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NavyGrunt
Guest
I heard the CF is playing around with different configs for port security as well......im done hijaking this thread....
The C7 Assault Rifle, M16, & AR15 family (C7A1, C7A2, C7 replacment, and C7 vs M16)
Wesley, I don't think you understand. A cross shoulder transition is a technique you use in a firefight whereby you're switching the weapon to the opposite shoulder while pieing or shooting around a corner to minimize the amount of your body that you are presenting to the enemy. There is no way in a firefight any sane individual would open up their weapon to switch about the bolt or whatnot. With the AR family you just transition to the other shoulder, do your business, and transition back, no need to fiddle with the weapon at all. While you're busy switching about the internals of your bullpup the bad guy will come up and shoot you (not to mention that while that's going on your focus is on your weapon when it should be on the fight.
Farmboy, you don't carry more ammo because you need more .223 to kill, but because military ressuply is often few and far between in wartime. Troops these days do not expend so much ammo. If any of my Yank friends did that their senior NCOs or officers would smack them. Does your civvy rifle have an MWS system, along with IR laser, tactical light, scope, etc.? You say you carry it around quite a bit. What to you constitues a bit? Have you carried it while humping a 90lbs rucksack and FFO weighing about 50-60lbs in mountanous terrain, or with little sleep the previous night? Or have you used it in a OBUA environment or during an assault? Assault rifles do the job and do the job well enough. The gains in ballistic capability brought about by battle rifles are offset by their weight, bulk, length, and weight of ammo. The designated marksman concept is being revived in some circles (and in fact is being practiced by several US units) and that in my opinion is the only place where battle rifles belong on the battlefield outside of other specialized roles.
Farmboy, you don't carry more ammo because you need more .223 to kill, but because military ressuply is often few and far between in wartime. Troops these days do not expend so much ammo. If any of my Yank friends did that their senior NCOs or officers would smack them. Does your civvy rifle have an MWS system, along with IR laser, tactical light, scope, etc.? You say you carry it around quite a bit. What to you constitues a bit? Have you carried it while humping a 90lbs rucksack and FFO weighing about 50-60lbs in mountanous terrain, or with little sleep the previous night? Or have you used it in a OBUA environment or during an assault? Assault rifles do the job and do the job well enough. The gains in ballistic capability brought about by battle rifles are offset by their weight, bulk, length, and weight of ammo. The designated marksman concept is being revived in some circles (and in fact is being practiced by several US units) and that in my opinion is the only place where battle rifles belong on the battlefield outside of other specialized roles.
. Sorry. Af for this tehnique, to the best of my knowledge is not done down here.
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I did a search for 'aussie peelback' on google, and only 2 Cdn' threads' came up. I'll speak to a few friends at 4RAR (Cdo) to see what this is called here as its 0430 here, as I cant sleep with this silly cracked rib 
I have inherited recently.
Cheers,
Wes
I have inherited recently.Cheers,
Wes
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MWS? No it does not have a laser or a light on it, although it does have a heavy base, rings and a big ass scope along with bipod and a hefty McMillan stock, it's an evil "sniper" rifle. >
Yeah, it's called moose hunting ;D only for 12 days though.
You bring up an interesting point though about the desginated marksman/ sniper. Personaly I think every unit should have a few guys who are trained snipers. For example a 7 car amoured recce troop should have a "sniper team" with at least one rifle carried with them.
Yeah, it's called moose hunting ;D only for 12 days though.
You bring up an interesting point though about the desginated marksman/ sniper. Personaly I think every unit should have a few guys who are trained snipers. For example a 7 car amoured recce troop should have a "sniper team" with at least one rifle carried with them.
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Thanks Excoelis; I was going to bring that point up, but I knew it would be better for the kid to hear it from the "horses-mouth", so to say.
For some reason, people seem to believe it is only a matter of willing it so to sum up snipers, airborne regiments, and pathfinders.
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Yes I realize how ambitious an idea it is, and how long it would take to impliment.
Just like saying money for the CF is an ambitious idea.
We can all keep our mouths shut and just go along or we can offer ideas that might make the force more effective. Yes most ideas will never see the light of day however none, will if there are no ideas.
Or maybe I'll just keep quiet and go back to playing with my GI Joes.
Just like saying money for the CF is an ambitious idea.
We can all keep our mouths shut and just go along or we can offer ideas that might make the force more effective. Yes most ideas will never see the light of day however none, will if there are no ideas.
Or maybe I'll just keep quiet and go back to playing with my GI Joes.
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Anyone heard anything about the US forces in Iraq and Afghanistan having a "designated marksmen" at the squad or platoon level? I understood they reissued M-14's for this role.
I've heard of this idea being proposed for use in Canadian Infantry units. The "Marksman" cadre would be in Pltn HQ and under the tutelage of the battalion snipers.
I've heard of this idea being proposed for use in Canadian Infantry units. The "Marksman" cadre would be in Pltn HQ and under the tutelage of the battalion snipers.
Sarcasm is a fool's wit.
