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I have to read the actual proposed legislation and give it some thought before I comment.
The Great Gun Control Debate
- Thread starter Jarnhamar
- Start date
- Status
Jarnhamar
Army.ca Myth
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Here's my thoughts.
-Enhance background checks on those seeking to acquire firearms - by eliminating the existing provision that focuses those checks primarily on just the five years immediately preceding a licence application.
Seems good.
-Enhance the utility of those background checks and the effectiveness of the existing licensing system - by requiring that whenever a non-restricted firearm is transferred, the buyer must produce his/her firearms licence, and the vendor must verify that it is valid.
Vendors are already required to do this. Maybe they mean private sellers. I always did this anyways so no real change.
-Standardize existing best practices among commercial retailers to maintain adequate records of their inventories and sales. These records would be accessible to police officers on reasonable grounds and with judicial authorization, as appropriate.
So a long gun registry under another name.
Ensure the impartial, professional, accurate and consistent classification of firearms as either "non-restricted" "restricted" or "prohibited" - by restoring a system in which Parliament defines the classes but entrusts experts in the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) to classify firearms, without political influence.
I think this is horse shit and too easy to abuse. The RCMP will also be able to make any gun they want prohibited.
The first thing the RCMP said they will be doing is reclassifying the Swiss Arms again (and maybe CZ858?) to prohibited. Because the "experts" made a mistake when the Swiss Arms was first classified 10 or 15 years ago. And used it 0 crimes since. I hope owners can get grandfathered in to some kind of licence and not out $4000. I can also see a lot of non-restricted rifles being made restricted.
-Bolster community safety in relation to restricted and prohibited firearms (mostly handguns and assault weapons) - by requiring specific transportation authorizations to be obtained whenever restricted or prohibited guns are moved through the community, except between a residence and an approved shooting range. The rules for transporting non-restricted weapons (such as legally owned rifles and shotguns) will not change.
Retarded. Owners will need an ATT to move the restricted gun from their house to a gunsmith or post office to mail. The only thing this does is waste a firearm owners time and increase work load on the CFO answering the phone. Good job security for them I guess.
-This legislation will complement prior steps to create a more balanced and representative Canadian Firearms Advisory Committee;
Which has members that don't know a smick about firearms but are there to virtue signal
-to strengthen infrastructure and technology at the border to better interdict gun smuggling,
Great
-to withdraw from manufacturers/importers the authority to determine in certain circumstances their own firearms classification,
never heard of that before
-and support provinces, territories, municipalities, communities and law enforcement in local initiatives to combat illegal gangs and gun crime.
Great
-Enhance background checks on those seeking to acquire firearms - by eliminating the existing provision that focuses those checks primarily on just the five years immediately preceding a licence application.
Seems good.
-Enhance the utility of those background checks and the effectiveness of the existing licensing system - by requiring that whenever a non-restricted firearm is transferred, the buyer must produce his/her firearms licence, and the vendor must verify that it is valid.
Vendors are already required to do this. Maybe they mean private sellers. I always did this anyways so no real change.
-Standardize existing best practices among commercial retailers to maintain adequate records of their inventories and sales. These records would be accessible to police officers on reasonable grounds and with judicial authorization, as appropriate.
So a long gun registry under another name.
Ensure the impartial, professional, accurate and consistent classification of firearms as either "non-restricted" "restricted" or "prohibited" - by restoring a system in which Parliament defines the classes but entrusts experts in the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) to classify firearms, without political influence.
I think this is horse shit and too easy to abuse. The RCMP will also be able to make any gun they want prohibited.
The first thing the RCMP said they will be doing is reclassifying the Swiss Arms again (and maybe CZ858?) to prohibited. Because the "experts" made a mistake when the Swiss Arms was first classified 10 or 15 years ago. And used it 0 crimes since. I hope owners can get grandfathered in to some kind of licence and not out $4000. I can also see a lot of non-restricted rifles being made restricted.
-Bolster community safety in relation to restricted and prohibited firearms (mostly handguns and assault weapons) - by requiring specific transportation authorizations to be obtained whenever restricted or prohibited guns are moved through the community, except between a residence and an approved shooting range. The rules for transporting non-restricted weapons (such as legally owned rifles and shotguns) will not change.
