2006 Parliamentary Debate on AFG Mission

[William Webb Ellis]

Ya Hoo.........ASSHATS

 

[MarkOttawa]

For what it may be worth:

"A Close Run Thing"
http://www.damianpenny.com/archived/006521.html

Mark
Ottawa

 

[Cloud Cover]

Good one Mark!

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Gen MacKenzie's response to Jack Laytons speech about going back to typical Blue Beret missions went something like this:  The UN doesn't do any missions like that anymore because they don't work.  He then went on to say how the Sudan Gov't would dick us around and we'd be killing people over there to stop further killings and rapes.

 

[17thRecceSgt]

The vote itself I watched.  Interesting that the Liberal leadership candidates didn't all "toe the party line"....and Mr Graham said yes?  Wow.  Wasn't he the MND when previous TFs were deployed???   

I also found Maj-Gen MacKenzie's response to Jack Layton Just plain funny.  It was classic even.  Maybe, if Jack Layton watches a replay of it he will realize he is so far out of his lane he couldn't correct himself to save his life.  My advice?  Hire someone to talk to you, or to teach you about "whats going on in the world".  Must be the happy-grass he smokes.

Now maybe the House of Commons will get on with the job they are charged with on behalf of Canadians' and let our professional military leaders get on with it.

 

[a_majoor]

If you're asking me, go for it.  I can't take credit for that term.  It's pretty common around these parts. 

a_majoor, the only thing I find curious about your bang on post is the out-of-place surprised tone to it.  Surely the self serving and morally bankrupt nature of the Lieberals could not catch you off guard?

Anger makes me tone deaf  :rage:

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Graham voted FOR the mission to continue. Good for him. I guess he was looking to the leadership race - or perhaps he does have a conscience.  Apparently some other Liberals put aside partisanship for this also.  Anyone here going to give them the credit they're due for that?

 

[paracowboy]

Apparently some other Liberals put aside partisanship for this also.  Anyone here going to give them the credit they're due for that?

nope. A gang-banger doesn't jaywalk one day, he's still a criminal to me.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

One of the other Liberals who is making a run for the leadership (his name escapes me) also vote for the renewal.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

nope. A gang-banger doesn't jaywalk one day, he's still a criminal to me.

:rofl:  Bloody classic!!

 

[17thRecceSgt]

Graham voted FOR the mission to continue. Good for him. I guess he was looking to the leadership race - or perhaps he does have a conscience.  Apparently some other Liberals put aside partisanship for this also.  Anyone here going to give them the credit they're due for that?

Personally I wouldn't give any Liberal enough "credit" for a stick of Juicy-Fruit.  But that's just me.  I heard a rumour that they owe some money back into the Gun Registry, so they get no more credit in my books.  They would have to...fix the whole in the ozone layer...or make red meat cholesteral-free or something to get any credit from me. 

 

[MarkOttawa]

Quagmire: Michael Ignatieff and Scott Brison (Liberal leadership candidates) voted for the motion.

"Leadership hopefuls Joe Volpe, Maurizio Bevilacqua, Hedy Fry, Stephane Dion and Ken Dryden voted against it.

Former prime minister Paul Martin wasn't present."
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060517/nato_afghan_060518/20060518?hub=Canada

Mr Dithers indeed.  To be kind.

Mark
Ottawa

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Michael Ignatieff I believe was the one mentioned who according to the coverage I watched is a bid supporter of the stuff the CF is doing now.  Which lead to the wonderings about the Liberal Leadership race and if this will divide the party.
Its also rumored that no not because of the extension but because of how the Conservatives went about the whole thing.

 

[GAP]

It was reported on CTV last night that Michael Ignatieff and 11 of his supporters voted for the extension. He has always been for the deployment and Brison, ever the opportunist (see Atlantic support for the CF), supported it also.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060517/nato_afghan_060518

Afghan mission extension 'no surprise' to soldiers
CTV.ca News Staff

Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan have reportedly welcomed Wednesday's Commons vote to extend their mission by another two years.

Just hours after Canada suffered its first female combat death in the war-torn country, MPs voted by a narrow margin of 149-145 to extend the Canadian military mission to February 2009.

Capt. Nichola Goddard, 26, was killed during a firefight with Taliban insurgents Wednesday.


CTV's Janice Mackey Frayer, reporting from Kandahar, said although there hadn't been any official reaction to the vote, soldiers she had spoken to had shown "a degree of inevitability" about the mission being extended.

"When foreign minister Peter MacKay had his surprise visit here last week, there was talk that perhaps Canadian troops would be staying longer," Mackey Frayer told CTV's Canada AM Thursday.

"The fact that the mission is being extended comes as no surprise because very few, if anybody here, believe that the task would be done by February, 2007."

Warrant Officer Bruno Wissell likened the Afghan mission to Bosnia.

"It's going to be similar to Bosnia, where we were there for 10 years and we had people that were doing two or three tours," he told reporters from Kandahar Thursday.

"Once you get into a mission, you always want to finish what you started."

Sergeant Scott O'Neill also approved the mission's extension, calling it "a no-brainer."

He told The Canadian Press that the coalition is only starting to make headway and needs to keep at it until the job is done.

