Dog Tags

[Arctic Acorn]

I remember seeing in 'A Midnight Clear' a scene that might explain the belief about the whole tag in the mouth thing.

I won't spoil it for those who haven't seen it (great film by the way), but a section (well, half-section by then) carry their dead friend out of enemy territory back to their own lines. They take him to the Graves Registration office, where they show what Sig is talking about.

:dontpanic:

 

[dont.get.it.48]

Mate as I said, ther is nothing glorious about death or dying. Just take a moment and think what you have said. Even if I had them, out of respect for these soldiers who gave their all (and they did), I would not post them. I do remember seeing them in a book, or on a run of film if I remember correctly.

Wes

I know, I feel really bad about what I said. I really shouldn't of asked that.

 

[reccecrewman]

Just to ask a Q WRT our ID discs, they can be broken in two, but I've heard they're only to be broken if you cannot bring the deceased's body back.  i.e; you're on a patrol and come under contact and one of your guys gets killed and you can't safely extract his body, then you break his tags and bring the bottom half back with you.  Or do you break it in two regardless?

 

[Zoomie]

Good question - they never covered that in any of my training - maybe the medics get such insight?

 

[Forgotten_Hero]

From what I remember, you break the bottom part off and take it with you. You also take an 8 figure grid reference of where the body is, so that afterwards the body can be located and given a proper burial.

 

[Armymedic]

This is BS:

Post battle, when forces were collecting bodies, they would take one disc for records, and the other tag would be place in the dead's mouth, with the notch between the two front teeth - then one would kick the jaw closed, lodging the tag in the dead's mouth.  That way, the tag would not be lost, and would later be matched with the tag collected for records.

This is close:

Just to ask a Q WRT our ID discs, they can be broken in two, but I've heard they're only to be broken if you cannot bring the deceased's body back.  i.e; you're on a patrol and come under contact and one of your guys gets killed and you can't safely extract his body, then you break his tags and bring the bottom half back with you.  Or do you break it in two regardless?

This is correct but incomplete for hasty burial:

From what I remember, you break the bottom part off and take it with you. You also take an 8 figure grid reference of where the body is, so that afterwards the body can be located and given a proper burial.

The top part (with the chain) stays looped on the body. The bottom is broken off and collected by the Sgt Maj or CQ, who then passes them up the Pers logistic chain (CQ, RQ, to the Service Bn). The Adjt is also informed as to numbers and disposition.

If you are in this situation and do not know what to do, leave the dog tags alone...someone behind you will know what to do with them. If you are withdrawing, you are duty bound to withdraw with the body as to leave no one behind.

 

[Bzzliteyr]

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/026-04_e.asp

There are a couple of answers on that site. I googled for "CFAO" then used the ctrl-f function to find "discs".

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/024-05_e.asp
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/024-01_e.asp

Same thing, searched for "death".  These are available without needing to access the DIN by the way.

 

[Hoover]

I've also heard from people who put them in each of their boots as well nowadays with the threat of suicide bombers, so if your body is dismembered you can still be identified.

 

[George Wallace]

I've also heard from people who put them in each of their boots as well nowadays with the threat of suicide bombers, so if your body is dismembered you can still be identified.

Not necessarily "identified", but more like Identified and all the parts brought back together for burial.  Would you want to be buried with someone elses' parts?  Although, DNA samples would also be used, that testing is time consuming. 

 

[Armymedic]

I've also heard from people who

:threat:

Will you all sum up with the "I heard from" BS crap....info and references are above. Search or ask if you need more

Wear your damn dogtags around your neck where they should be anytime you are in uniform, so I don't have to waste time searching your broken bleeding body for the info.

 

[Hoover]

Haven't even been issued them yet!! BMQ completed and departing for SQ in 3 days..

 

[Art Johnson]

It seems to me that there is a lot of drivel going on in this thread but then I'm an old dinosaur and maybe too far out of touch. A few questions if I may.
1-Can I assume that this kicking of the jaw shut takes place a rear echelon location?

2- What do they do if the man has dentures?

3- Army Medic why would you be wasting any time with a dead soldier I'm sure your talents would be put to better use attending to a live wounded soldier.