Retarded. Owners will need an ATT to move the restricted gun from their house to a gunsmith or post office to mail. The only thing this does is waste a firearm owners time and increase work load on the CFO answering the phone. Good job security for them I guess.
-This legislation will complement prior steps to create a more balanced and representative Canadian Firearms Advisory Committee;
Which has members that don't know a smick about firearms but are there to virtue signal
-to strengthen infrastructure and technology at the border to better interdict gun smuggling,
Great
-to withdraw from manufacturers/importers the authority to determine in certain circumstances their own firearms classification,
never heard of that before
-and support provinces, territories, municipalities, communities and law enforcement in local initiatives to combat illegal gangs and gun crime.
Great
Halifax Tar
Army.ca Fixture
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Jarnhamar said:
Eaglelord17
Army.ca Veteran
- Reaction score
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Ultimately this law does nothing to really target crime and only inconveniences those who choose to legally own a firearm. I would love to see how many people who have had the 5 year background check, but might have had something in their past, who have gone out and committed a crime with a firearm (I suspect the answer is none).
The requiring you phone in to the firearms center anytime you want to sell a non-restricted is a huge pain for buying and selling non-restricted firearms. This shall do nothing to actually target criminals, as once you have bought a non-restricted firearm from a dealer I could sell it without letting the cops know anyways and they wouldn't have a clue. Its not like strawbuyers actually check for licencing. Also what type of affects shall this have on things like gunshows, as it is basically telling me my PAL card is now useless. Also for myself I tend to work from 7-5 every Monday to Friday in a area with no phones, when am I supposed to find the time to call in?
Businesses keeping their own copies really won't have much of a effect either way as currently they have still been able to track them, whether or not the vender has those records.
The RCMP deciding the classification is a no go for me, despite the fact I could have gotten a job as a classifier. They have made many poor decisions in the past, the best example I can think of being the 10/22 magazines. The CZ-858s and Swiss Arms are from a technical standpoint prohibited firearms (converted autos, and in the case of the Swiss Arms a prohibited by name firearm), however from a practical standpoint they are the same as every other semi-automatic in Canada (i.e. only fire one round when the trigger is pulled). This ultimately won't have a effect on crime in any manner.
The ATT changes again won't have a effect on criminals and will only inconvenience lawful firearms owners. If I wanted to use my handguns in a crime I wouldn't ask for a ATT.
Ultimately this law is along the lines of what I predicted the Liberals would come out with. Something small which would just annoy everyone and accomplish nothing.
The requiring you phone in to the firearms center anytime you want to sell a non-restricted is a huge pain for buying and selling non-restricted firearms. This shall do nothing to actually target criminals, as once you have bought a non-restricted firearm from a dealer I could sell it without letting the cops know anyways and they wouldn't have a clue. Its not like strawbuyers actually check for licencing. Also what type of affects shall this have on things like gunshows, as it is basically telling me my PAL card is now useless. Also for myself I tend to work from 7-5 every Monday to Friday in a area with no phones, when am I supposed to find the time to call in?
Businesses keeping their own copies really won't have much of a effect either way as currently they have still been able to track them, whether or not the vender has those records.
The RCMP deciding the classification is a no go for me, despite the fact I could have gotten a job as a classifier. They have made many poor decisions in the past, the best example I can think of being the 10/22 magazines. The CZ-858s and Swiss Arms are from a technical standpoint prohibited firearms (converted autos, and in the case of the Swiss Arms a prohibited by name firearm), however from a practical standpoint they are the same as every other semi-automatic in Canada (i.e. only fire one round when the trigger is pulled). This ultimately won't have a effect on crime in any manner.
The ATT changes again won't have a effect on criminals and will only inconvenience lawful firearms owners. If I wanted to use my handguns in a crime I wouldn't ask for a ATT.
Ultimately this law is along the lines of what I predicted the Liberals would come out with. Something small which would just annoy everyone and accomplish nothing.
