Second Language Training ( SLT )

[mudrecceman]

As a side note, NCMs can apply to take "part-time" SLT as part of their work day.  I know of only one myself, but I know he does go to SLT for 2 hours each day.  IIRC, he has to complete the first 5 (of 15 I think) modules before he is able to apply to take the "year long" course.  But this is part of his work day, from 1000-1200 hrs daily.

As for the discussion about why, I think George is correct in that you have to be test every 5 years to maintain your profile, and most young Officers (most) probably don't serve with a Fanco unit.  I know of a few exceptions, but they are just that, exceptions.  I believe (not sure) that most, if not all, Field grade officers (Major +) are expected to get a profile.  I know my previous CO, an Arty LCol of the Reg Frce flavour, was spending considerable time at work and on weekends working on his, as it was required for his next job/rank or something of that nature. 

If you look at it from a fiscally responsible standpoint, I think that the CF is being proactive in ensuring that the "Officers in training" pass their REQUIRED MOC training, first.  This does a few things.  1, it puts more people into the system that are employable.  We are stretched alittle thin, no?  2, it makes sure we aren't using up needed $$ on Officers that don't make it to the "qualified" level in their MOC.  Some of these trainees will VR, some will VOT or be re-assigned.  3?  It just makes sense.

I think of it as sending a Trooper on his Crew Commander course before sending them on a PCF, and that wouldn't make sense no would it?  So it seems like one other thing that is being turned in the right direction under the watchful eye of General Hillier and his senior staff. 

;D

 

[Happydiver]

Everything I could find points to no more SLT for most new Anglo officers coming off IAP/BOTP but does anyone have hard Intel/messages on whether or not SLT is being canned for new courses just starting up in St Jean?  I spoke with my recruiting center in Vancouver today and they couldn't give me an answer.

Here is the link to the 'National Defence Official Languages Program Transformation Model - 25 Oct 2006'.

http://www.forces.gc.ca/hr/dol/Engraph/TransModel_TOC_e.asp

Here is the link to the Auditor General's 1990 report on how bilingualism was going in the CF back then.

http://www.forces.gc.ca/hr/dol/docs/pdf/AnnexA_TransModel_e.pdf

The 1990 report and the new 2006 Policy make for interesting reading and reflect my personal experiences in regards to this particular piece of social engineering promulgated by the late Mr. Trudeau and successive 'politically correct' governments.  Words like flawed, failure and prohibitive cost pop up throughout the Auditor General's report.

It's also interesting to hear all the old arguments that haven't changed a bit since the mid 80's when myself and my English contemporaries were doing SLT in St Jean.  We agree with the Auditor General from back then and with the new policy being put in place now.  It's a waste of time and money mass training junior members just after Basic and before their MOC training.  Give CF members SLT training when and where they appropriately need it later on in their careers.

Personally, I'm rejoining to become a pilot not to speak another language that I have little chance of needing any time soon.  My time straight after IAP/BOTP could be put to a lot better use if I didn't have to attend a 33 week SLT course in St Jean.

 

[mudrecceman]

Everything I could find points to no more SLT for most new Anglo officers coming off IAP/BOTP but does anyone have hard Intel/messages on whether or not SLT is being canned for new courses just starting up in St Jean? 

Doesn't the first part of your sentence answer the second part?  My S/O is on SLT now, and this current group (Grads of BOTP last December) were told that they are the last IAP/BOTP course to take SLT "in mass".

Thats all I know from my end.

I suspect the folks on BOTP now will soon be asking the same questions to their CoC if they weren't already told, let me ask my S/O when she calls, as there is someone on BOTP now that was a Medical recourse from her Platoon last fall.

 

[aesop081]

As for the discussion about why, I think George is correct in that you have to be test every 5 years to maintain your profile,

Every 5 years unless your profile is EEE

 

[Patrolman]

I attended a BPSO briefing today in Gagetown and the SLT issue came up. One of the PSO's stated she had set on a selection board last week in Esquimalt for Mars officers and that SLT training for them, would only occur after they became fully qualified in their trade. She along with the other PSO's speculated that this would also become the case for other trades. The reasoning behind it was money,time and resources wasted at an early stage in a career, when there was still plenty of opportunity for someone be unsuccessful in the CF.

 

[hercboy]

Was in a briefing not too long ago and this topic came up.  We were told as of April 07 no more SLT right after BOTP, with certain exceptions such as JAG s, because of this second language will no longer be a merit board consideration, I believe it was said as of Nov 07.