Make a reference to the eight numbered map coordinates. What idiot dreamed that one up? Most Infantrymen when in action  haven't a clue as to what the coordinates are they talk in terms such as "we left him about a quarte of a mile up the road by that second bunch of trees". Or "he was dead and we had to leave him about 50 yards to the left of that house we were attacking". 
Having said that we always tried to bring our dead back with us but sometimes when you are loaded down with wounded you have to wait and go back under cover of darkness to recover the body.

 

[geo]

Haven't even been issued them yet!! BMQ completed and departing for SQ in 3 days..

That's unnusual - you should already have.

AJ - a lot of sub units are working with GPS now. Not perfect but 8 grid reference is not that out to lunch anymore.

 

[Armymedic]

3- Army Medic why would you be wasting any time with a dead soldier I'm sure your talents would be put to better use attending to a live wounded soldier.

Correct Art, but they are not dead until I (or an MO) say they are. Also, not everyone dies instantly. Either way the info needs to be gathered.

 

[Forgotten_Hero]

1-Can I assume that this kicking of the jaw shut takes place a rear echelon location?

2- What do they do if the man has dentures?

From what others say, it apparently doesnt happen. Why would you need to kick the jaw shut when the body is already in the rear?

3- Army Medic why would you be wasting any time with a dead soldier I'm sure your talents would be put to better use attending to a live wounded soldier.

Not to steal Armymedic's thunder or anything, but I dont think he was talking about when the soldier's dead. As he said, the medic has to go to the body and confirm that the soldier is dead. If he's alive, then its quite an inconveniance for the medic to look all over the person's body for the tags.

Make a reference to the eight numbered map coordinates. What idiot dreamed that one up? Most Infantrymen when in action  haven't a clue as to what the coordinates are they talk in terms such as "we left him about a quarte of a mile up the road by that second bunch of trees". Or "he was dead and we had to leave him about 50 yards to the left of that house we were attacking".
Having said that we always tried to bring our dead back with us but sometimes when you are loaded down with wounded you have to wait and go back under cover of darkness to recover the body.

Hey, I'm just telling you what I thought. I figure that it has to do with when you're not in the firefight anymore, but you cannot continue with the mission while carrying a body.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Make a reference to the eight numbered map coordinates. What idiot dreamed that one up? Most Infantrymen when in action  haven't a clue as to what the coordinates are they talk in terms such as "we left him about a quarte of a mile up the road by that second bunch of trees". Or "he was dead and we had to leave him about 50 yards to the left of that house we were attacking".

Hey, I'm just telling you what I thought. I figure that it has to do with when you're not in the firefight anymore, but you cannot continue with the mission while carrying a body.

Forgotten_Hero I think you should always know exactly where you are so when someone asks me for a grid reference I'll look to you and you'll have an answer for me

I've actually spoke with Vietnam vets who've did the whole put the dogtags in their boots thing and they've also said they've put dog tags in dead soldiers mouths so they don't get lost (though it's far far less common apparently- lots of hollywood)
Thing is we're not in Vietnam. Chances are if you're blown up someone's going to know who you are and that your missing.  Pretty good chance someone's going to be able to identify your body too, you're not going to be some FNG just off the plane being thrown into a company.

 

[NL_engineer]

For the dog tags in the boot: unless you are an engineer, you will probably step on a mine, making the dog tags in your boots useless (destroyed with your lower leg). I have hired that some of the older engineers had a se madet for there boot, in case there top half was blown off wile clearing mines.

 

[Forgotten_Hero]

Forgotten_Hero I think you should always know exactly where you are so when someone asks me for a grid reference I'll look to you and you'll have an answer for me

Hey now, give me a map and I'll find out where I am or where I was, but I dont consciously calculate the exact grid location we're at... I've got too much responsibility as it is being the gunner AND being a pacer

 

[1feral1]

My tag  ;D, my boot, and yes thats a brown snake, on the 10 deadliest in the world. He was sniffing around our sleeping area. Note the term 'was'.

Tags in boots is common here, as tags are plentyful from the QM. No big thing like it is back in Canada. Each main QM has its own 'addressograph' machine, so its easy as pie.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[geo]

Wes,
between the two sets of stainless and two sets of aluminium disks, I have more than enough to put tags on everything & anything.
Obtaining a new set of tags isn't all that complicated