Bzzliteyr
Army.ca Veteran
- Reaction score
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Here's a post from a real firearms lawyer that is frequently on Reddit:
"Okay, so I have been away most of the day, which means that my commentary on the new firearms bill is a little late. But, here goes.
Minor stuff:
* It incorporates the language used in the Criminal Code for definitions. This is sensible.
•Some grammatical changes, mostly which recognize that businesses/corporations exist.
More important stuff:
•Section 5(2) of the Firearms Act is amended to remove the "within the previous 5 years" that was previously incorporated. So instead of the CFO having to consider what happened in the previous five years, they now have to consider the issue generally. The effect of this is actually fairly minimal, because the courts had said that the CFO/etc are more than entitled to consider things outside the five year range, and the CFO/etc did consider it.
•Section 12 is amended by creating a new blanket grandfathering clause that can be done by regulation. Now, this suggests that the current government may intend to prohibit more firearms in future. However, it also suggests that they may grandfather in existing owners. This is a big warning sign for gun owners going forward, and one I haven't yet seen discussed. These firearms will also be excluded from the automatic ATT provisions. However, the new category of grandfathered firearms are not necessarily barred from being issued an ATT. This creates an uneven patchwork of laws that is exactly the opposite direction our firearms laws should be going.
•They are adding a specific grandfathering clause for the CZ 858 and the Swiss Arms rifles for owners who had one before June 30th, 2018. It's not yet June 30th... anyone feeling like giving me a present?
•Automatic ATTs for prohibited firearms are being clawed back, meaning most can't be taken to ranges. Those who have 12(6) firearms (short-barreled handguns) and who have registered as collectors will also not be issued an ATT that allows range trips for those firearms.
•Non-restricted firearms can now only be transferred if you call the CFO and get a reference number for the transfer. This is going to be a serious issue for gun shows, most of which happen on weekends, when the CFO is not open. It'll be a headache generally, because the CFOs office does not keep the hours they claim to keep (I frequently find that if I call in at 1:00 PM I may get the message that tells me that they closed at 4:00 PM and to call again the next day). This will also aggravate the issues associated with the CFO practice of placing a licence "under review", which is not permitted by the legislation, and effectively means that a person with a valid licence is nevertheless barred by CFO fiat from exercising transfers. This is a practice that I have been looking for an opportunity to challenge in court, though. Oh, and violating this is grounds for revocation of your firearms licence... though it'd also be grounds for criminal charges. The net effect of that is mostly something that interests folks like me, because it provides negotiation options.
•Businesses must now keep records of transfers for 20 years, which they provide very little details on confidentiality for. The Liberal Party has been spinning this as though the only way for the police or the CFO to get access to those records is via a warrant, and thus this is not a backdoor registry. This is either a lie or a fairly major oversight, because section 102 of the Firearms Act allows for inspection of a businesses records on fairly broad basis, including copying details. So... yeah. These records will be easily available to the CFO. Additionally, a business going under has to transfer the records to the CFO. So... not quite a registry, but definitely has some substantial monitoring.
•Major omission: Refusals to issue a reference number aren't enunciated in section 74 (referring decisions of a firearms officer to a court to have them reviewed). This means that challenges to this are going to be in a legal limbo. Arguably case law (including Runkle v. Alberta) says that this new creature will be reviewable by the section 74 process, but it would have been nice to clear up this particular disaster.
•It also revokes a ton of ATTs. So, there is going to be one hell of a backlog at the CFO's office the instant this gets proclaimed.
•Restores the prohibition on the CZ 858 and the Swiss Arms rifles.
•Allows the government to retain the long gun registry data.
•Removes the ability of the government to designate something as non-restricted by Order In Council.
Okay, so, some comments:
First, it makes sense that the same principles that allow a firearm to be designated as restricted by law or prohibited by law should allow the government to make it non-restricted. The whole "we need to take these decisions out of the hands of politicians" rhetoric is insane, because of course politicians decide the laws. The LPC just wants to ensure a 'ratchet' effect, where firearms can more to being more restricted, but cannot easily move back to being less restricted. This assumes that the government will never make an error, which is silly.
Second, there are indications in this bill of planned prohibitions to come. The people saying "Oh, they're not banning anything" are wrong, because there are clear plans laid to ban things.
