A Deeply Fractured US

[Humphrey Bogart]

Buffalo Police Officers Suspended After Shoving 75-Year-Old Protester

The protester, who was seen on video motionless on the ground and bleeding from his ear, was in serious but stable condition on Friday, a hospital spokesman said.

Full article:  https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/05/us/buffalo-police-shove-protester-unrest.html

The general consensus and I can't help but agree, is good riddance.  Assaulting a 75 year old man and then leaving him to lie there like a piece of trash, yah you don't deserve to wear a badge.  Then the only two to actually render aid were two National Guardsman.  Those men have no honour and I am utterly disgusted.

Soldiers treat wounded combatants who were just trying to kill them better.

 

[mariomike]

We need to fill an order for 500 tacos for law enforcement - Condado Tacos

https://cincinnati.com/story/news/2020/06/04/owner-condado-plans-meet-employees-thursday-after-some-staff-walked-out-over-argument-manager-over-s/3142876001/

'Nope' -  Condado Tacos employees

57 mbr's of the ERT in Buffalo have resigned from the team after the 2 officers were suspended.

Would not be surprised if their cars start following the traffic act to the l e t t e r when responding to calls. Hopefully not.

ie: No strike. But, a work to rule slowdown. Emergency services style.

Hopefully, that will not happen.

Far-Right Infiltrators and Agitators in George Floyd Protests: Indicators of White Supremacists
https://www.justsecurity.org/70497/far-right-infiltrators-and-agitators-in-george-floyd-protests-indicators-of-white-supremacists/

 

[PuckChaser]

Far-Right Infiltrators and Agitators in George Floyd Protests: Indicators of White Supremacists
https://www.justsecurity.org/70497/far-right-infiltrators-and-agitators-in-george-floyd-protests-indicators-of-white-supremacists/

Left wing website peddles unproven conspiracy theory blaming "far-right" for protest violence, colour me shocked. Meanwhile mainstream media attempts to throw gas on the fire because apparently 400 years of racial tensions in the US is suddenly Donald Trump's fault: https://twitter.com/SteveGuest/status/1267987525198585856

 

[Jarnhamar]

ST. LOUIS -- A retired police captain who died during a night of violent protests was trying to protect his friend's pawn shop, his widow said.

David Dorn's last moments were caught on video and apparently posted on Facebook Live, though the video has since been taken down. He was killed by people who had broken into Lee's Pawn & Jewelry, and his body found on the sidewalk at about 2:30 a.m. Tuesday. No arrests have been made.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/world/widow-retired-police-captain-died-protecting-friend-s-store-in-st-louis-1.4966913

 

[mariomike]

Left wing website peddles unproven conspiracy theory blaming "far-right" for protest violence, colour me shocked.

Overall, we rate Just Security Left-Center Biased based on story selection and editorial positions that moderately favor the left. We also rate them High for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/just-security/

 

[PuckChaser]

Thanks for proving that by left, I meant left of center. If I put up a right-center website touting an equally crazy theory that the Democrats are starting the riots because they want to stoke a race war in the US, I'd be tarred and feathered. I wonder how their fact check record would look after posting that article that literally has no sourcing or facts other than speculation?

Just because you can Google something to support a confirmation bias, doesn't mean its true.

 

[BeyondTheNow]

Left wing website peddles unproven conspiracy theory blaming "far-right" for protest violence, colour me shocked. Meanwhile mainstream media attempts to throw gas on the fire because apparently 400 years of racial tensions in the US is suddenly Donald Trump's fault: https://twitter.com/SteveGuest/status/1267987525198585856

I think you know what the issue is. I think all Trump supporters do. No, he didn’t cause racism in America. and certainly can’t be single-handedly blamed for its existence. But he can acknowledge, take responsibility and be partially blamed for enflaming current tensions and encouraging/magnifying the pre-existing rifts within the country. (Although everyone knows he never will)

Yes, all of these issues were already alive and well, but it’s very clear to see that tensions rise when more divisive, controversial and openly-brutish leaders are occupying the Oval Office. He has made it abundantly clear that school-yard behaviour is acceptable leadership, and has repeatedly refused to speak up against criminal instances of varying racially-charged offences which have taken place very publicly since he became president.

Sure, give him kudos for a few things that were working in his favour prior to the pandemic. But his negative influence far outweighs any positive he’s managed to accomplish...when not blatantly misrepresenting his involvement with policies he’s trying to take credit for that were put in place by previous administrations. He has endorsed cruelty and open hatred of anyone he deems inferior as an acceptable practice by someone who ought to know that ‘lead by example and people will follow’ is not simply a cliche phrase. There’s a reason western society expects its leadership to behave in a certain manner; it’s so the population doesn’t crumble into hopelessness, chaos and rebellion.

Racism existed long before Trump. And he’s enjoying fanning the flames of racial and gender divides, rather than attempting to bring the population together. We all know that when as many people as possible like their boss, his/her job is usually much, much easier. But perhaps he enjoys taking the difficult road. It would certainly appear so.

As I mentioned earlier...perhaps this is all a good thing—how his leadership has aided in disrupting the US so much. It all might bring about change.

 

[blacktriangle]

There’s a reason western society expects its leadership to behave in a certain manner; it’s so the population doesn’t crumble into hopelessness, chaos and rebellion.

