Training in Calling for Fire Support

[Haligonian]

What are some of the ways to train calling for fire?  I have heard that this is a skill that should be known at all ranks so I would like to know all the different sorts of ways to achieve this.  Thanks.

 

[Fusaki]

There's no lesson plan for this on the DIN?

Everything you need should be right there, and I'm 99% sure this is covered on a gunner's QL3.  Army.ca is a good place to get insight from guys who've actually used the drills or modified them to kill Taliban, but you shouldn't be worrying about that untill you've mastered the skill as taught by the PAM.  Learn from the ground up. Thats my .02.

And uhhh... you're not using your service number as a screen name, are you? Your SN is NOT public information.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

You mean this?

INDIRECT FIRE SUPPORT REQUEST

a. FIRE MISSION  (Warning order)
b. Target grid
c. Direction (bearing in mils)
d. Method of engagement

 

[Fusaki]

TGT description is in there too.

I remember it as 5 point's I've got to hit:

FIRE MISSION
Grid
Bearing
Description
Method of engagement

I know that as long as I get those 5 points out there the gunners will have enough to work with. If need be, they'll ask for my RNG to TGT if they want to be sure I'm not danger close. 

Corrections can be tricky. I'm not a FOO and I probably won't have mil scale binos with me and I don't know the "mils to distance" formula off the top of my head anyways.  But what I can do is wing it by imagining football fields and being bold with the corrections.

I think if you can remember the above, your average combat arms guy should be good to go.

 

[Michael OLeary]

There's plenty of open-source information on the basic call for fire - such as 061-283-6003 (SL2) - Adjust Indirect Fire

The process will be taught before you need it, and checklists should be provided to ensure you know the sequence.  To best prepare, it might be better at this point to focus on the fundamentals:

Map using
- identifying your own location
- identifying a distance location with similar accuracy (e.g., a target)

Determining Direction
- from you to a given point (e.g., a target)
- by use of a compass
- by use of the map

Judging Distance
- from your location to a distance location (e.g., a target)
- between two distant locations, roughly in line with one another  (e.g., the range between an adjusting round and the a target)

Math
- the WORM rule (which is used to calculate the correction left or right to bring the adjusting fire onto the observer-target line)

These elements are where many people first attempting to adjust fire in practice, whether on a live range or simulation, tend to fail.  The basic proforma for the call for fire isn't challenging, but the underlying skills to provide accurate data rapidly can be for some.

 

[Cleared Hot]

The Supported Arms Call For Fire has 5 Parts - but I have also included Direction because most people think it's required and most checklists include it not to mention you will probably be asked for it anyway.

Warning Order (Fire Mission)
Location of Target (Target Grid, Target Number, Reference Point, Direction and Distance from your own loc, or Direction and Distance from a known point)
Direction (either from you to target or some other "arbitrary direction)  * This is not technically required until/unless you are going to adjust the rounds, but most CPs will incorrectly ask you for it anyway.
Target Description (Target Type - what it is, Size, Activity, Degree of Protection)
Effect Desired (What you want done i.e. screen, destroy, neutralize)
Timing and Duration of Fire (eg. suppress for 10 min in 5 min or Destroy ASAP).

As has been mentioned, you will be taught this properly prior to being placed in a situation where you will need it.  Please don't rely on what you read on MILNET.CA to get you out of a tight spot on a two-way range.  That being said, when you request this you will have someone on the other end of the radio who will know what they are doing and will be able to walk you through it if you forget/lose your checklist.

-CH

 

[George Wallace]

Just go to your Unit and get the standard Voice Procedures for REPORTS and RETURNS, and you will be OK.  A copy of ACP 125 may be of some help. 

If you do that then you will be able to cover all the other IMPORTANT procedures that you and your troops will have to know; such as CONTACT REPORTS, SITREPs, LOCSTATs, ADREPs, INTREPs, VEHCASREPs, VEH RECOVERY REQUESTs, FIRE MISSIONS, etc.

 

[aesop081]

The OP is in second language training...i doubt he will need to worry about this for some time. I also doubt that his unit ( CFLS) will have that info on hand.

 

[rampage800]

If your heading overseas, your right, this is a skill your going to want to know, cold. Cleared Hot has it the AACFF down pretty good, IMO just worry about giving a Gr though for tgt loc, dir and dist will work too but for that you'll have to send your own loc first so keep that in mind. The other stuff is more relevant to trained observers and in a TIC you don't want to be guessing tgt #s. For adjusting if you get stuck just use cardinal directions and distances of where you want the round to go, ie East 200 North 50 its a little easier and most guys don't carry scribed optics on ptl anyhow and it'll save you from doing the math in your head.

All that being said, theres shortcuts to everything, your best bet is to get in the IFT,lots, and if its all going bad, speak in plain English to your FOO/FEDC/JTAC and he'll (she) will get you what you want.