Third, this legislation doesn't fix any of the legislative disaster that is our firearms laws, and generally makes things worse by making it an even more uneven patchwork of conflicting rules. I have no idea how laypeople are expected to navigate this.
Fourth, the business records provisions are not as described--because these records are not excluded from the application of s. 105, the promises that a warrant will be needed to get this information are flatly false. I leave it to the reader to decide if this creates a back door registry. If the goal is to create same, this is probably the worst of all possible worlds, as it will be highly unreliable for determining anything.
Note: This is copied from my Facebook Page, as I'm not sure about the rules about linking to such things here. I'm the author, feel free to ask me any questions."
"Okay, so I have been away most of the day, which means that my commentary on the new firearms bill is a little late. But, here goes.
Minor stuff:
* It incorporates the language used in the Criminal Code for definitions. This is sensible.
•Some grammatical changes, mostly which recognize that businesses/corporations exist.
More important stuff:
•Section 5(2) of the Firearms Act is amended to remove the "within the previous 5 years" that was previously incorporated. So instead of the CFO having to consider what happened in the previous five years, they now have to consider the issue generally. The effect of this is actually fairly minimal, because the courts had said that the CFO/etc are more than entitled to consider things outside the five year range, and the CFO/etc did consider it.
•Section 12 is amended by creating a new blanket grandfathering clause that can be done by regulation. Now, this suggests that the current government may intend to prohibit more firearms in future. However, it also suggests that they may grandfather in existing owners. This is a big warning sign for gun owners going forward, and one I haven't yet seen discussed. These firearms will also be excluded from the automatic ATT provisions. However, the new category of grandfathered firearms are not necessarily barred from being issued an ATT. This creates an uneven patchwork of laws that is exactly the opposite direction our firearms laws should be going.
•They are adding a specific grandfathering clause for the CZ 858 and the Swiss Arms rifles for owners who had one before June 30th, 2018. It's not yet June 30th... anyone feeling like giving me a present?
•Automatic ATTs for prohibited firearms are being clawed back, meaning most can't be taken to ranges. Those who have 12(6) firearms (short-barreled handguns) and who have registered as collectors will also not be issued an ATT that allows range trips for those firearms.
•Non-restricted firearms can now only be transferred if you call the CFO and get a reference number for the transfer. This is going to be a serious issue for gun shows, most of which happen on weekends, when the CFO is not open. It'll be a headache generally, because the CFOs office does not keep the hours they claim to keep (I frequently find that if I call in at 1:00 PM I may get the message that tells me that they closed at 4:00 PM and to call again the next day). This will also aggravate the issues associated with the CFO practice of placing a licence "under review", which is not permitted by the legislation, and effectively means that a person with a valid licence is nevertheless barred by CFO fiat from exercising transfers. This is a practice that I have been looking for an opportunity to challenge in court, though. Oh, and violating this is grounds for revocation of your firearms licence... though it'd also be grounds for criminal charges. The net effect of that is mostly something that interests folks like me, because it provides negotiation options.
•Businesses must now keep records of transfers for 20 years, which they provide very little details on confidentiality for. The Liberal Party has been spinning this as though the only way for the police or the CFO to get access to those records is via a warrant, and thus this is not a backdoor registry. This is either a lie or a fairly major oversight, because section 102 of the Firearms Act allows for inspection of a businesses records on fairly broad basis, including copying details. So... yeah. These records will be easily available to the CFO. Additionally, a business going under has to transfer the records to the CFO. So... not quite a registry, but definitely has some substantial monitoring.
•Major omission: Refusals to issue a reference number aren't enunciated in section 74 (referring decisions of a firearms officer to a court to have them reviewed). This means that challenges to this are going to be in a legal limbo. Arguably case law (including Runkle v. Alberta) says that this new creature will be reviewable by the section 74 process, but it would have been nice to clear up this particular disaster.
•It also revokes a ton of ATTs. So, there is going to be one hell of a backlog at the CFO's office the instant this gets proclaimed.
•Restores the prohibition on the CZ 858 and the Swiss Arms rifles.
•Allows the government to retain the long gun registry data.
