Justin Trudeau hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Czech_pivo]

Vague commitment in response to pressure. But should be a start.....

Canada launching process to acquire up to 12 conventionally-powered submarines - Canada.ca

Canada is the country with the largest coastline in the world – an underwater surveillance capability is crucial to our security and sovereignty.

www.canada.ca

So conventional, under Arctic ice subs - what does that leave us in terms of currently available sub options?

 

[suffolkowner]

So conventional, under Arctic ice subs - what does that leave us in terms of currently available sub options?

AIP for under ice operation. Some kind of strengthening to push through the ice pack?

We did just sign a deal with Germany and Norway on defence cooperation

U212CD jumps to the front of the line?

 

[PPCLI Guy]

Vague commitment in response to pressure. But should be a start.....

Canada launching process to acquire up to 12 conventionally-powered submarines - Canada.ca

Canada is the country with the largest coastline in the world – an underwater surveillance capability is crucial to our security and sovereignty.

www.canada.ca

That is a next level cynical play.

They have no intention of honoring that commitment if they remain in office...but will probably put the project development on a starvation diet so they can continue to re-announce it a few times without actually doing anything other than read speeches. They will wring the last drop of tainted and ersatz value from this charlatans plan before throwing away the tattered remains of their dignity and honour...again

This government is beyond the pale - and the fact they are still there is an indictment of the country and both the political class and citizens / voters.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

The CAF falls for it again.

And again.

And again.

 

[MilEME09]

So conventional, under Arctic ice subs - what does that leave us in terms of currently available sub options?

Korean, Japanese, German, French, and Swedish. the RFI is going to be key, many companies are already gunning for this program, but if government says it has to be an existing design the europeans are likely out.

 

[Quirky]

We have enough sailors in the RCN to operate these subs? What about the infrastructure and housing that will be required?

 

[daftandbarmy]

We have enough sailors in the RCN to operate these subs? What about the infrastructure and housing that will be required?

Or the $100B, give or take, of petty cash ...

 

[Cloud Cover]

Agreed vague statement but there is at least one very specific element to this program that is a capability leap:

“Through the Canadian Patrol Submarine Project (CPSP), Canada will acquire a larger, modernized submarine fleet to enable the Royal Canadian Navy to covertly detect and deter maritime threats, control our maritime approaches, project power and striking capability further from our shores, and project a persistent deterrent on all three coasts..”


The bit in yellow is a capability aspiration for which we will have to rely initially upon US and UK tactical doctrine if the strike component is missiles (likely).

How would we support an SSK or 2, in that role far away from our shores. The subs will need fuel, provisions, logistics, possibly ammunition in that strike capability component of power projection.

I’m happy for this but also it’s a bit of a head scratcher. If the government is serious, there are heady years in the future of the Dolphin branch.

 

[GK .Dundas]

this is a good point. Maybe he's a "Biden" candidate.

More likely the PMO and then those Ministers in Cabinet that " matter ".

 

[brihard]

Just pulling a few threads together since they haven’t all appeared in one post-for-pondering, in light of the news of the past day or two:

• Climate change as a threat/threat multiplier
• Russia
• China
• Arctic sovereignty
• New submarines
• Northwest passage

In very few ways is our physical sovereignty actually in any danger; but our Arctic littoral waters are one. May be that in pushing for capabilities to better secure an emergent opening Arctic, we’ll also draw closer to NATO expenditure goals. Not a terrible thing in strategic terms. Russia and China as professed Arctic or near-Arctic states won’t give a damn about what profess; only what capabilities we demonstrate.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Political Theatre in the hope of deflecting wrath from the rest of our NATO partners.

"Cheque's in the mail" is getting pretty tiresome for everyone involved.

 

[PrairieFella]

Plan for 2% GDP to be released tomorrow. Fool me once...

 

[brihard]

Political Theatre in the hope of deflecting wrath from fhe redt of our NATO partners.

"Cheque's in the mail" is getting pretty tiresome for everyone involved.

They’ll have an opportunity to prove it in a budget before the election I suppose.

Realistically, the ability to meaningfully ramp up defense spending near-immediately is sorta limited.

 

[Quirky]

Plan for 2% GDP to be released tomorrow. Fool me once...

2227s for furniture are already pre-filled. Just need to put the dates in.

 

[Maxman1]

Korean, Japanese, German, French, and Swedish. the RFI is going to be key, many companies are already gunning for this program, but if government says it has to be an existing design the europeans are likely out.

The Netherlands just selected the Shortfin-Barracuda as the replacement for the Walrus class, and it's a conventional development of an existing nuclear sub. And the Type 212CD is under construction and is a development of an existing design. So the European designs aren't necessarily out of consideration just yet.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

We have enough sailors in the RCN to operate these subs? What about the infrastructure and housing that will be required?

Silence Heretic!

 

[MilEME09]

Canada launching process to acquire up to 12 conventionally-powered submarines - Canada.ca

Canada is the country with the largest coastline in the world – an underwater surveillance capability is crucial to our security and sovereignty.

www.canada.ca

This procurement will enable Canada to develop closer ties with its allies and partners and establish a strategic partnership that not only delivers the submarines themselves, but creates a durable relationship between Canada and its strategic partner(s) to support personnel training and the sharing of information.

This to me sounds like it's not going to be one our traditional sources for equipment such as Germany. My money is firmly on Korean builder Hanwha

 

[dapaterson]

The foundational issues will be getting spots on the production line, getting infrastructure in place, getting trained sailors.

 

[FJAG]

Yet if Ukraine throws in the towel simply because it is exhausted, that will all just be a sunk cost and we won't have anything ready to help in Poland and the Baltics, nor to deter anyone else who thinks that NATO or various coalitions of the willing centred on the US are temporarily weak.

By my reconning those costs have already been well spent in degrading the Russian military's stocks of equipment and ammunition. Add to that the fact that Canada's press is finally getting wise to the fact that our emperor has no clothes, is reporting it as such and demanding action

.

Vague commitment in response to pressure. But should be a start.....

Canada launching process to acquire up to 12 conventionally-powered submarines - Canada.ca

Canada is the country with the largest coastline in the world – an underwater surveillance capability is crucial to our security and sovereignty.

www.canada.ca

No its not. It's pure cynical bullshit.

 

[Good2Golf]

Canada launching process to acquire up to 12 conventionally-powered submarines - Canada.ca

Canada is the country with the largest coastline in the world – an underwater surveillance capability is crucial to our security and sovereignty.

www.canada.ca

This to me sounds like it's not going to be one our traditional sources for equipment such as Germany. My money is firmly on Korean builder Hanwha

If Wayne Eyre is appointed Ambassador to (going back to) Korea, that’ll be a pretty interesting indicator.