Boot, General Purpose (Mk III acting/interim replacement)

[davidk]

Long before my time I think...

Is this silicone still issued anymore? And did it have any real advantages over Kiwi?

 

[OldSolduer]

I'm not sure if silicone dompund is issued any more.
The advantage of the silicone was that it made your boots water resistant, and the life of the boot was prolonged.
By using Kiwi et al, the life of the boot was reduced.
Army Vern is right. Use the issue can of paste.

 

[armyvern]

Kiwi not for MkIIIs? This is news to me...

Thread title: Boot, GP (as in the MkIII interim replacement - NOT the MkIII)

The devil is, I guess, in the details no?

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Last time I saw a tin of that stuff was around 2000 or so, I still got said tin and works great.

 

[davidk]

Yeah, I caught the title of the thread  Just responding to what OldSolduer said here

Why do so many of you insist on using good old KIWI shoe polish on boots that were not intended to be polished? KIWI is for ankle boots and low dress shoes, NOT for Mark III combat boots nor these Interim boots or WWB.
Please join the 21sy century!!

 

[Bzzliteyr]

I used the black stuff for the longest time.. didn't do much for me..

don't mistake it for the light blue silicone that comes in the same shape container.

Old solduer, the reason we use it is because it IS leather polish and as most of the boots we use are leather, it seems to make sense.  Of course, there are many people that use it because "that's what we've always done".

 

[NL_engineer]

Why do so many of you insist on using good old KIWI shoe polish on boots that were not intended to be polished? KIWI is for ankle boots and low dress shoes, NOT for Mark III combat boots nor these Interim boots or WWB.
Please join the 21sy century!!

Do you really want an answer???

 

[OldSolduer]

NL_ENGINEER
Please enlighten me. I'm a big boy, I can take it.

 

[NL_engineer]

NL_ENGINEER
Please enlighten me. I'm a big boy, I can take it.

well someone well above my pay grade decided that blacknd meant shiny  :  Then the current lever of X rank keeps enforcing it, so the people at Y, and Z rank enforce it; ending up with sayings like: "why don't they shine like Bloggons over there; quickly followed by fix it"  :. 



Thats just my 2 cents

At least I won't have to polish boots come the winter  ;D

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I can wade in, taking no sides, just offering my own experiences of Basic Training, Cornwallis, summer 1989.  Our instructors, upon being issued our kit in Thurday of Week 1, did the standard "here's how to dress/iron/polish/etc" demos.  One of our MCpl's, from the PPCLI, demo'd how to polish the combat boots with boot polish, purchased from the Canex, Kiwi brand, black.  The same polish was used to demo how to apply the base coats to our 2 x pairs of ankle boots, and oxfords.  Only later (3 years) did I discover the cans of silicon and boot blackener in the SQMS shop while poking around for Troop stores as the Echo c/s prep'ing for an ex.  From 1989 until I was issued the CWWB in 2002 and received the 'paste' that came with these boots, I polished my combat boots with purchased Kiwi polish.  This includes the pair of Matterhorns I purchased at the US Calvary shop outside Fort Knox in 1995; despite the instructions that stated to use only mink oil, my Sgt-Major said "I don't care if you wear the boots outside garrison, but they WILL be polished, or I will see issued sneakers on your paws MCpl".   

I never have seen the silicone and boot blackener used except for those of us that had a seperate pair of "field boots" that we soaked in the silicone with hopes that our feet would not be *as* wet after the first early morning defile drill as with the kiwi-polished ones....

 

[TCBF]

- I have not drawn a pair of Mk III's for four years, but does the big white paper attached to new boots say "... use only silicone T-3000 and blackener, do NOT polish..." on it?  Or words to that effect?

- At one time, before an exchange at Base Clothing, we T-3000 siliconed the Mark IIs/IIIs so it would LOOK like we never spit shone them with KiWi.

- So I, and 100,000 others, used Kiwi on the Greb/Sunbeam Mark II/III boots, and Emu paste on the CWWBs and GPCBs.

 

[medaid]

polishing any form of combat boots = dumb.

It is, and I think so, and I'm sure many of you think so as well. The idiocy that goes behind polishing your damn combat boots is mind boggling. If you want a shiny pair of boots while in garrison wear garrison boots. Oh yeah... remember those? The Corcoran Jump Boots that they decided would be really really great addition to the fold?! Let's bring THOOOSE back shall we?

If not... no polishing boots while in combat clothing. Makes no damn sense a tall.

 

[RCR Grunt]

Then are you suggesting a return to garrison dress?

We polish our boots in garrison to show that we have the initiative to carry out implied orders and that we can maintain our personal equipment with no supervision. 

Garrison life transltes into field life.  We only go to the field for a small amount of time every year.  (Not counting work up training)  A soldier who polishes his boots, gets his hair cut every pay day, and generaly has his stuff squared away in garrison translates into a squared away field soldier.  These troops that roam around the unit saying "oh, I'm a field soldier, this garrison crap ain't for me" are idiots.  Your in the field for a max 20% of the year, and garrison the rest.  Does that mean you are 80% sh*t bird?  Cutting your hair in garrison = personal hygiene in the field.  Polishing your boots in garrison = cleaning your weapon in the field.  Not looking like a bag of hammers in garrison = maintaining your personal kit in the field.  See where I'm going? 

 

[Bzzliteyr]

I just noticed a slight bit of differing here.. some people are referring to polishing (as in make shiny) and others are referring to polishing (as in blackening).