•Removes the ability of the government to designate something as non-restricted by Order In Council.
Okay, so, some comments:
First, it makes sense that the same principles that allow a firearm to be designated as restricted by law or prohibited by law should allow the government to make it non-restricted. The whole "we need to take these decisions out of the hands of politicians" rhetoric is insane, because of course politicians decide the laws. The LPC just wants to ensure a 'ratchet' effect, where firearms can more to being more restricted, but cannot easily move back to being less restricted. This assumes that the government will never make an error, which is silly.
Second, there are indications in this bill of planned prohibitions to come. The people saying "Oh, they're not banning anything" are wrong, because there are clear plans laid to ban things.
Third, this legislation doesn't fix any of the legislative disaster that is our firearms laws, and generally makes things worse by making it an even more uneven patchwork of conflicting rules. I have no idea how laypeople are expected to navigate this.
Fourth, the business records provisions are not as described--because these records are not excluded from the application of s. 105, the promises that a warrant will be needed to get this information are flatly false. I leave it to the reader to decide if this creates a back door registry. If the goal is to create same, this is probably the worst of all possible worlds, as it will be highly unreliable for determining anything.
Note: This is copied from my Facebook Page, as I'm not sure about the rules about linking to such things here. I'm the author, feel free to ask me any questions."
- Reaction score
- 6,059
- Points
- 1,160
ll typed up yesterday, running the spell check and the power went out and lost it all.
Try again.
The new legislation proposes to:
Enhance background checks on those seeking to acquire firearms - by eliminating the existing provision that focuses those checks primarily on just the five years immediately preceding a licence application.
All I see here is an increase on the PAL form from 5 years to 15, 20 years? I don't have a problem with doctors determining mental status and telling the CFC, as long as they are qualified to make those decisions. Speaking of, who makes the final determination? A psychologist? A psychiatrist? Or a Corporal sitting behind the desk in Orillia? I see Charter challenges.
Enhance the utility of those background checks and the effectiveness of the existing licensing system - by requiring that whenever a non-restricted firearm is transferred, the buyer must produce his/her firearms licence, and the vendor must verify that it is valid.
This law is already on the books and followed by legal firearms owners. You want to purchase a rifle from me? Let's see your up to date PAL. This is just feel good filler for the ignorant masses. If you have to call the CFC to verify it, fine and I have. None of their business what it is or it's number. If they insist, it's an unofficial registry. Tell me if the PAL is valid. That's all. Again, something we already do. Makes the base feel like they are screwing gun owners.
Standardize existing best practices among commercial retailers to maintain adequate records of their inventories and sales. These records would be accessible to police officers on reasonable grounds and with judicial authorization, as appropriate.
Stores have always been required to see a valid PAL and to record the purchase and details in a book that is supplied to dealers. Feel good again.
Ensure the impartial, professional, accurate and consistent classification of firearms as either "non-restricted" "restricted" or "prohibited" - by restoring a system in which Parliament defines the classes but entrusts experts in the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) to classify firearms, without political influence.
This is their biggest lie on gun control. The government has abrogated it's duty to make laws, and given it to the RCMP. They now get to decide, make and enforce those laws with impunity. And Trudeau just installed his new puppet RCMP Commissioner. In the past, their firearms lab has refused to give information, prove best practice, prove their hypothesis on what part(s) of the firearm would cause the prohibition and have refused FOI requests on testing methods and standards. In short, they do what they want. The RCMP have been particularly zealous in their prosecution of law abiding owners, while never seeming to catch the bad guys. Cases have been tossed because neither the Crown or the RCMP are fully cognizant of the firearms laws. Many don't even know what the storage and transportation laws are. Not just the RCMP but city cops also. Unless they actually own guns, they are as ignorant of those laws as most Canadians. They tried to reclassify and confiscate firearms when Harper was in. They got slapped down and were rightly told that is not their responsibility by the Public Safety Minister, who dictated all decisions would go through or come from, him. The liebrals have just gone back to business as usual by supplanting our parliamentary system to suit their Laurentien Elitist attitude.