Obviously, discussing this......like for the sake of argument.........the merits of designated marksmen/sharpshooters as an interim measure to your perceived endstate, would be a total waste of time.
Over and out to you, Farmboy.
Obviously, discussing this......like for the sake of argument.........the merits of designated marksmen/sharpshooters as an interim measure to your perceived endstate, would be a total waste of time.
Over and out to you, Farmboy.
Ahhhh.......Infanteer you are a breath of fresh air. You posted your latest as I was composing my last message, and was of the thought that things where going south.
Last tour in Afghanistan I did just that.
As our AO was predominantly OBUA, we had tailored our weapons systems accordingly. To compensate for the lessened long-range capability, several contingencies where put in place. One of which was to designate a marksman at platoon level and employ him in my platoon weapons det. Although not a qualified sniper(yet), he had outstanding musketry skills, in part due to his extensive rifle team experience. I even worked it out so he could have his 'tricked out' competition wpn brought along - vice the normal one on the CQs books.
Last tour in Afghanistan I did just that.
As our AO was predominantly OBUA, we had tailored our weapons systems accordingly. To compensate for the lessened long-range capability, several contingencies where put in place. One of which was to designate a marksman at platoon level and employ him in my platoon weapons det. Although not a qualified sniper(yet), he had outstanding musketry skills, in part due to his extensive rifle team experience. I even worked it out so he could have his 'tricked out' competition wpn brought along - vice the normal one on the CQs books.
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Sarcasm is used to point out how stupid an argument is that was brought up by the other.
You poo poo me and then continue conversing about a idea I brought up. :
To help your conversation along, the French do somthing like this already. :sniper:
You poo poo me and then continue conversing about a idea I brought up. :
To help your conversation along, the French do somthing like this already. :sniper:
devil39
Sr. Member
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Farmboy,
You had an idea, though perhaps not a very practical idea.
When your idea gets shot down by some people who should know the facts, take it like a man. If you wish to argue then please argue reason.
You are a civilian shooter, and a Pte (Armd) sldr, and likely good at both. I doubt you understand the complexity and the training requirements of the CF sniper (I may be wrong).
You had an idea, though perhaps not a very practical idea.
When your idea gets shot down by some people who should know the facts, take it like a man. If you wish to argue then please argue reason.
You are a civilian shooter, and a Pte (Armd) sldr, and likely good at both. I doubt you understand the complexity and the training requirements of the CF sniper (I may be wrong).
A designated marksman is not a sniper. Full stop. It would be a complete waste of a sniper's ability to put him in a DM role, and a complete waste of time and money to train DMs to a sniper standard. A DM is a soldier with excellent rifle skills given a weapon that is tailored to the DM role (i.e. the M14). As I said before the practice of using DMs has taken hold in certain US units. I know for a fact it has been used by the 82nd ABN in both Astan and Iraq, don't know about other units and I don't know how they're organized within the TO. Placing the DM in the wpns det strikes me as a good idea. That provides the platoon commander with a precision instrument to use at range compared to the machine guns. As well he could loan out the DM to a section for a patrol or specific tasking. Flexibility is key here, and I see nothing wrong with keeping a DM in the wpns det on paper as long as the plt. cmdr. understands that is not a TO cage to keep him in. I do know that the DM concept has been bandied about in the CF, but as I know nothing about that or what's been discussed about that specifically I will refrain from making any commentary on that which I know nothing about.
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As has already been pointed out it's apples and oranges, I'd suggest using a little more tact in your approach.
Better put your Field Marshal baton away and let Excoelis carry the discussion, as he is the SME here (if you haven't noticed).
If ya'll haven't figured it out yet, I'm not about to waste effort arguing with those that will digress to compensate for lack of knowledge.
Infanteer, I am not an SME of anything.
I will however answer any questions, or make an effort to get the answers to legitimate questions, should they fall within my area of expertise. I may speculate at times, and I may even be in a foul mood and entertain the trolls a little - I'm only human after all.
So, if anyone wants to have a mature and informed discussion, see ya around the board.
p.s. For those of you that are less experienced or civilians: Believe it or not I'm here FOR you. If I wanted to shoot the shit with people who understood everything I was saying, I would do that at work. As I've stated before, I'm not here to stroke my own ego, I'm here to try and make even a slight difference with the young up-and-comers and prospective recruits.
Knowlege is power - but you can't receive it if you are stuck on permanent send
Infanteer, I am not an SME of anything.
I will however answer any questions, or make an effort to get the answers to legitimate questions, should they fall within my area of expertise. I may speculate at times, and I may even be in a foul mood and entertain the trolls a little - I'm only human after all.
So, if anyone wants to have a mature and informed discussion, see ya around the board.
p.s. For those of you that are less experienced or civilians: Believe it or not I'm here FOR you. If I wanted to shoot the shit with people who understood everything I was saying, I would do that at work. As I've stated before, I'm not here to stroke my own ego, I'm here to try and make even a slight difference with the young up-and-comers and prospective recruits.
Knowlege is power - but you can't receive it if you are stuck on permanent send
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Well said and an excellent point excoelis.
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