Monarchy, I am glad and grateful to be living in Canada. If Canadians want this "Royal" illusion then I will fight for their right to believe it, I am just glad none of those Royal dim wits actually order us or lead us into battle.

I will now prepare myself to be flamed. 

I would point out, sir, that Prince Harry - one of those 'royal dimwits' - may well presently be leading his armoured troop in battle in the Basra region with the Blues and Royals. Prince Phillip served in the Second World War in the navy. Prince Andrew served in the Falklands and decoyed Exocets. I'm sure I've missed a few others.

Might I suggest that insulting them as you did is akin to insulting any competent officer, sir? It reflects poorly only upon yourself when you attack officers with some rather impressive service records. Though they may serve in the forces of another nation, perhaps the term 'superior' officer may not be inappropriate given the circumstances. Moreover, to blatantly attack the integrity of the oath oneself has sworn cannot help but to cast you in a poor light. Would you tell your troops that the oath they swore is bunk, sir?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Teacher at RMC, OK.  But soldier first.  If he is so against saluting, then deploy this 'soldier' to Afghanistan where there is no saluting outside the wire.  He should be pleased as punch to be in such an enviroment me thinks.  Oh, but wait, maybe he is against real soldiering as well. 

Those that can....do. Those that can't.......teach.

I know that's not fair to most instructors or teachers, but in this case it's more than apt. This guy got what he wanted from the military and now wants out of his contract, preferring a big pay out to make him go away.

Speaking of whales, this guy is even lower than their excrement.

 

[KevinB]

Teacher at RMC, OK.  But soldier first.  If he is so against saluting, then deploy this 'soldier' to Afghanistan where there is no saluting outside the wire.  He should be pleased as punch to be in such an enviroment me thinks.  Oh, but wait, maybe he is against real soldiering as well. 

I can just see this guy as your Pl Comd    I wonder if having your driver run him over would be illegal?  I'm sure I could make a better case for running him over than he can make for not saluting...

 

[Roy Harding]

Cardstonkid:

I wonder if the CO of 18 AD Regt (not 18th as your profile has it) frequents these means?  I wonder if he's as amused as I am regarding your position here.

You're on duty and represent the CROWN 24/7, Sir.


Roy

 

[Bane]

"Military historian Jack Granatstein said the complaint raises a debatable point, but one better addressed when a Canadian Forces member first takes the oath.
It's actually a question of substantial principle, but he should have worked out that question of conscience when he enlisted," he said."

I normally don't like others doing my thinking for me , but I agree with Jack.
After sixty books he's got his 'sum up a debate in two sentences' skill down nicely.

 

[Stetson and Spurs]

Canadian Law by virtue of the Constitution Act, 1982 states quite clearly that the Queen is the Head of State being referred to as the Queen of Canada. I think it will be interesting to see how this person makes a Charter argument against the Charter...

 

[gaspasser]

I would point out, sir, that Prince Harry - one of those 'royal dimwits' - may well presently be leading his armoured troop in battle in the Basra region with the Blues and Royals. Prince Phillip served in the Second World War in the navy. Prince Andrew served in the Falklands and decoyed Exocets. I'm sure I've missed a few others.

During WW2, Princes' Elizabeth and Margerate learned to drive and shuttled wounded soldiers to and from hospitals.  At the time, it was the only thing the princess' were allowed to do.  But do they did!

 

[Pikache]

I see no further merit in allowing this thread to continue as I see more chance of mudslinging and flaming.

-The Army.ca Staff

 

[Bigmac]

Officer’s lawsuit against allegiance to Queen dismissed
Meagan Fitzpatrick and Phil Couvrette,  Canwest News Service 
Published: Monday, January 21, 2008


OTTAWA -- A member of the Canadian military who launched a court case around his refusal to pledge allegiance to the Queen had his Federal Court application dismissed Monday.

Capt. Aralt Mac Giolla Chainnigh argued that he was subjected to a form of "institutional harassment" by having to pay respect and show loyalty to the Queen or the Union Jack.