Bolster community safety in relation to restricted and prohibited firearms (mostly handguns and assault weapons) - by requiring specific transportation authorizations to be obtained whenever restricted or prohibited guns are moved through the community, except between a residence and an approved shooting range. The rules for transporting non-restricted weapons (such as legally owned rifles and shotguns) will not change.
This was the original law that the Liebrals operated under. I caused backlogs, millions of dollars in manpower, paper, time and wasted resources. You had to call then.........wait,...........wait and wait some more, if you get through. Once you do get through it's forty question time. If you were travelling, say to a competition, or a gunsmith, or to the border or any other reason you needed to take it from your residence. Once you receive your ATT, you must keep an 8.5x11 sheet of paper with your firearm and you. Strict timelines, dates and details and orders to proceed directly to and return. Stopping for more than gas or a piss will make you a criminal.
The Conservatives recognized the waste and the opportunity to harass and charge gun owners on judgement calls. The changed it. If you had a PAL for Restricted or prohibited, transportable guns your ATT became a condition of your PAL. You now could transport, under all the same rules. You just didn't need to fiddle fuck with the CFC bureaucracy and it cost taxpayers zero dollars, not the millions of the liebral plan.
Try again.
The new legislation proposes to:
Enhance background checks on those seeking to acquire firearms - by eliminating the existing provision that focuses those checks primarily on just the five years immediately preceding a licence application.
All I see here is an increase on the PAL form from 5 years to 15, 20 years? I don't have a problem with doctors determining mental status and telling the CFC, as long as they are qualified to make those decisions. Speaking of, who makes the final determination? A psychologist? A psychiatrist? Or a Corporal sitting behind the desk in Orillia? I see Charter challenges.
Enhance the utility of those background checks and the effectiveness of the existing licensing system - by requiring that whenever a non-restricted firearm is transferred, the buyer must produce his/her firearms licence, and the vendor must verify that it is valid.
This law is already on the books and followed by legal firearms owners. You want to purchase a rifle from me? Let's see your up to date PAL. This is just feel good filler for the ignorant masses. If you have to call the CFC to verify it, fine and I have. None of their business what it is or it's number. If they insist, it's an unofficial registry. Tell me if the PAL is valid. That's all. Again, something we already do. Makes the base feel like they are screwing gun owners.
Standardize existing best practices among commercial retailers to maintain adequate records of their inventories and sales. These records would be accessible to police officers on reasonable grounds and with judicial authorization, as appropriate.
Stores have always been required to see a valid PAL and to record the purchase and details in a book that is supplied to dealers. Feel good again.
Ensure the impartial, professional, accurate and consistent classification of firearms as either "non-restricted" "restricted" or "prohibited" - by restoring a system in which Parliament defines the classes but entrusts experts in the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) to classify firearms, without political influence.
This is their biggest lie on gun control. The government has abrogated it's duty to make laws, and given it to the RCMP. They now get to decide, make and enforce those laws with impunity. And Trudeau just installed his new puppet RCMP Commissioner. In the past, their firearms lab has refused to give information, prove best practice, prove their hypothesis on what part(s) of the firearm would cause the prohibition and have refused FOI requests on testing methods and standards. In short, they do what they want. The RCMP have been particularly zealous in their prosecution of law abiding owners, while never seeming to catch the bad guys. Cases have been tossed because neither the Crown or the RCMP are fully cognizant of the firearms laws. Many don't even know what the storage and transportation laws are. Not just the RCMP but city cops also. Unless they actually own guns, they are as ignorant of those laws as most Canadians. They tried to reclassify and confiscate firearms when Harper was in. They got slapped down and were rightly told that is not their responsibility by the Public Safety Minister, who dictated all decisions would go through or come from, him. The liebrals have just gone back to business as usual by supplanting our parliamentary system to suit their Laurentien Elitist attitude.
Bolster community safety in relation to restricted and prohibited firearms (mostly handguns and assault weapons) - by requiring specific transportation authorizations to be obtained whenever restricted or prohibited guns are moved through the community, except between a residence and an approved shooting range. The rules for transporting non-restricted weapons (such as legally owned rifles and shotguns) will not change.