Motion

After the Conservative motion passed late Wednesday, Prime Minister Stephen Harper walked across the floor and shook hands with Liberal Opposition Leader Bill Graham, who voted in favour of the extension.

Graham was defence minister when the current Afghan mission was deployed.

"I'm obviously pleased, the vote was obviously much closer than we thought even 24 hours ago," Harper told reporters.

"Support for the mission is a lot stronger than the vote. There were a lot of people in there who just wanted to vote against the government."

Harper accused the Bloc Québécois of playing political games over the issue, and attributed his narrow victory to Conservatives and "certain Liberals who acted on principle."

While Graham voted in favour, another former Liberal defence minister, John McCallum, voted against the motion.

Leadership contender Michael Ignatieff voted for the extension, while rivals Stéphane Dion, Ken Dryden and Joe Volpe voted against.

The vote leaves the Liberal Party deeply divided over an issue that will likely dominate the coming Liberal leadership campaign.

A defiant Harper led off the debate Wednesday by declaring he would extend the mission by a year in any case, with or without the support of the House, and would be willing to call an election on the issue.

"We cannot walk away quickly," Harper told the House. "If we need further efforts or further mandate to go ahead into the future, we will go so alone and go to the Canadian people to get that mandate."

The Conservatives announced the debate and vote for a two-year extension on Monday, and MPs spent about six hours debating whether Canada's troops should come home as scheduled in February 2007, or stay until 2009.

The Bloc Québécois and New Democratic Party voted against the motion.

NDP Leader Jack Layton said the mission would see Canada straying from its traditional role as peace keeper.

Meanwhile, Graham allowed Liberal MPs a free vote and in the end Graham and 29 other Liberals supported the motion.


Graham earlier criticized the government for holding a vote without providing enough time to debate the issue. He said his party supports the troops and the mission in Afghanistan, but that MPs were voting "with a gun to our heads."

Canada has around 2,300 soldiers in Afghanistan, with most stationed at Kandahar Airfield.

The Globe and Mail reported Wednesday that the government's sudden decision to call a debate and vote was in part because NATO wants Canada to take over command of the entire Afghan mission in 2008.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

I find it interesting that CTV reported Harper shook hands with Graham, but CBC did not.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Michael Ignatieff I believe was the one mentioned who according to the coverage I watched is a bid supporter of the stuff the CF is doing now.  Which lead to the wonderings about the Liberal Leadership race and if this will divide the party.
Its also rumored that no not because of the extension but because of how the Conservatives went about the whole thing.

I wouldn't be surprised to see another Lieberal good MP/bad MP play like they did with Dithers taking over from Cretin.  That whole "he's a bad guy/ you go pound it" donkey show was just a thinly veiled stunt to capture publicity.  Look at how much press that got them, they got to make Cretin the big bad boogie man and Dithers the new golden boy who was being picked on because he was such a straight up guy.  Smart people management.  And low and behold, a Lieberal victory in the face of huge scandal in the previous federal election.
Now, you have a Lieberal leadership race (what is it up to now, 37 hopefuls?) and you see the front runners going against their party.  The poorly worded polls didn't sway Canadians feelings about the troops, and the insiders would know the real information behind the stats they skewed.  The front runners can now paint themselves as rogue upstarts, bravely foraging against the grain for the good of Queen and Country.  Contrary votes get press no matter what.  No matter what we think of them (and it is pretty piss poor) the Lieberals are good at media manipulation.  Don't be surprised when Dithers starts to be made out as a lightning rod and the front runners "just can't be silent any longer in all fairness to Canadians everywhere".  I'm calling bullshit.

 

[Hot Lips]

Well, well...I watched most of the debate off and on yesterday and of course the vote late last evening...it sickens me to think that regardless of what the others think of Harper, what the others think of the Liberal party that they were willing to vote, not on what was at hand but on the principle of how it was presented to the members of Parliament.

For the love of god, would these overgrown, overpaid individuals just suck it up and vote to support the mission already!!!!
When do they shut down the politicking and get to work...decisions at hand...that require real attention, not attention seeking behavior.
Nevertheless I was happy to see the motion passed...

I would have to concur that General Mackenzie's remarks about Jack Layton were extremely amusing and so very accurate in depicting the fact that Jack Layton doesn't have one iota of an idea what he is talking about...the statement from Gen. Mackenzie to the effect that Jack Layton needs to realize we don't do these touchy feely peacekeeping missions any more...was hilarious...and that no one is doing that kind of peace keeping (Layton's reference of peacekeeping) no one in the world...it cracked me up...he's an amazing individual in my opinion...

Well that's the end of my 2 cents

HL

 

[a_majoor]

Harper is far smarter than any of us think. This vote was a test of the waters, and soon our friend David Emmerson might find some of his old pals sitting on his side of the floor. What a test by fire, who is a party drone, and who has the potential to do the right thing (in all senses of the word)?

Technicolour dreaming? Maybe.........or maybe not 

 

[Hot Lips]

a_majoor,

I do agree that Harper is intelligent and strategic in his thinking and actions...I'm a big fan of his ballsy political style...and I agree the waters were definitely tested last night on more ways than one 

HL