He launched a grievance in 2001 with the military which was later rejected by the Chief of Defence Staff Gen. Rick Hillier. He then asked the Federal Court to review Gen. Hillier's decision. In the decision released Monday, Justice R.L. Barnes wrote that the military was "both correct in law and reasonable" to reject his grievance.

"I cannot think of any Canadian institution where an expectation of loyalty and respect for the Queen would be more important than the Canadian Forces," Judge Barnes wrote in the 27-page judgment. "Whether Capt. Mac Giolla Chainnigh likes it or not, the fact is that the Queen is his Commander-in-Chief and Canada's Head of State. A refusal to display loyalty and respect to the Queen where required by Canadian Forces' policy would not only be an expression of profound disrespect and rudeness but it would also represent an unwillingness to adhere to hierarchical and lawful command structures that are fundamental to good discipline."

Capt. Chainnigh, a member of the military since 1975 and an associate professor of physics at the Royal Military College in Kingston, Ont., has "consistently expressed his disaffection for the British monarchy," according to court documents. He claimed that having to sing God Save the Queen, toasting the Queen as the Head of State of Canada, and saluting the Union Jack were all duties he found "politically offensive" and in conflict with his views.

Capt. Chainnigh, reached at his office, said "I'm obviously very disappointed and frankly quite surprised as well.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=253579

Good for the judge! Is this guy still in the military??

 

[SweetNavyJustice]

I don't know if he's still in, but I hope that he will now comply with the judges order and show the respect to the Queen that is expected by all members of the Canadian Forces and demanded by his holding the Queen's commission. 

If he still has issues, which I suspect he does due to his disappointment toward the ruling, than I hope that he puts forth his release (which he should have long ago) so as to save himself from further disgrace through his hipocracy.  He should not be collecting a paycheck from an organization when he is unable to accept its very foundation. 

As a final word, the guy is an ass-hat.

 

[Teflon]

As a final word, the guy is an ass-hat.

That my friend is an unprovoked insult to both Asses and Hats!

 

[Haggis]

I don't know if he's still in,

I would say that the line from the article which reads:

Capt. Chainnigh, reached at his office, said "I'm obviously very disappointed and frankly quite surprised as well.

would imply that he is still in the CF.

 

[geo]

.... should Capt Chainnigh wish to imolate himself in protest.... I am prepared & will provide the matches.

 

[GUNS]

Can Officers be invited for a " Blanket Party". :warstory: :argument:

 

[Privateer]

Here is a link to the judgment of the Honourable Mr. Justice Barnes:

http://cas-ncr-nter03.cas-satj.gc.ca/rss/T180906Decision.pdf

Apparently the good Captain is on the teaching staff at RMC.

 

[Jager]

Can Officers be invited for a " Blanket Party". :warstory: :argument:

Sure, Why not  :

 

[MedCorps]

Yep, he is still one of Her Majesty's loyal Officers on strength at the Royal Military College of Canada.

http://www.rmc.ca/academic/physics/MacGiollaChainnigh/index_e.html

Doing fine work with symbiotic stars binary systems I am sure.

MC

 

[medicineman]

This guy used to make my skin crawl when I worked there - hopefully now he'll put his money where his mouth is and, paraphrasing Monty Python, "bravely, bugger off".

MM

 

[xFusilier]

This guy used to make my skin crawl when I worked there - hopefully now he'll put his money where his mouth is and, paraphrasing Monty Python, "bravely, bugger off"

Well if it is of any small consolation, he'll have slightly less money to bugger off with as he is stuck paying the crowns legal bills, as his case was dismissed with costs to the crown

 

[a_majoor]

If RMC is unable to do the right thing and terminate his contract (as he is seemingly unable to follow the terms and conditions of his commissioning), perhaps the students can organize to refuse to take any classes offered or taught by this "gentleman".

Maybe he will get the message then.