This was the original law that the Liebrals operated under. I caused backlogs, millions of dollars in manpower, paper, time and wasted resources. You had to call then.........wait,...........wait and wait some more, if you get through. Once you do get through it's forty question time. If you were travelling, say to a competition, or a gunsmith, or to the border or any other reason you needed to take it from your residence. Once you receive your ATT, you must keep an 8.5x11 sheet of paper with your firearm and you. Strict timelines, dates and details and orders to proceed directly to and return. Stopping for more than gas or a piss will make you a criminal.
The Conservatives recognized the waste and the opportunity to harass and charge gun owners on judgement calls. The changed it. If you had a PAL for Restricted or prohibited, transportable guns your ATT became a condition of your PAL. You now could transport, under all the same rules. You just didn't need to fiddle fuck with the CFC bureaucracy and it cost taxpayers zero dollars, not the millions of the liebral plan.
Colin Parkinson
Army.ca Myth
- Reaction score
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Jarnhamar said:
Using information from the "experts" importers can determine if a firearm falls into a certain class, now they will have to submit those samples to the CFO lab for examination, a process that already takes 6 months to year at least.
Halifax Tar
Army.ca Fixture
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Federal gun control reforms don't go far enough, Quebec school shooting survivors say
Bill includes 'lots of concessions to the gun lobby,' survivor of 1989 Polytechnique massacre says
The federal government's proposed changes to tighten Canada's firearms laws don't go far enough, say Quebec advocates for stricter gun control, including survivors of the mass shootings at Dawson College and École Polytechnique.
Heidi Rathjen, a gun control activist and survivor of the 1989 Polytechnique massacre, said she felt "utter disappointment" after reviewing the proposed law, which she said offered "lots of concessions to the gun lobby."
More on link:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-gun-control-ottawa-1.4585087
Bill includes 'lots of concessions to the gun lobby,' survivor of 1989 Polytechnique massacre says
The federal government's proposed changes to tighten Canada's firearms laws don't go far enough, say Quebec advocates for stricter gun control, including survivors of the mass shootings at Dawson College and École Polytechnique.
Heidi Rathjen, a gun control activist and survivor of the 1989 Polytechnique massacre, said she felt "utter disappointment" after reviewing the proposed law, which she said offered "lots of concessions to the gun lobby."
More on link:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-gun-control-ottawa-1.4585087
- Reaction score
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- Points
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Imported firearms always have to be checked by the RCMP. It is the only way they can fully identify something and then issue it a Canadian FRT**. Obviously a break action shotgun would breeze through and likely, maybe, they 'might' let it through with little thought and just issue the FRT. Almost anything semi auto will get a good look to ensure it can't easily be modified, without tools, to fire full auto. (That is why the FN series of FALs are prohibited.)
** - http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/online_en-ligne/frt-traf-eng.htm#b
** - http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/online_en-ligne/frt-traf-eng.htm#b
- Reaction score
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Jarnhamar said:
That's what they're saying.
I gave all my non restricted to a friend. He gave me all his, that he got from someone else, but I'm going to give them all to another guy now, cause he wants to give me his too. :Tin-Foil-Hat:
Colin Parkinson
Army.ca Myth
- Reaction score
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Jarnhamar said:
and they won't tell you if the PAL is valid, till you them what you are selling.
Halifax Tar
Army.ca Fixture
- Reaction score
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Jarnhamar said:
I dont think you have to tell what guns are going where but you have to verify the PAL...
I could be wrong though.
Halifax Tar
Army.ca Fixture
- Reaction score
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Jarnhamar said:SKS's for everyone
Sadly I feel like our SKSs, and M305/M1a/M14s days as non restricted are numbered now that the RCMP can do what it wants without and oversight.
- Reaction score
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If one was looking to throw monetary support to one of the various Canadian Firearms Groups or Associations to fight Bill C-71, who would the esteemed membership of army.ca recommend and why?
Who is best positioned to influence the current Government, in a manner positive to the interests of the average gun owner?
Who is best positioned to influence the current Government, in a manner positive to the interests of the average gun owner?
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I would think the NFA would be a front runner, not overly rabid and quite level headed from the interactions I've had with them.
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