 

[George Wallace]

Re: Training Calling for fires

Hope no one minds that I have changed the Title.  I don't think anyone really wants to be calling 911 or the Fire Dept here.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

FSOP/FP001

FIRE MISSION CALL FOR FIRE (FM.CFF)

FM.CFF
A. MAP DETAILS
MAP/CHART SERIES
MAP/CHART SUFFIX NO.
MAP/CHART SHEET NO.
MAP/CHART EDITION NO.
GEODETIC DATUM
B. TARGET NO.
C. NUMBER OF FIRE UNITS TO FIRE FOR EFFECT
D. TARGET LOCATION
D.1. UTM EASTING
D.2. UTM NORTHING
D.3. ALTITUDE
E. TARGET GRID ZONE
F. TARGET DESCRIPTION
F.1. TARGET TYPE
F.2. TARGET SUBTYPE
F.3. DEGREE OF PROTECTION
G. TARGET STRENGTH
H. TARGET SIZE
H.1. LENGTH
H.2. WIDTH
H.3. ATTITUDE
I. REPORT VALUE ACCURACY OF THE TARGET LOCATION
J. TRAJECTORY TYPE FROM:
HIGH-HIGH ANGLE
LOW-LOW ANGLE
K. MUNITIONS IF EFFECT
K.1. # OF VOLLEY/ROCKETS
K.2. FIRE FOR EFFECT PROJECTILE
K.3. FIRE FOR EFFECT FUZE
L. EFFECTS REQUIRED
M. METHOD OF CONTROL
M.1. METHOD
M.2. TOT OR TIME TO FIRE
N. FIRING INTERVAL
N.1. INTERVAL
N.2. DURATION
O. END OF MISSION

 

[Michael OLeary]

FSOP/FP001

FIRE MISSION CALL FOR FIRE (FM.CFF)

Way too much information for someone who is only starting to think about learning a basic call for fire.

 

[241]

Way too much information for someone who is only starting to think about learning a basic call for fire.

That is way more information then I every sent up in my 5 years in the OP as a FOO tech or sig...

 

[Nfld Sapper]

That info is straight from USOP (VOL 1) 1999-04-01

 

[rampage800]

NFLD Sapper

Although I applaud your ability to bring something like that up I think thats a little too complicated for calling in fire. I don't even think thats Canadian to be quite truthful the trained Cdn Observers is :
Obs ID
Wng Ord
Tgt Loc
Direction
Description
Traj
Type of Engagement
Ammo
Distribution of Fire
At My Comd
Method of Eng

The avg AACFF needs only a few of those (see Cleared Hots Post) and even the observers only need to give 5 of the 11 listed. Its by no means hard, it just requires some practice.

Just trying to help out and keep it simple

 

[George Wallace]

The most I have ever had to worry about is the:

WARNING ORDER:     FIRE MISSION WAIT OUT

Actual FIRE MISSION:

FIRE MISSION

GRID  123 456
DIRECTION 6400

EN PLATOON DUG IN ON FORWARD SLOPE    150 X 50

NEUTRALIZE IN 15 FOR 5.

(AT MY COMMAND)

ADJUST FIRE

CORRECTIONS:    LEFT or RIGHT; ADD or DROP (Until a bracket has been achieved and/or within 50 to 100 m.)

FIRE FOR EFFECT

END OF MISSION
TGT NEUTRALIZED etc.
GOOD SHOOTING

OUT

Nothing too hard about it.  Now if some anal Gunner asks for air temperature, wind speed or whatever at your loc and the tgt loc, just ask him/her to send up a MET Tech and you will continue.  >

 

[241]

That info is straight from USOP (VOL 1) 1999-04-01

Well as I have never even seen that book, I don't know what country it comes from, but can tell you that in the five years I was on the hill calling in fire we never sent that much info ever. Not even on the FOO Tech course did they have us send that much. That could be some info that the FSCC (Fire Suppot Coordination Center) has to log, I am not sure as I haven't ever worked in the FSCC.

 

[aesop081]

I don't know what country it comes from,

Its Canadian

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Well as I have never even seen that book, I don't know what country it comes from, but can tell you that in the five years I was on the hill calling in fire we never sent that much info ever. Not even on the FOO Tech course did they have us send that much. That could be some info that the FSCC (Fire Suppot Coordination Center) has to log, I am not sure as I haven't ever worked in the FSCC.

B-GL-334-001/FP-001 STANDING OPERATING PROCEDURES FOR LAND OPERATIONS Supersedes B-GL-332-001/FP-001 [Vol 1 and 2] dated 1999-04-01 and B-GL-333-001/FP-001 dated 1999-03-16

And from I listed is the NATO Standard as listed in 334.

 

[Haligonian]

For everyone who has given me some constructive info, thankyou.  Perhaps I should be a bit more clear however.  I am curious as to what are the methods that we use to train this skill?  We have the simulators, we have live fire ranges.  Is there any other ways?

In my trades training I was on a simulator for about 2 hours and then during attacks we called in fire missions, which of course, were notional and really just put you through the motions of calling in a fire mission over the means.