Most of us live in a country where our Prime Minister was documented wearing racist blackface makeup on multiple occasions, and is literally a textbook example of white privilege. Oh, and he was subsequently re-elected. I guess we should be expecting insurrection anytime now. 

 

[BeyondTheNow]

Most of us live in a country where our Prime Minister was documented wearing racist blackface makeup on multiple occasions, and is literally a textbook example of white privilege. Oh, and he was subsequently re-elected. I guess we should be expecting insurrection anytime now.

This is not a comparative thread between Canada and the US. We’re discussing the US. The thread was already split once.

 

[blacktriangle]

This is not a comparative thread between Canada and the US. We’re discussing the US. The thread was already split once.

And you made a general statement about the expectations of "Western society" which encompasses more than just the US. But ok.

 

[Brad Sallows]

What are the things Trump has said that are inflaming racial tensions right now?  I know he has made inelegant but reasonably straightforward remarks about stopping rioting and looting.  Aside from unreasonably calling for a restoration to order, which is necessarily racist because it serves "the system", what else has he said?  Has he called for Americans to stand behind cops no matter what?  Has he called for Americans to get over their grievances and go on with things the way they are?

 

[Brad Sallows]

There is no reason white extremists can't be exploiting unrest for their own purposes.

But Antifa activists have been reliably exploiting unrest for their purposes for years.  What novel theory informs us that they have stopped and are not involved?

Simplest explanation: to the extent there is outside agitation, it is mostly Antifa activists.

 

[BeyondTheNow]

And you made a general statement about the expectations of "Western society" which encompasses more than just the US. But ok.

I’m quite certain it’s easy to differentiate the fact that the focus is solely on the US, but you chose to single-out one statement of the entire post, when the majority of “western society” as a whole can’t be spoken of in the same context of this conversation, as it doesn’t encompass the same degree of conflict, nor in the concentration that the US is experiencing atm.

But ok.

 

[PuckChaser]

Racism existed long before Trump. And he’s enjoying fanning the flames of racial and gender divides, rather than attempting to bring the population together. We all know that when as many people as possible like their boss, his/her job is usually much, much easier. But perhaps he enjoys taking the difficult road. It would certainly appear so.

I'd argue CNN and Fox News are doing more to fan the flames of racial divide currently than POTUS. His statements after Floyd's killing echoed the same call for justice and investigation that everyone's did. (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1265774767493148672) Its also particularly telling that he went right to looking for justice, seeing as how he's been traditionally very pro-police. This is a dude that will literally tell you what he thinks in 280 characters on Twitter. Unfortunately, we get force-fed opinions on what "he actually means" by pundits who have an axe to grind. Probably 95% of Americans (including the President) wanted Chauvin charged with murder. They got it.

Pretty sure these folks didn't spray paint anything on monuments or smash windows during their protests and they had a heck of a lot more to fight for than some folks do now.

 

[Remius]

And yet have things gotten better since that era where they didn’t burn and smash things?  Or when Kapernick silently knelt during the national anthem in protest and was considered an unacceptable form of protest.  Rodney king was a lifetime ago and are they better off now?

I don’t condone the destruction, but I understand the frustration when orderly protests and silent symbolic gestures gets them nowhere. 

 

[Brad Sallows]

>Look at the end of the video...the only ones to help were two Guardsmen, who as soon as they came up to him, knelt down and started to triage him.

Looks bad.  I wouldn't pass judgement based on that video, though.

The shove didn't look very forceful.  Was it reasonable?

One of the pair of police the man initially approached was approaching the injured man before he was interrupted by a third officer who subsequently spoke into his mic.  Why two Guardsmen in a sea of police?  Designated first aiders?

Would it matter if the officer who spoke into the mic intended the officers to stay in their "formation" knowing that designated help was right behind them?

More information needed.

 

[Remius]

There was an explanation to that effect.  The line is trained to keep moving and doesn’t stop.  Medics in the rear tend to the injured. 

 

[mariomike]

Medics in the rear tend to the injured.

Don't know how it works in Buffalo, but that's how they do it in Toronto.

 

[Brad Sallows]

I'm ordinarily calm to the point of indifference about these things, but not now.  A lot of rushes to judgement are being made by armchair observers, particularly media and politicians.  I doubt the politicians are extensively briefed and walked through whatever visual evidence has been collected.  I choose not to give them the benefit of the doubt for being wise and prudent; rather, I assume they are pandering to the mob.

Police can always choose to follow their orders in a way that minimizes physical and legal risk.

We are a long way from it, but an undesired outcome could emerge: the people adamant that military force is the last resort might, as a consequence of their own short-sightedness and lack of resolve while the problems are still manageable, unexpectedly be confronted with a shortage of police and nothing but the last resort.

 

[Jarnhamar]

There was an explanation to that effect.  The line is trained to keep moving and doesn’t stop.  Medics in the rear tend to the injured.

Those guys were just meandering forward.
You can see a lot in their body language.
With North America watching and everyone with a cell phone recording it doesn't take a a lot of SA for an officer to realize the benefit in taking the 75 year old man and move him to the side or move him to the rear.

It sucks for the police. They're probably short staffed exausted. Having protestors throwing stuff at you all day is going to keep them on nerves edge and make it easy to see everyone as a bad guy.

If I was organizing protests (as a shit disturber) against the police I'd try to convince every senior citizen and parent & child to frustrate the police. Those are million dollar videos.