 

[JesseWZ]

I just got my posting message and on it I have BOTP May 7 -June 22 Immediatly followed by SLT till Aug 10.
My trade is infantry so it appears I still do SLT immediatly followed by SLT.

 

[Quag]

because of this second language will no longer be a merit board consideration,

Can you elaborate furthur on this? Are you saying that to get promoted to Major you no longer require a profile?

 

[hercboy]

We were told no more french, and the question was asked if its not offered to everyone then how will it reflect on the merit board.  The answer was simply it will no longer be part of the merit board.  However, that specific queston about promotions was not asked so I cant answer with 100% certainty.  I will let you draw your own conclusions from this.

 

[dimsum]

Unless I'm mistaken, SLT is offered for a 7-month block...? 

Also, if it's not offered to everyone, who *is* it offered to?  I only ask this b/c for some reason I'm posted SLT in St. Jean from 23 Apr - 07 Dec.

 

[hercboy]

There is specific trades which require a profile for example JAG s, and I would think that Franco pilots still must earn the necessary profile.  However, im not sure who exactly  requires it.  I know when I did it we had a couple of lawyers and they had to get a BBB, and Franco pilots had to get a certain profile before they left the friendly confines of the mega.  As for your posting I wouldnt know, but I have heard the same as someone else had mentioned that a class that has already started would be the last ones to go through, but that is second hand so take it for whats its worth. 

 

[mudrecceman]

There is specific trades which require a profile for example JAG s, and I would think that Franco pilots still must earn the necessary profile.  However, im not sure who exactly  requires it.  I know when I did it we had a couple of lawyers and they had to get a BBB, and Franco pilots had to get a certain profile before they left the friendly confines of the mega.  As for your posting I wouldnt know, but I have heard the same as someone else had mentioned that a class that has already started would be the last ones to go through, but that is second hand so take it for whats its worth. 

That second hand info is from my S/O, who was told this, along with the others on SLTnow, in the Theater in the Mega a short while ago.

Unless you have better info...

 

[aecami]

I am curious about the likeliness of being allowed to do SLT somewhere other than St. Jean?  Has this been done?

 

[Rowshambow]

Good question aecami, I was going to ask to do it in Edmonton, as the language school there has a year long french couse.
I should elaborate, I am going officer and instead of being away from my family for longer than needed I was going to ask to do it here. I know some SSM's and other ranks that have done it in Edmonton, but it's under different circumstances.

 

[stealthylizard]

Is SLT needed for certain NCM promotions?  I had heard years ago, that for a person to be promoted past Master Corporal, bilingualism was a requirement.  I am just wanting to know if this is, at present, still the case.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

no this is not the case, there are no requirements to have a second language profile for NCM's as yet my former carreer manager (seeing as I am CEOTP'd later this week) speculated it might be coming and his gues was at the P2/Sgt level, but as far as I know it is still just a rumour.

I know Venture does a SLT block out here in Esquimalt for all NCdts (except in the case of the new breed they seem to have scrapped that until later in the carreer path) and I agree with Recce, sending an officer on SLT before he/she is moc qual and has some experience with troops is kinda like giving him a HMG before he learns the C7 just not sensible or fiscally responsible either

 

[Gunner98]

"You're wit da Van Doos now!!!
"Dis is a french only net!!!"
They said at the PRT........

Unfortunately not all of the rest of the countries in ISAF speak Quebecois French.  I am not sure the locals and the ANA are fluent either.  This will be an interesting year in A'stan!

As for NCMs and Second Language profiles - it is important at the MWO rank and critical at the CWO for Base, Bde, Wg, formation appointments.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

agreed this is not so much a federal policy issue as a leadership issue, you should be able to lead your troops no matter which language they speak, and at the base CWO/CPO level you come into contact with both often

 

[mudrecceman]

In true military fashion, the plan to delay SLT for Officers is now changed again.  :

Apparantly, the folks just finishing BOTP are all headed to the Fort and CFLS now...

On the bus, off the bus...on the bus...

FWIW, it apparantly was a political decision, vice a military one.

 

[dimsum]

Wow.  That's a lot of people to be cramming into the Fort, n'est-ce pas?  And I was there wondering if I'd be the only one doing SLT...  ;D

Well, for whoever will be there, see you on the 23rd!  I'll be the guy who doesn't really remember how to wear combats and still adds in "Sub" before "Lieutenant" every other time I say my rank. 

Cheers!