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Sniper/Long Range Rifles

yukon - exactly.

PGWDTI has a website - PGWDTI

Steve and Ross have been good enough to update their site.


They both are great guys and in shooting events across the country they are very accomodating to all (civilians and military people) and will let you shoot their wares if you ask.  They will also undertake metal work projects on behalf of units etc. to make things work...
 
Hey I was just trying to add another source for confirmation. I do know the DND site quite well btw...I've actually emailed the webmaster about a few broken links...so don't say I can't find the DND site. I never actually said it was tied to DND either...I'll admit I was wrong that it was governemt but I said nothing of DND anywhere.
 
Its nice to see a western Canadian province getting a contract as sweet as this, and as far as I know, its the first domestic small arms manufacturing for the CF outside of the traditional eastern Canadian facilities ever.

Excellent, and all the best to PGW!

Cheers,

Wes
 
so with what rifle was this done with? The farthest recorded kill?

2450 metres, thats CRAZY, that guy knew what he was doing
:salute: :cdn:
 
The 2450m kill was a round that bounced off of the engine block of the vehicle being targeted, hitting and killing the driver - just like the sniper planned ;)
 
From the guys that were there - they are in my unit - read my profile - any more questions?
 
GO!!! said:
From the guys that were there - they are in my unit - read my profile - any more questions?

Well other than your DIN account saying where you are in 3VP   ;D

You profile here is relatively vacant - and I dont have an issue with that (not that its up to me anyway).

You left out the guy had a sandbag and IIRC it was the 3rd or 4th round...
Regardless it is outstanding shooting getting harasign rounds at that range - mirage,wind, coreollis effect etc. play out there (I put CE in for those that paid attention to Dean's HTI lectures  and those who range by theodolite milling etc.)
 
For harassing fire at further than the max effective range of the wpn it was indeed excellent shooting, but according to the info I have been given, the guy witht the bag was a different tgt.

Having said that, the sniper cell has had a complete change of personnel since then, and the details of many events from that tour seem to get better with additional tellings  ;)
 
Has anybody fired the Timberwolf?  I wish the Blaser wasn't a loaner, very pricey.
 
With the Timberwolf being selected any word on what they will do with the C3A1s?
 
If they are smart, they will kept the weapon as a training tool as the ammunition isn't as expensive
 
Twolf and CoyoTi are awesome they nicely lent them out here a year or so ago...

C3A1's are getting mothballed from what I heard - parts are impossible to come by with PH gone...
 
in my opinion, the .338 is a medium to long range anti-personel (600m to 1200m), where the .50 is long range anti-material (out to 2500m =/-)

granted some trained snipers have taken out men with a .50 from 1500m+ (i.e. the MoH winning Canadians that where with the US Rangers) at those ranges it's mostly anti-material.  So hats off to those that can put one center mass at that range on something the size of a man...
see enclosed pic of shooting position #6 at 1000m..... dat be a long way. 

The .338 says super sonc out past that.  7.62x51NATO starts dropping sub-sonic at about 800-900m depending on ammo type, once the bullet starts passing back into the sub-sonic funny things happen down range.  The .338 packs a nice kick at those ranges.
Not likely the .50 will replace turn-bolts in the 7.62 to .338 range, just too heavy and too harsh on the shooter.

thomastmcc said:
hi so whats the differnence between the .338 long range rifle and the .50 cal ,i know its different ammo but whats the ranges ,power etc .

thomas
 
pappy,

I have been told that the Lapua is a more effective weapon at longer ranges due to the flatter trajectory and faster round, in comparison to the .50, which has such a high arc and neccessity to compensate, and is more susceptible to wind/atmospheric conditions/etc.

Do you consider this to be an issue?

 
GO!!! - QM and I talked about the .338 - he wished he had it in Afghan due to the reasons you gave, and the weight to carry it...

The .50 with the Mk211 Raufos round can carry a payload (HE) so you get much better HTI/ADM results.

'Some guys' where fooling with .408CheyTac rumour has it they got some pretty long kills - but they dont talk...
 
granted some trained snipers have taken out men with a .50 from 1500m+ (i.e. the MoH winning Canadians that where with the US Rangers) at those ranges it's mostly anti-material.

Medal of Honour???
 
opps typing faster then I was thinking.... or the irish whiskey sorry, not the MOH  :-[

Yeah I agree the .338 has much better down range performance then a 7.62NATO that's a given.  The biggest factor is the guy pulling the trigger, we just don't teach long range shooting skills except for the few and far between snipers.  I agree with everyone that thinks there should be a range of weapons available to trained sniper teams.  I just don't think giving up on a smaller lighter weight weapon (7.62NATO) is a smart option.  Not all battles, i.e. sniping will be done in the long ranges we're seeing in Iraq and Afgainistan.  Granted that is our current focus these days.  Each caliber choice has it's disadvantages and advantages, let's make sure we're giving the sniper comunity ALL the tools they need, not limiting them to a few big-bore choices.  Weight is becoming a large factor today.  But that being said, Body armor is becoming much more commonplace and something with a little added impact downrange is nice to have at hand. 

One, and probably not a big concern, of the .338 or any other non-military round is availability on the battle field.  It's nice to think the supply boys will keep up and always have all the ammo the Sniper teams need, but what if?  (or better said WHEN) With 7.62NATO one can rob the machine gunners (since the 7.62NATO MAG58/M240 series can't be replaced with the M249 in my opinion).  Same goes with the .50 cal family of sniper rifles.  Granted this belt-fed ammo ain't match grade, it still reaches out there further then one can swing an empty .338.

Without ammo, it's just a club. 

Bigger isn't always better, bigger rifles have bigger recoils, bigger dust signatures, and the all important weight, weight and weight.

I'm not saying the folks the guys on the pointed end of the spear are shooting at aren't good, but if we face an even more determined, beter armed, more numorous enemy with our supply lines slow or cut it will limit the snipers options.  Granted a well trained sniper with ANY weapon is a threat.  Flexibility is key.

Combined Arms should be the better choice for very long range sniping.  There is nothing better then watching 8" howitzers friing for effect.  No need to clean your weapon afterwards ethier, or giving away your position.  I had the pleasure of watching some 16" HE land on targets in Hooterville oh so many years ago, one never forgets the effects of counter-sniper ops with Naval Gunfire.  No need to find the eacact window thier shooting from, you take out the entire building. 

In my humble opinion I'd rather carry a 7.62NATO, a nice laser rangerfinder/GPS and a radio with the Arty on the other end then hump a big ass fifty.  But that me.  Hitting something with a .50 or arty, I'll take the arty anyday.  HE fuse quick will kick up body parts better then a .50 cal. 

If one is sniping at a group of vehicals at 2000-3000m away, why give them the chance to scatter on foot or in surviving vehicals when you can "scattering" the whole mess of them at once with a simple call for some arty. 

But bottom line, give the sniper comunity everything they want and all the ammo they can ever hope to shoot be it 5.56mm to 2000lbs Mk82's.


 
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