T-Flash or Arty Sim...

[Colin Parkinson]

Never get caught in a small concrete room approx. 10'x10'x4' with a whistling arty sim at the entrance, you will regret it. 

 

[Thompson_JM]

ouch.. that must have been quite the Bang....

heck even when im in open field if its within 20m I cover my ears if possible.... those arty-sims put out quite the racket!

 

[kkwd]

The "Grenades and Pyro" pam is located here http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/ael/pubs/300-008/b-gl-385/007/PT-001/B-GL-385-007-PT-001.pdf
All the info you would ever want to know on the subject. A good nostalgic read as well.

 

[George Wallace]

You know I'm actually curious, on the topic of T-Flashes, did anyone ever "dive" on one, either out of stupidity, reckless heroism, or other reasons? 

First off:  This is a stupid post and should never have been posted.

Why:  This is a serious matter, and that action would have killed the person who did so.  It would have been a "Darwin Awards" Article.

T-Flashes and Arty Sims can kill, especially in confined spaces, as has been mentioned before.  Read the whole thread before commenting further.

It is because of stupid questions like this that we used to do Pyro Demonstrations to all Students before ever issuing them any pyrotechnics.  When we demonstrated the effects of these items on inanimate objects like helmets and 45 gallon drums, the effects were indelibly burnt into the candidates minds.  If you are asking these questions now, then you have had poor instruction.  A sad thing to say about our Training System.

 

[GO!!!]

In response to the people here claiming that training pyro can "throw people around" with powerful explosions, I call BS.

T-flashes are noisy when used indoors, and can kick dirt and stones around, but cannot "throw someone". You can buy firecrackers louder.

Arty sims can move people - but it is usually because they are trying to get away! I've had one explode at my feet and right next to me while lying down, it burned my jacket and gave me a bit of a concussion effect, but nothing more.

 

[George Wallace]

So GO!! would you really jump on one and play the movie hero to save your friends?

 

[Kat Stevens]

A blast, any blast, contained, is a blast multiplied.  If you were to flop down on a T flash, you give the blast wave only one route of egress...through your soft tissue.

 

[GO!!!]

So GO!! would you really jump on one and play the movie hero to save your friends?

No, absolutely not. We have OCdts on OJT for those sorts of important tasks.  ;D

 

[Shamrock]

Waste of pyro when a well sharpened KFS can simulate the effects.

Fun to say before you light one at night... "Don't look into the whistle."

Right up there with, "Gotta pee?"

 

[1feral1]

WRT T-Flashes and Arty Sims. We used to do a demo with a wash basin under them, and from a distance candidates could see how dangerous these things really are. Also done was a pillow with a Arty Sim underneath. Blew the hell out of it.

My 2 cents,

Wes

 

[Michael OLeary]

In response to the people here claiming that training pyro can "throw people around" with powerful explosions, I call BS.

I believe that point was effectively put down back in April 2004 when the statement was made.

 

[George Wallace]

WRT T-Flashes and Arty Sims. We used to do a demo with a wash basin under them, and from a distance candidates could see how dangerous these things really are. Also done was a pillow with a Arty Sim underneath. Blew the hell out of it.

My 2 cents,

Wes

We used to demo the Arty Sim with a helmet from one of the students.  (Pre-Kevlar days)  It would blow the helmet a minimum of 250 m straight up in the air and in the process would invert the fiberglass liner inside out.  Of course the helmet was now N/S, often with a few tears in it.  I have seen the demo done with 45 gallon drums also.

My worse experience was when a DS threw an Arty Sim under the M113 that we were sitting in with the ramp down.  It actually lifted the M113 a few inches and deafened us all inside.

These are not toys.

 

[Trooper Hale]

Just got back from a week out field and saw a hell of a lot of Arty sims being thrown around. I was enemy force and snuck up to around 10m from the SQ courses trenches. Had the misfortune of having one of the Mcpl's throw an arty sim without knowing where i was and it landing about 3m away from my ear. Second that whistle sounded my face was flat in the dirt. Wasnt a fun experiance when it went off but then again it wasnt that bad. I had no idea they were as powerful as you folk are saying though. I would have been a bit more concerned if i did. As long as your sensible with them they seem to me to be a really good training tool to me, the privates on the course definately loved them, especially when they went off at 2 in the morning and they had to get out of bed.

 

[GAP]

especially when they went off at 2 in the morning and they had to get out of bed.

Ask them that when it's for real and they've had to get out of bed at 2am and dive for the bunker! It's good training...something we never had until the real thing happened. I didn't know whether to sh*t or bite my tail the first time it happened.  ;D

 

[Trooper Hale]

Haha, well how about this GAP. As (I think it was) Reccebydeath walked past on of the trenches a private complained to him that (paraphrasing) "When the arty sims go off we get some gravel and dirt land on us, shouldnt you throw them further away". To which reccebydeath responded "What do you think happens when a mortar lands in front of you?".

 

[Blackadder1916]

Years ago when I was a young soldier the potential for damage by pyro was well demonstrated on two occasions. 

On ex in Wainwright, the Evac Coy HQ and Amb Pl was in a hide at 0dark30.  The OC, having just returned from an O Gp, pulled into the position.  Not a sound was heard, except for the distintive low roar of a heater in a 5/4 box amb.  Quickly deciding to demonstrate the consequences of not maintaining noise discipline, he pulled the cord on an arty sim and placed it on the hood of the offending vehicle while muttering "that will show those little bastards to sleep in the back of the ambs."  Well, when the guys in the back scrambled out, they found the windshield blown out, the hood buckled and the OC wondering how he was going to explain this one.

Again in Wainwright.  At the end of WAINCON, a couple of amb dets stayed to provide support to the Royal Regiment of Wales who were using the training area. I was attached to one of their companies set up in a defensive position.  The CSM was liberally supplied with arty sims and on one occasion threw several while a group were in the open.  One landed close to a soldier who was trying to take cover on the ground.   Afterwards, he came to me complaining that he was a little dizzy and his ears were ringing.  He had no external signs of injury, but when I looked in his ears, there was a trace of blood in one of the canals and one of his eardrums had been ruptured.  Amazing what a little over-pressure will do.