I use kiwi polish on my boots to blacken them. I find using a cheap, stiff dollarama brush makes them nice and black and leaves no residue, it can also be used before the polish to remove any dirt..

If I remember correctly, when using the black T-3000 it had a tendency to stay moist for the morning and if it would rain, it would tend to seep if not fully dried.. sometimes leaving marks on a leg if you ever took the time to cross your legs, etc...

 

[TCBF]

- Also, the tag warned that using T-3000 on the boots then going outside in cold weather would cause discomfort, as the evapouration of the T-3000 would have a cooling effect on the boots.  Worked nice in the summer, though.

 

[medaid]

Then are you suggesting a return to garrison dress?

We polish our boots in garrison to show that we have the initiative to carry out implied orders and that we can maintain our personal equipment with no supervision. 

No way. CADPAT in the garrison is just fine, along with BLACKENED not POLISHED combat boots. I'm sure a soldier can demonstrate initiative to carry out orders by merely blackening their boots and thus fulfilling their requirement in maintaining their personal kit.

 

[Armymedic]

Here you go Vern, question to you, but answerable by anyone with an educated comment:

I heard that. Young Pte at supply tried to tell me he could only size me if I wore the "sock system" black and green socks, not the Thorlos I normally wear. I politely told said Pte that I have never EVER worn the green socks and now choose to only wear the socks I have on.

Needless to say I don't think I have a pr of these new Boot GPs that fit. (I love how the quick laces touch each other above the ankle)

My boots are too loose for width, my heel travels up and down in the boot, even when I sucumbed to the system and put on the sock system of green and black socks. All the quick lacing loops touch each other right to the top of my foot. A traveling heel would make for wonderful blisters if I ever tried to march with these on.

So today I took in my boots for exchange, only to find that my size 260/94 is the narrowest width provided in these boots. The young Cpl shows me in the sizing book that they do not make any 260's any narrower. So I ask what should I do. He tells me to get a medical chit. But remembering the article below (which does not quote over), I say, Med chit? but I don't have orthotics. He says it does not matter, I need a med chit to get proper fitting boots.

Not one to argue when I am not sure, I thank him, and go on my way...To find, from the ref that I was right.

All righty, here we go:

Boots, Wet Weather:
Smallest size:  215/88
Largest size:  300/114

Boots, Interim GP:
Smallest size:  215/88
Largest size:  305/116 

Pers who do not fit into these stocked size ranges are entitled to custom footwear. They do NOT need a medical chit -- this is a sizing issue, not a medical one. The Crown is obligated to pay the expense for such instances. Entitlement is to two (2) pair of each boot type.

Once placed into custom (or LPOd from downtown footwear), the purchased/custom footwear is put onto the member's charge on their clothing docs utilizing the two below NSNs:

Wet Weather Boots:   21-921-3532 Boots, WW, S/S
Boots, Interim, GP:  20-001-9369 Boots, Interim GP S/S

From the CFSM (Canadian Forces Supply Manual) Vol 3, Ch 13, Sec G, Art 002, para 5b:
Ref: CFSM 3-13G-002.5b

Hyper link to CFSM

Also, please note that I have highlighted para 5e in red font: This para is the authority for personnel who do not wish to wear issued boots to procure and wear civilian pattern footwear using their own monies provided that those purchased boots generally resemble issued boots (ie are black/leather etc).

So if the Mk 3's fit me (wore them for yrs), how do I convince them that these don't fit properly despite the fact the sizing template says my feet should?  And that I should not need a med chit to get proper fitting boots?

 

[Ecco]

Vern provided the reference from
From the CFSM (Canadian Forces Supply Manual) Vol 3, Ch 13, Sec G, Art 002, para 5b:

b.  If after being fitted IAW Measuring and fitting of footwear (3-13G-003) an individual is found to have a foot size, which does not fall within the range of standard catalogue footwear sizes and does not require orthopaedic footwear, the individual will be provided with special size footwear. B/W/S are responsible to fund these requirements through their Command allotments. All special size boots are free issue to all Regular and Reserve force members. Supply sections shall ensure the member receives footwear that fits properly and that meets performance and quality standards equivalent to the authorized CF footwear to which the member is entitled as defined in the applicable scales of issue. Special size safety footwear must meet the safety standards of the regulation footwear. Supply sections are under no obligation to procure brand name footwear. The procedures for Special size shoes/oxfords is covered at para 7.

What more do you expect Vern to say?

You need special sizing footwear, not a medical chit.

 

[Armymedic]

Hey rookie,

an individual is found to have a foot size, which does not fall within the range of standard catalogue footwear sizes and does not require orthopaedic footwear, the individual will be provided with special size footwear.

What more do you expect Vern to say?

You need special sizing footwear, not a medical chit.

But my foot size DOES fit in the standard foot size by the sizing tool that they use to size boots. And in fact was sized two sizes wider than the ones I have now. Also if you read from the top of my post, you will see I was sized while wearing non issued (and thinner) socks.

 

[McG]

But my foot size DOES fit in the standard foot size by the sizing tool that they use to size boots.

My boots are too loose for width

Does one of the available boot sizes fit you or not?  You are telling us both answers here.  If there is no size that fits (as you initially suggested) then you are entitled to free pair special size footwear (as per ref).

Note: fitting implies how the actual boot fits your foot & not just the opinion of the measuring tool.